Another example of pilots getting ripped off--tie down kits!

I am not sure they are the same thing. The RV system has two options one is 25.66 and is called the utility system. It is not described on the site but probably is not as strong as the RV/Awning system which is probably similar to the aviation system except it is two claws with straps versus three claws with rope for the aviation system and is 77.76 versus 84.99. So my guess is that it is not the aviation issue but the difference in stoutness.

On this site the claw utility is one tie down with rope so that may be the difference. In which case it is pretty close in price, as it does not include the bag, nor hammer.

http://www.factoryrvsurplus.com/products.php?product_id=1433
 
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Or, you could got to the hardware store, buy three lengths of heavy chain, each four links long.

Now, buy nine 12" spikes, of a diameter that fits through the links in your chain.

Now attached sturdy nylon ropes, of the proper length, to each of the three sections of chain.

Lay the chain on the ground beneath your wing. Drive the three 12" spikes into the ground, through its own link, at opposing angles. Pull rope up to tiedown on wing. Snug it up and tie the knot.

Repeat on tail.

Total cost: <$12. Maybe less, if you have the rope.
 
Jay Honeck said:
Or, you could got to the hardware store, buy three lengths of heavy chain, each four links long.

Now, buy nine 12" spikes, of a diameter that fits through the links in your chain.

Now attached sturdy nylon ropes, of the proper length, to each of the three sections of chain.

Lay the chain on the ground beneath your wing. Drive the three 12" spikes into the ground, through its own link, at opposing angles. Pull rope up to tiedown on wing. Snug it up and tie the knot.

Repeat on tail.

Total cost: <$12. Maybe less, if you have the rope.
Click to expand...
But you do not get the all purpose bag, and claw hammer!
 
N801BH said:
Cheap,, Effective and has worked for my STOL plane is high winds...

http://eaavintage.org/aircraft-tiedowns/
Click to expand...

Those served me well during last year's apocalyptic storm at Oshkosh.

I've weathered plenty of storms, but that was the only one that caused me to seriously question whether I'd have an intact airplane when I returned to the campsite.
 
You are sounding more and more like Arturo, Jay. . .

Wells

Jay Honeck said:
Or, you could got to the hardware store, buy three lengths of heavy chain, each four links long.

Now, buy nine 12" spikes, of a diameter that fits through the links in your chain.

Now attached sturdy nylon ropes, of the proper length, to each of the three sections of chain.

Lay the chain on the ground beneath your wing. Drive the three 12" spikes into the ground, through its own link, at opposing angles. Pull rope up to tiedown on wing. Snug it up and tie the knot.

Repeat on tail.

Total cost: <$12. Maybe less, if you have the rope.
Click to expand...
 
Jay Honeck said:
Or, you could got to the hardware store, buy three lengths of heavy chain, each four links long.

Now, buy nine 12" spikes, of a diameter that fits through the links in your chain.

Now attached sturdy nylon ropes, of the proper length, to each of the three sections of chain.

Lay the chain on the ground beneath your wing. Drive the three 12" spikes into the ground, through its own link, at opposing angles. Pull rope up to tiedown on wing. Snug it up and tie the knot.

Repeat on tail.

Total cost: <$12. Maybe less, if you have the rope.
Click to expand...
Exact setup I have. Home Depot guy thought I was really strange when I asked for 3 sets of 4 links each. I bought marine-grade rope for UV protection, but boight too much. No big deal. Total cost of kit $35 because I also picked up a nylon bag to put everything in.

Spray paint the links bright orange or yellow for visibility. It really helps after a week of being tied down.
 
Jay Honeck said:
Or, you could got to the hardware store, buy three lengths of heavy chain, each four links long.

Now, buy nine 12" spikes, of a diameter that fits through the links in your chain.

Now attached sturdy nylon ropes, of the proper length, to each of the three sections of chain.

Lay the chain on the ground beneath your wing. Drive the three 12" spikes into the ground, through its own link, at opposing angles. Pull rope up to tiedown on wing. Snug it up and tie the knot.

Repeat on tail.

Total cost: <$12. Maybe less, if you have the rope.
Click to expand...
yup. I used to use the same system with one change I welded the links to one of the spikes so it would be harder to lose.
 
tmyers said:
Has anyone used nylon straps for tie downs?
Click to expand...

Most of the time the point of failure is the metal hook. As for overall strength...fully loaded the cherokee is 2400 pounds. So I want rope strength at least two times 1/3 the weight (3 tie down points) or 2 * 800 = 1600 pounds on each tie down.

Yes, I'm paranoid.

Here's a great discussion of breaking strength vs safe working load.
http://www.boatsafe.com/marlinespike/breaking.htm
 
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I had my claw bend and break in a pretty stiff wind in Cody a few years back. To it's credit, it didn't pull out entirely and the Claw folk replaced all the damaged components without question.
 
I've been using the tie-downs they sell you at Oshkosh ($15), and they've weathered some fearsome storms as well. Jay has the right of it though.
 
My main problem these day is finding "real" rope. No one in our area carries real braided nylon rope. i.e. the entire cross section is rope without the solid "plastic" core. All I can find these days is rope with the "plastic" core and nylon braided around it.

I found it a while back online but the minimum order was a full spool...250'...or maybe even 500'. I didn't need enough for 10 or 20 sets of tie downs.

I have three sets of real rope tie downs but they're getting older and stiffer.
 
N801BH said:
Cheap,, Effective and has worked for my STOL plane is high winds...

http://eaavintage.org/aircraft-tiedowns/
Click to expand...

Dun learned something...
attachment.php



timwinters said:
My main problem these day is finding "real" rope. No one in our area carries real braided nylon rope. i.e. the entire cross section is rope without the solid "plastic" core. All I can find these days is rope with the "plastic" core and nylon braided around it.

I found it a while back online but the minimum order was a full spool...250'...or maybe even 500'. I didn't need enough for 10 or 20 sets of tie downs.

I have three sets of real rope tie downs but they're getting older and stiffer.
Click to expand...

Three strand
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wc...&subdeptNum=50315&classNum=50316#.Ud12pm1O66Q

Double braid
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wc...&subdeptNum=50315&classNum=50317#.Ud13BG1O66Q

All by yea olde foote
 

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I use nylon friction straps and dog run screws. They work better than the aircraft ones that screw in and then pull out with about 100lbs of force.
 
MSPAviator said:
I could buy two Claw kits for the RV, get a total of four anchors that way, and still come out ahead vs. the aircraft kit... :rolleyes:



The Claw tiedown kit for RV awnings, $25.66:

http://tweetys.com/the-claw-tie-down-kit.aspx

The Claw tiedown kit for airplanes, $84.99!

http://www.pilotmall.com/product/The-Claw-Aircraft-Tie-Down-System/tie-down-kits
Click to expand...


If you go to the manufacturer's website, you'll see that the kit Tweetys sells for $25.66 only includes one claw. The Aircraft system includes 3 claws.
http://www.theclaw.com/the-claw/aircraft-claw-c100.php
They have different model numbers. If you look on Tweety's site, it lists the manufacturer's model number. Go the TheClaw.com and see what is included with that model number.

The ad is very misleading because it says it comes with a bag that stores 2 anchors, but it only only comes with one.
 
douglas393 said:
I am not sure they are the same thing. The RV system has two options one is 25.66 and is called the utility system. It is not described on the site but probably is not as strong as the RV/Awning system which is probably similar to the aviation system except it is two claws with straps versus three claws with rope for the aviation system and is 77.76 versus 84.99. So my guess is that it is not the aviation issue but the difference in stoutness.

On this site the claw utility is one tie down with rope so that may be the difference. In which case it is pretty close in price, as it does not include the bag, nor hammer.

http://www.factoryrvsurplus.com/products.php?product_id=1433
Click to expand...

Both of those kits claim to hold 1200lbs
 
Eastern Mountain Sports and REI both sell various climbing rope by the foot. Most of the large malls around here at least have one or the other.
timwinters said:
My main problem these day is finding "real" rope. No one in our area carries real braided nylon rope. i.e. the entire cross section is rope without the solid "plastic" core. All I can find these days is rope with the "plastic" core and nylon braided around it.

I found it a while back online but the minimum order was a full spool...250'...or maybe even 500'. I didn't need enough for 10 or 20 sets of tie downs.

I have three sets of real rope tie downs but they're getting older and stiffer.
Click to expand...
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
Three strand
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wc...&subdeptNum=50315&classNum=50316#.Ud12pm1O66Q

Double braid
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wc...&subdeptNum=50315&classNum=50317#.Ud13BG1O66Q

All by yea olde foote
Click to expand...

The first link is for twisted rope, twisted rope is quite inferior to braided rope.

The second link in indeed braided but, unfortunately, when i called customer service i was told that it is braided over a solid core just like what I can find locally. That ain't real rope.

Thanks for trying though.
 
Tim,

Are you looking for the true braided rope for it's strength or it's ability to stretch and provide some cushion when strained?
 
ClimbnSink said:
Eastern Mountain Sports and REI both sell various climbing rope by the foot. Most of the large malls around here at least have one or the other.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, that too has a solid core:

braided nylon sheath over nylon strand core--offers low static elongation and superior abrasion resistance
Click to expand...


tmyers said:
Tim,

Are you looking for the true braided rope for it's strength or it's ability to stretch and provide some cushion when strained?
Click to expand...

Neither...but rather because I'm overly anal retentive and can't bring myself to consider solid core rope to be "real" rope.
 
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N801BH said:
Cheap,, Effective and has worked for my STOL plane is high winds...

http://eaavintage.org/aircraft-tiedowns/
Click to expand...

When I go to the site via Safari, I get some stupid popup on the second page I cannot get rid of. Is there something I am missing? I can sort of get all the drawing plans from switching between the two articles but it would be nice to see it without the popup.

Cheers
 
Tim

You can order from West Marine by calling them and asking for details about the various types of line (rope). That's where I got my ropes...it does not have a solid core but is braided over a core of some other material. It's definitely not solid plastic. IIRC (it's been 10 yrs) looking at the photos on the website, I think I have the Sta-Set X Polyester.

When you talk to them, ask them to send you samples. There are two WM stores in Missouri - Osage Beach and St Charles.

If either is nearby, go have fun. If neither are nearby, it's a great reason to go fly to one of them. Only 100 nm between 0T3 and KSET. Or a bit more to get vectored around KSTL.
 
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Murphey, thanks, when talking with New England Rope's customer service earlier today (one of the brands that West Marine sells), I was told that they do have a fully braided nylon rope. It's sailboat mast rope and it runs over $4/ft. I believe they said it's called "single braided".

All their other rope is "double braided" (again, I believe that was their terminology) and it is a braided sheath over a core of one sort or another. Regardless of the core material, it's still not real rope in my opinion so I'll probably be paying the $4/ft for the real stuff.

You know...the "core and sheath" rope may be just fine but I can't bring myself to use it.
 
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I'm pretty sure if the RV awning gets damaged no one is going to drag the Claw folks to court. If, on the other hand your RV-XXX pulls loose and flips over, Avemco or whoever pays for it will look at the Claw as a potential source of recompense.
 
timwinters said:
The first link is for twisted rope, twisted rope is quite inferior to braided rope.

The second link in indeed braided but, unfortunately, when i called customer service i was told that it is braided over a solid core just like what I can find locally. That ain't real rope.

Thanks for trying though.
Click to expand...

You have got to be effing kidding.
 
X3 Skier said:
When I go to the site via Safari, I get some stupid popup on the second page I cannot get rid of. Is there something I am missing? I can sort of get all the drawing plans from switching between the two articles but it would be nice to see it without the popup.

Cheers
Click to expand...


I can't answer that.. I have never used safari... Maybe one of the resident computer wizards can chime in...:dunno::rolleyes:
 
timwinters said:
Murphey, thanks, when talking with New England Rope's customer service earlier today (one of the brands that West Marine sells), I was told that they do have a fully braided nylon rope. It's sailboat mast rope and it runs over $4/ft. I believe they said it's called "single braided".

All their other rope is "double braided" (again, I believe that was their terminology) and it is a braided sheath over a core of one sort or another. Regardless of the core material, it's still not real rope in my opinion so I'll probably be paying the $4/ft for the real stuff.

You know...the "core and sheath" rope may be just fine but I can't bring myself to use it.
Click to expand...


Why not?
 
dell30rb said:
Both of those kits claim to hold 1200lbs
Click to expand...
You are right, I edited my post when I realized my first conclusion was wrong. Probably should have deleted the wrong part. Sorry. Anyhow the difference is the utility only has one claw, and no bag, or hammer where as the awning/RV has two claws, two straps, a bag, and a hammer, where as the aviation has three claws, three ropes, a bag, and a hammer. Bottom line it seems to me that the pricing is pretty consistent between the three versions and it does not appear they are inflating their prices for the aviation version.

As to whether they are worth what they are asking, that is another issue.
 
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