AC-120-76D and Private Checkride

[OkieAviator]

Yes

https://asrs.arc.nasa.gov/publications/callback/cb_392.html

Small grouping but somewhat interesting and comedic all at the same time. I’ve flown with friends who get hyper focused on ADSB traffic or something GPS related during initial 1K climb.

 

[Bubba G]

Cool, James. That is some good anecdotal evidence that accidents/incidents are indeed occurring due to pilots and controllers working with technology and missing something outside the window. Not enough to establish a definitive trend or 'uptick' in accidents, but useful nonetheless to illustrate the point that it happens.

 

[James331]

Cool, James. That is some good anecdotal evidence that accidents/incidents are indeed occurring due to pilots and controllers working with technology and missing something outside the window. Not enough to establish a definitive trend or 'uptick' in accidents, but useful nonetheless to illustrate the point that it happens.

Just a NASA call back report

But it's obvious that the more stuff you have to look at in the cockpit, the more your head is going to be in the cockpit.

This is where building that initial foundation without all the screens comes in, than adding them later.

It's knowing what information you need and when.

I've told this story before, but
Years ago I was checking a VFR PPL out in a rental, it was a G1000 172, we went up and did the thing, all was ok, but his eyes were inside a bit, especially for a SoCal clear blue and 92 kinda day.
I give him a heading for something, might have been for a steep turn or whatever, anywho this heading had us pointing at a somewhat distant mountain range.
I asked if we would clear that range at our present altitude and heading, he starts fumbling around with the G1000, I asked what he was looking for, he says the terrain screen, I told him I'd show him how to get it in a second, I hit the duplicate screen display so he lost what he was trying to do on my screen, I asked him to look out the window and tell me if we were going to clear, he looked out the window for a second and then went back trying fiddle with the G1000, I told him to forget it and take us back to the airport and we wouldn't be renting him without a good bit of dual instruction.

 

[denverpilot]

I asked if we would clear that range at our present altitude and heading, he starts fumbling around with the G1000, I asked what he was looking for, he says the terrain screen, I told him I'd show him how to get it in a second, I hit the duplicate screen display so he lost what he was trying to do on my screen, I asked him to look out the window and tell me if we were going to clear, he looked out the window for a second and then went back trying fiddle with the G1000, I told him to forget it and take us back to the airport and we wouldn't be renting him without a good bit of dual instruction.

Good lord. Was the next flight, “I’m going to cover the entire panel with my jacket so you can see that you can fly an airplane just fine without any of that?”

 

[Jeffythequick]

Hello all,

I'm nearing my private checkride and I'm having a little debate with my CFI. He quotes AC-120-76D as evidence that the FAA approves an EFB (iPad w/ForeFlight in this case) as a suitable replacement for paper charts and hence the DPE can no longer fail the device. Now I've read the document, and a few of the other documents that it references, but it's still not totally clear to me. Pretty much every discussion on the use of an iPad during a checkride everyone says it's very likely the DPE will fail the device and maybe even fail the GPS.

Now, I do not rely solely on ForeFlight for my XC flight or planning. Typically I'll paper plan the flight, then also plan it in ForeFlight and reference it on the iPad in-flight, but I try to avoid using the moving map. My concern is that if the DPE fails my iPad on the checkride during the diversion, how am I supposed to navigate to another airport without a chart? Sure I can plan ahead and write down possible locations he'll ask me to fly to, but I live in SoCal, there's a good chance he can pick an airport I didn't pre-plan as a possible diversion.

AC-120-76D was updated October 2017 making an EFB legal. I haven't found many people's experiences with checkrides after that date. What's the thinking here? Does the AC actually make it so the DPE cannot fail your iPad if you're using it as your chart? I don't mind having paper back ups, but it is another (wasted) expense, especially because the date keeps getting moved around and I don't want to have to keep buying more to stay up to date.

Thoughts?

$11 for Sectional Chart
$399 for FlyQ IFR/VFR Lifetime subscription
$1100 for iPad with 512GB memory and Cellular

Having a backup plan for the iPad... Priceless.

I had both, and my DPE had no problem with the iPad, and that was June 4, 2018.

He asked me what I'd do if the iPad died because of heat, whatever, and I told him I had the database on my iPhone, and had the paper sectional as a backup, plus I write all of the frequencies I need on my kneeboard. Plus, I have 3 NiMH batteries on me.

 

[steingar]

Most of the accidents wouldn't have been prevented with a app or a gizmo, most of them can be tracked down to very old and fundamental screw ups.

Actually, if you look at the accident databases what you see as a major cause of crashes is folks just getting lost. Yeah, charts and stopwatch work great until they don't, we're all humans and make mistakes. Lots of folks got lost, ran out of gas, crashed and died. One mountain can look like another, one little town can look like the next. Not to say that one shouldn't have a good backup, but claiming that satellite navigation hasn't increased safety is simply inaccurate.

 

[hamer]

In my experience looking down at a chart and trying to make changes mid flight is a lot more "heads down" time than having an iPad mounted in your field of view and making on the fly changes with a few taps. My two cents.

 

[lancie00]

https://ipadpilotnews.com/2018/06/ask-a-dpe-is-it-ok-to-use-an-ipad-on-the-checkride/

Here's what some DPE's said when asked about iPad use on checkrides. It sounds like they want the applicant to plan and fly the way the always will. If that includes an iPad then use an iPad. However, don't be surprised when it fails during the checkride. If it were me, I'd have my iPad, iPhone and paper just in case.

 

[MauleSkinner]

In my experience looking down at a chart and trying to make changes mid flight is a lot more "heads down" time than having an iPad mounted in your field of view and making on the fly changes with a few taps. My two cents.

On the other hand, looking down at an iPad in your lap is a lot more heads down time than holding a paper chart in your field of view.

 

[Salty]

IMO it's just simpler to learn and check out with paper. Then learn and use the gps gadget and you can always fall back to paper if you ever have to.

 

[N3368K]

I had to wait a long time for all the electronic gizmos beyond a VOR. I had to learn it for my checkride. It was several more years before I had a plane with one...and even longer before I had one with one which worked.