Beware of AOPA insurance scam

Bob Noel

Bob Noel

Touchdown! Greaser!
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Bob Noel
AOPA continues to send "bills" to owners around the time of insurance renewal, even though I don't have insurance with AOPA.

AOPA continues to live down to my expectations of them.
 
My time is worth something. Have decided to start charging companies that waste it. Recently, I got a $30 gas bill on a rental we sold 13 years ago. This was not a misplaced bill, it was an owner that moved out and the property was on our list to revert back to the tenant in he event the tenant moved out. It is called "Landlord Revert" . Like I said, we had not owned the house in 13 years. :dunno:

It took me 6 calls to the gas company and two calls to the public service commission to straighten it out. I $150 per hour so I sent them a bill for $300.

If they do not pay it I will take them to small claims court. :D
 
AOPA has also been annoying me with a mailer to "sign up for my free AD&D insurance" that apparently I get for free so their new Underwriter/Insurance company can then claim they have a business relationship with me and start calling/annoying me. LOL.
 
denverpilot said:
AOPA has also been annoying me with a mailer to "sign up for my free AD&D insurance" that apparently I get for free so their new Underwriter/Insurance company can then claim they have a business relationship with me and start calling/annoying me. LOL.
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Send them a bill!
 
denverpilot said:
AOPA has also been annoying me with a mailer to "sign up for my free AD&D insurance" that apparently I get for free so their new Underwriter/Insurance company can then claim they have a business relationship with me and start calling/annoying me. LOL.
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Oh crap, I just caved into that...how persistent are they?
 
airbornejohnny said:
Oh crap, I just caved into that...how persistent are they?
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I have had a couple of instances where this happened. One national organization I joined, and was immediately inundated with junk mail -- several pounds per week, it seemed, almost all of it askign for money for various lobbying funds, etc. Another was a lawn care company (Trugreen) who was calling at least weekly with upsells -- shrubs, trees, aerating, grub treatment, you name it.

In the first case, I was ****ed off because they could have been using the money I already gave them -- my membership -- do do better things than waste it on junk mail that went into the recycle bin usually unopened. In the second case I was just annoyed, I absolutely loathe sales calls. Period.

In both cases I explained (by phone for one, by mail for the other) that, if they did not immediately stop the sales calls/solicitation mailers, I would cancel my membership/service and never give them another penny. Ever. In both cases it worked. I have had to remind Trugreen, and if they make another sales call they're history. So far AOPA hasn't hit that level of annoyance, but I'll tell them the same thing if they do. It does seem to work.
 
DaleB said:
In both cases I explained (by phone for one, by mail for the other) that, if they did not immediately stop the sales calls/solicitation mailers, I would cancel my membership/service and never give them another penny. Ever. In both cases it worked. I have had to remind Trugreen, and if they make another sales call they're history. So far AOPA hasn't hit that level of annoyance, but I'll tell them the same thing if they do. It does seem to work.
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I'll definitely keep that in mind. Sometimes the caller ID number looks like it could be legit, so I don't ignore it and moments later am frustrated at the loss of my groove just before the phone call.
 
You can call member services and tell them to cut it out and they will. I stopped the phone calls and emails several years ago. The junk mail doesn't annoy me because anything from AOPA is trash other than the magazine.
 
Everything I get from AOPA goes in the trash. It is ALWAYS something they are trying to sell me, and I get my aircraft insurance through another source.
 
I just stuff the postage paid envelopes from AOPA full of junk mail and send them back :rofl:
 
Anthony said:
Everything I get from AOPA goes in the trash. It is ALWAYS something they are trying to sell me, and I get my aircraft insurance through another source.
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Pretty much same here - I changed my magazine subsrcription to electronic on the iPad so it makes my mail sorting that much easier.
 
DaleB said:
In the first case, I was ****ed off because they could have been using the money I already gave them -- my membership -- do do better things than waste it on junk mail that went into the recycle bin usually unopened.
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That pretty much sums up my feelings about AOPA and why I don't contribute a penny beyond my basic membership - they'll just waste it.
 
Fearless Tower said:
Pretty much same here - I changed my magazine subsrcription to electronic on the iPad so it makes my mail sorting that much easier.
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Cancel the membership and if you're like me you'll still get the magazine:rofl:

And all the junk mail:mad2:
 
Skylane81E said:
I just stuff the postage paid envelopes from AOPA full of junk mail and send them back :rofl:
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While it may make you feel better, it's not going to change their behavior. You need to TELL THEM to stop, or they'll just keep sending it.
 
Skylane81E said:
I just stuff the postage paid envelopes from AOPA full of junk mail and send them back :rofl:
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:thumbsup: I have been doing this for quite a while. I select random "winners" and stuff their envelopes with sanitized, (all ID removed) junk mail from other sources and ship it back. It's FUN, it's FREE and a small strike for the little guy.
 
DaleB said:
While it may make you feel better, it's not going to change their behavior. You need to TELL THEM to stop, or they'll just keep sending it.
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I did, but I'm not a member so they don't listen.
 
Skylane81E said:
I just stuff the postage paid envelopes from AOPA full of junk mail and send them back :rofl:
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Me too but only after I notify them that I do not want any phone calls, or solicitations of any other kind.
 
I gave up on AOPA after six years of membership. I like the hat I got from them for free once. I call it my six hundred dollar hat.

-John
 
flyingron said:
You can call member services and tell them to cut it out and they will. I stopped the phone calls and emails several years ago. The junk mail doesn't annoy me because anything from AOPA is trash other than the magazine.
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Actually I had a real letter that looked like junk mail including a "thank you for your membership" on the envelope, etc.

It was announcing the end of AOPA Legal Services and the switch to AOPA "Pilot Protection" which sounds like they're going to send me birth control or send thugs over to beat up any bad guys who mess with me. Haha.
 
Steve Foley said:
Without a signed contract, I don't see how you can win.
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My understanding is it's possible that you can win. When you sue them they need to send representation. Just the fact that they have to pay to send someone costs them money, which is more Geico's point.

But if they choose not to send anyone, the judge can rule in your favor. And then you win, and they owe you money. They may choose not to bother over a $300 claim.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
My understanding is it's possible that you can win. When you sue them they need to send representation. Just the fact that they have to pay to send someone costs them money, which is more Geico's point.

But if they choose not to send anyone, the judge can rule in your favor. And then you win, and they owe you money. They may choose not to bother over a $300 claim.
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That's pretty much a textbook definition of a frivolous lawsuit.
 
Steve Foley said:
That's pretty much a textbook definition of a frivolous lawsuit.
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Although I hate frivolous lawsuits, this is actually something that I think isn't and would, perhaps, get some of these companies to stop with their spam on the order of harassment.

At least 75% of the mail that I get is junk, most of it being from the same groups. If a $300 small claims court lawsuit would be what it took to get them to stop sending me junk, I'd be all for it. They're wasting my time and disturbing my peace.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
Although I hate frivolous lawsuits, this is actually something that I think isn't and would, perhaps, get some of these companies to stop with their spam on the order of harassment.

At least 75% of the mail that I get is junk, most of it being from the same groups. If a $300 small claims court lawsuit would be what it took to get them to stop sending me junk, I'd be all for it. They're wasting my time and disturbing my peace.
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Why do you want the post office closed down? :D

But seriously, you just discovered the modern day USPS's business model... Junk mail.
 
Steve Foley said:
Without a signed contract, I don't see how you can win.
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I do a variation of the theme.

The first time they call me, I tell whoever it is that "In the future, you're welcome to call me. Such calls will be charged to your company at a rate of $150 for each hour or potion thereof. Your company's calls will be deemed to be consent to this. For the record, I have a recording of this call as evidence." (I have a VOIP line, with Cain and Able capturing a record of each call, which are deleted nightly unless I flag them for retention...I'm in a one-party-consent-to-record state)

So, at that point, I've made an offer of a contract with them, made to an employee of the company acting as a vicarious agent thereof, and their next call is their acceptance thereof.

I may or may not win, but it's not frivolous.
 
JeffDG said:
I may or may not win, but it's not frivolous.
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I'd argue that it's not frivolous anyway. The frivolous lawsuits are the ones where people are just trying to extract absurd sums of money from corporations so that they can retire. The reasons are out there at best, and it seems are typically caused by the plaintiff's desire to consume products of the defendant.

In this case, the defendant has annoyed (harassed) the plaintiff. The plaintiff does not wish to be harassed, and the defendant has refused to cease its harassment.

If I did this to another individual, I could be brought to court and I doubt it would be called frivolous.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
I'd argue that it's not frivolous anyway. The frivolous lawsuits are the ones where people are just trying to extract absurd sums of money from corporations so that they can retire. The reasons are out there at best, and it seems are typically caused by the plaintiff's desire to consume products of the defendant.

In this case, the defendant has annoyed (harassed) the plaintiff. The plaintiff does not wish to be harassed, and the defendant has refused to cease its harassment.

If I did this to another individual, I could be brought to court and I doubt it would be called frivolous.
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It's frivolous to claim a contractual relationship (ie. billing the company for your time) in the absence of any pretense of same. You would be on better legal ground to argue a tort, something like a nuisance, but then you need to show actual damages, and unless you can show that you had to set aside billing someone $150/hr, you're not going to collect that in a tort action.
 
bartmc said:
Why do you want the post office closed down? :D

But seriously, you just discovered the modern day USPS's business model... Junk mail.
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No, USPS is run by shrewd business people who have extensively studied a new alternative form of economics.

Under standard economics, if your business volume drops, you will reduce your prices in order to attract new business. However, USPS is smarter than the average economist. When they see a fall off in volume, they raise their prices to compensate. This makes sure that the reduced volume will still bring in the same amount of revenue. This way, they have no need to reduce expenses in reaction to decreased volume. The great thing is, if the increased prices cause even more reduction in volume, they have a ready-made solution: raise their prices even more! It's a never-lose strategy!
 
JeffDG said:
No, USPS is run by shrewd business people who have extensively studied a new alternative form of economics.

Under standard economics, if your business volume drops, you will reduce your prices in order to attract new business. However, USPS is smarter than the average economist. When they see a fall off in volume, they raise their prices to compensate. This makes sure that the reduced volume will still bring in the same amount of revenue. This way, they have no need to reduce expenses in reaction to decreased volume. The great thing is, if the increased prices cause even more reduction in volume, they have a ready-made solution: raise their prices even more! It's a never-lose strategy!
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Of course. The PURPOSE of USPS and any quasi-government or government agency is to keep its UNION WORKERS employed, and/or increase their payroll. Not make money, nor provide good service.

No profit motive, no expense cuts, nor customer service mentality.
 
Hopefully they raise prices enough so it is no longer profitable to send junk mail.
 
DaleB said:
...In the first case, I was ****ed off because they could have been using the money I already gave them -- my membership -- do do better things than waste it on junk mail that went into the recycle bin usually unopened. In the second case I was just annoyed, I absolutely loathe sales calls. Period.

In both cases I explained (by phone for one, by mail for the other) that, if they did not immediately stop the sales calls/solicitation mailers, I would cancel my membership/service and never give them another penny. Ever. In both cases it worked.
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You have it backwards. Your AOPA membership is a loss. It doesn't cover the cost of mailing the magazine or handling your check.

What brings in the revenue is the extra stuff like legal coverage, the affiliate products and the ads in AOPA Pilot. Example: You can be sure that AOPA gets a buck or two when you use the car rental discount.

So they aren't wasting money mailing you to buy insurance. That is making them money. It's the insurance company paying for the mailing.

Consider how much the mailing list of "rich pilots" is worth.
 
mikea said:
You have it backwards. Your AOPA membership is a loss. It doesn't cover the cost of mailing the magazine or handling your check.
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Not my fault == not my problem.
mikea said:
Consider how much the mailing list of "rich pilots" is worth.
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Probably quite a bit. And as yet the volume of junk mail from AOPA and its affiliates has not gotten even to the minor annoyance stage, so it's not a big deal. What I griped about earlier was a different organization, constantly soliciting for their lobbying efforts. In that case, no -- they can use the membership dues. If they're losing money on the monthly print magazine (which I don't believe for one millisecond -- I know what magazine ads cost) it's their own fault for not making an option available to get it in an electronic format.

But again -- that's not AOPA. I get very little in the way of unwanted junk mail from them. I'm sure that will change eventually.
 
DaleB said:
And as yet the volume of junk mail from AOPA and its affiliates has not gotten even to the minor annoyance stage, so it's not a big deal.
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For me, the major junk mail annoyance is not AOPA, but store coupon flyers. I can't figure out how to stop them, either.
 
Geico266 said:
My time is worth something. Have decided to start charging companies that waste it. Recently, I got a $30 gas bill on a rental we sold 13 years ago. This was not a misplaced bill, it was an owner that moved out and the property was on our list to revert back to the tenant in he event the tenant moved out. It is called "Landlord Revert" . Like I said, we had not owned the house in 13 years. :dunno:

It took me 6 calls to the gas company and two calls to the public service commission to straighten it out. I $150 per hour so I sent them a bill for $300.

If they do not pay it I will take them to small claims court. :D
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Haha. Let us know how it turns out. Black Hills isn't the sharpest tack in the board.
I think you have more than just your time ... they can't just bill someone for something they don't owe. That's fraud.
 
My local cable / Internet company called for an up sell to add their VoIP phone service.
I must get two mailings a week pushing this service.

I asked the caller, politely, if she knew what time it was. She was not in my time zone.

I told her, it's 9pm, please take me off the calling list.
I have not received another call.
 
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