Another stupid question - Home improvement

Everskyward

Everskyward

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Everskyward
I THINK I know the answer to this but would like to see what the people here say.

If I want to get both new windows and new siding, which should come first? How about new windows vs. painting the existing siding?

I've gotten answers from the internet and the window installer but they may have bias.

Be kind. I don't know all that much about construction either. :redface:
 
Since coordinating the installs is next to impossible, unless one contractor does both jobs, I would do the windows last. But really though it doesn't make much difference unless you have some unusual circumstances.
 
JOhnH said:
Since coordinating the installs is next to impossible, unless one contractor does both jobs, I would do the windows last. But really though it doesn't make much difference unless you have some unusual circumstances.
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Can you give a reason for that? I don't think I have any unusual circumstances.
 
Depends on the current windows and siding.

Sometimes windows can be replaced from the inside, so you just need to replace and repaint the interior trim. This method doesn't require the new siding right away, allowing you to do this in stages.

Otherwise, if you are having the siding replaced (and not just new vinyl siding tacked onto existing siding), you can have the windows replaced from the outside and have the new siding installed over them.

I think the exterior installation method for windows does a couple things - I think they are better weatherproofed because of the way you can install flashing and waterproof membranes, and it also opens up the window framing so you can inspect for any existing water damage and get it repaired before you cover it back up.

But - not knowing your situation, just get a couple of quotes from both siding and window contractors. You can also check with a general contractor and get some advice.
 
What kind of siding do you have now, and what will you be replacing it with?
 
Everskyward said:
Can you give a reason for that? I don't think I have any unusual circumstances.
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On an iPhone on a bicycle at the gym so be tolerant of my typing.

Both types of jobs are very standardized and retrofits are common so it doesn't make much diff. The techniques for both work well. But there is a greater chance of overspray or damage to the windows if they go in first.
A more important decision is WHO to hire. Make sure they have a lot of experience with the product. Make sure they are licensed and adequately insured and check references and Never never never make the final payment until you are satisfied with the job. Put that in writing on the contrac because it won't be there and they won't like it.
 
Matthew said:
What kind of siding do you have now, and what will you be replacing it with?
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I have cedar siding now, and am considering replacing it with concrete woodpecker-resistant stuff. I'm pretty sure the existing siding needs to come off. It's 20-years old and is painted. If not new siding, it needs repair where the woodpeckers have drilled, and I'm afraid they will just drill anew which is what happened when I had just the holes patched. None of the holes affect the windows, however.

I'm not fussy about how it looks temporarily as long as it is weathertight. I had my roof and gutters replaced a year or two ago and they don't really match the rest of the house right now.

My house is a ranch with walkout, somewhat L-shaped with a 2-car attached garage. It's about 1,350 square feet living area, not counting the finished basement.
 
It sounds like cedar lap siding? So that'll all be popped off, exposing either OSB or a sheet of insulation board on top of OSB. New-construction windows often have attached flashing and other weatherproofing membranes that get covered up by that insulation and siding.

With 'replacement windows', the old windows have to be cut out, and the replacement windows use other tricks to weatherseal them. It's not rocket science, and it's done all the time. But my preference would be to go with the new-construction windows so you can seal them before the siding goes on. The does require both to be done at the same time.

The new-construction or replacement-style are really up to you though. Most name brands make both.

My folks in Colorado have the same woodpecker problem with their cedar siding. And, as you probably know, you're not allowed to bother them because they are a protected species...stupid woodpeckers.
 
Windows first.....Then you side up to the new trim around the windows...

Standard procedure.....:yes:
 
Here are some pictures I just took. You can see how the holes have been patched and they just drill next to the patch. I gave up a few years ago and let them live with me. I hate to see what is between the sheathing and the drywall! There is no hole to the inside. You can also see where the gutters have been replaced and only part of the green trim color shows. Just as well. I used to call it my "pumpkin house". My fault completely. I picked the colors from a chip, went out of town, and when I came back I couldn't deny I picked the colors since they were the same ones I chose. They just looked different on a small chip. I have lived with it for about 8 years. :rofl:

IMG_0324


IMG_0323
 
Windows first.

Having to screw around with the siding after it is up is not easy, and will require some of the concrete siding to be broken. :eek:

Leave the old siding on. No need to take it off.

Concrete siding is a great choice. :yes:
 
Geico266 said:
Windows first.

Having to screw around with the siding after it is up is not easy, and will require some of the concrete siding to be broken. :eek:

Leave the old siding on. No need to take it off.

Concrete siding is a great choice. :yes:
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When you say "leave the old siding on" do you mean I should put the concrete siding on top of the cedar? Or do you mean leave it on around the windows while they install the windows and get the concrete siding later?
 
I replaced windows first then siding. It worked out well. We pulled off the old siding because it was warped and that was the only reason.

Your siding is in good shape so no need to remove (unless there are bad areas not shown in your pictures). As long as the old siding is flat it is no problem to cover.
 
Clark1961 said:
I replaced windows first then siding. It worked out well. We pulled off the old siding because it was warped and that was the only reason.

Your siding is in good shape so no need to remove (unless there are bad areas not shown in your pictures). As long as the old siding is flat it is no problem to cover.
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I would say the only thing "bad" is that there are other holes. This is a woodpecker condo. I don't think it is warped.

Oh, and I meant fiber-cement siding, not concrete. I never have figured out the difference between concrete and cement.
 
Everskyward said:
I never have figured out the difference between concrete and cement.
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Cement is a small town in Oklahoma, concrete is the rock that is poured in place then gets hard.




no need to thank me, happy to help...
 
Clark1961 said:
Cement is a small town in Oklahoma, concrete is the rock that is poured in place then gets hard.




no need to thank me, happy to help...
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Concretes are those frozen desserts I love. I want one now!

I had never heard of a concrete until I moved to Missouri. I think they have them in Colorado too but not here.
 
Everskyward said:
When you say "leave the old siding on" do you mean I should put the concrete siding on top of the cedar? Or do you mean leave it on around the windows while they install the windows and get the concrete siding later?
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Leave all of it in place. The new siding guys will deal with any irregularities.
 
You can put the siding on top of the old stuff. Personally I would at least pull it off were the woodpeckers are/were and clean out the mess.

If it was me I would pull off the siding replace the windows with new construction ones and put new siding on. This is not need just what I would do.
 
Everskyward said:
Concretes are those frozen desserts I love. I want one now!
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Durn good day for frozen dessert. I've been in the desert for three days so it's way past time for dessert.
 
Everskyward said:
When you say "leave the old siding on" do you mean I should put the concrete siding on top of the cedar? Or do you mean leave it on around the windows while they install the windows and get the concrete siding later?
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The way that would be done is he contractor would take a worm- drive saw and cut 2" channels vertically in the existing cedar to the dpth of the sheathing every 32" on center. Then he would lay 2" vertical nailers in the channel and screw them to the structure. This would provide a secure, flush surface to nail the new siding to. Then he would fir out and wrap your existing window and door casings, and corner beads.

Removing all that old siding would be an expensive waste of time.
 
Clark1961 said:
Durn good day for frozen dessert. I've been in the desert for three days so it's way past time for dessert.
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My home does not have air conditioning so it's been warm and getting warmer, before it cools off...
 
Matthew said:
My folks in Colorado have the same woodpecker problem with their cedar siding. And, as you probably know, you're not allowed to bother them because they are a protected species...stupid woodpeckers.
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I know some folks who um, bothered, them until they were dead. No more holes in their stucco. ;)
 
With the extra information, and pics, I agree that the windows should be first.

And cement is the powdery substance that is mixed with sand, water and possibly gravel to make concrete.
 
JOhnH said:
With the extra information, and pics, I agree that the windows should be first.

And cement is the powdery substance that is mixed with sand, water and possibly gravel to make concrete.
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I'm glad there is a consensus. And it's what I guessed too! :)
 
You could just replace the boards with holes, and repaint the siding. You could repaint it yourself in a few days (but wash it first with tsp or something like that).

Our house has 20-year old cedar siding, and we repainted it in about two days. We got an estimate to repaint it for something like $7,000, but we bought paint for $200 and did it ourselves.
 
bluee said:
You could just replace the boards with holes, and repaint the siding. You could repaint it yourself in a few days (but wash it first with tsp or something like that).

Our house has 20-year old cedar siding, and we repainted it in about two days. We got an estimate to repaint it for something like $7,000, but we bought paint for $200 and did it ourselves.
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After taking 15 years to finish the basement; working on it for 5, letting it sit for 10, and having a professional finish in a couple months; I don't do things like that any more. Besides, the worst damage is on the highest corner and there is the slope to the walkout. I appreciate the suggestion, however.
 
Everskyward said:
After taking 15 years to finish the basement; working on it for 5, letting it sit for 10, and having a professional finish in a couple months; I don't do things like that any more. Besides, the worst damage is on the highest corner and there is the slope to the walkout. I appreciate the suggestion, however.
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That's me these days!
 
bluee said:
You could just replace the boards with holes, and repaint the siding. You could repaint it yourself in a few days (but wash it first with tsp or something like that).

Our house has 20-year old cedar siding, and we repainted it in about two days. We got an estimate to repaint it for something like $7,000, but we bought paint for $200 and did it ourselves.
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Whether you do it yourself or not, just fixing your existing siding would be my suggestion also. Especially if you don't have too many areas like this one. ( and I'm a "30 year in the business" construction/property mgmt guy).

Typically, if you don't have bugs then you won't have woodpecker issues...because that's what they're after. So, call the exterminator, replace the windows, repair the siding and replace the trim, repaint and go on with life.

Then call the exterminator again the first time you suspect That woodpeckers are falling in love with your house again.

But the ultimate question..Are you sure it's cedar siding?

You should ask the woodpecker if your house is...

...a son of a beech or a son of a birch? :wink2:
 
bluee said:
You could just replace the boards with holes
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I'm still trying to figure out how to get holes to replace boards...can you even buy holes anymore? I used to get holes at the donut shop but haven't been there in a long time. I asked about bagel holes but the folks at the bakery just laughed.
 
Clark1961 said:
I'm still trying to figure out how to get holes to replace boards...can you even buy holes anymore? I used to get holes at the donut shop but haven't been there in a long time. I asked about bagel holes but the folks at the bakery just laughed.
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looks like the Woody Woodpeckers have already replaced the boards with holes. Next task is to replace the holes with boards again.
 
I have a house at 8000' which looks similar. I had a woodpecker problem one spring. I use the Ithaca method to solve that. It's kind of sad, because the woodland woodpecker is an excellent hunter of mountain pine beetle which is ravaging our forest lands.

Anyway, I agree with the others. Get it fumed then fix up the boards with repairs, paint it to match and call it a day. I know that advising you to get a 20Ga shotgun is worthless, so you'll have to do this again in a few years maybe if the bugs aren't gone.
 
When we lived in CT we had a prob with woodpeckers chewing up the cedar on the NW side of the house - so I brought an exterminator out who discovered a few bad places that had dry rot and termites . . . the woodpeckers are looking for food. They eat insects. If they are pecking your house, your house has insects. Deal with the insects and birds go away . .. .
 
To answer some of your questions...

I'm sure it's cedar, I am the original owner and had piles of scrap siding to burn in my fireplace.

I originally thought about replacing just some boards and still may do that depending on the estimate for residing the whole house. The problem is that I have had boards replaced in the past and they came back to some other boards. :mad2:

Shooting them or at them is out for me. No shooting allowed in the subdivision, at least not with real firearms. I am too slow with a pellet gun and don't want to shoot out my new windows. Besides, I have developed a live-and-let-live attitude with the animals around here. I used to try to smoke out the ground squirrels in my septic field, etc, but they just came back. Now they are gone for whatever reason. Even when they dig under my slabs I let them. If I feel energetic I fill the holes but mostly I just let them live there.
 
Shooting at varmints, rodents and the like is encouraged in my area. Usually the coyotes and hawks keep things in check but once in a while the hand of man needs to do the job.
 
docmirror said:
Shooting at varmints, rodents and the like is encouraged in my area. Usually the coyotes and hawks keep things in check but once in a while the hand of man needs to do the job.
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I'm glad we are not allowed to shoot in my subdivision. The lots are only 2-3 acres and there are plenty of people who would try.
 
That's what I'm on. I can control my shots to not endanger others. I'm just not in a covenant controlled area.
 
docmirror said:
That's what I'm on. I can control my shots to not endanger others. I'm just not in a covenant controlled area.
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It appears you understand the TRUE meaning of GUN CONTROL. :yes:
 
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