AA pilot: "Unable relay..."

D

docmirror

Touchdown! Greaser!
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Cowboy - yeehah!
What a turd. I often fly just east and into the Rockies. Often, flitting around the big rocks where radio reception is limited. So, consequently I often run out of com with ABQ center. They know it, I know it, and we work around it.

So, Sunday, headed back to TX, I'm on with ABQ and a AA eastbound gets on and checks in. I haven't heard from center for a while, and request a relay from the AA flight:

"AA flight 547, this is Bonanza 12345. Request relay to Albuquerque center." Wait:

"Um, Bonanza calling 547, unable relay".

Okay so maybe they're switching freq. Nope, a few minutes later they come up on the same freq and get higher altitude. Nice. While I don't have any guarantees, this is the first time I've heard an 'unable' and then just motor on their way. Finally, picked up FW center and advised them that I was unable to contact or relay to ABQ. They said ABQ was wondering where I was. Hope AA never needs a relay from me(pretty unlikely, I know) [/rant]
 
I had an AA pilot relay for me when I was lost once. Saved my bacon pretty good. That AA pilot is an ass.
 
I know what ya mean. Guys relay for me all the time in there. This one still has me a bit steamed.
 
Man, you were just asking for a common courtesy. I'd be steamed too.
 
I kinda look at this a little differently. That is very uncommon to find a pilot that will not try to help another pilot out. There's no question that the AA pilot was a dork but it goes to show you how professional pilots are all around from GA to the airlines. You have 1 in maybe a 1000 that’s a dork, I find that pretty good odds.
 
Lance F said:
Man, you were just asking for a common courtesy. I'd be steamed too.
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Keep in mind that there's some possibility that the AA pilot had a valid reason for refusing to help baring an emergency "mayday" call.
 
Doc,
You didn't mention the time of day this occurred. It might have been nap time.
 
If you ever need a relay and hear a SENTRYxx on freq, give 'em a call. God knows we get SUPER bored sitting in the orbit for hours on end.
 
During my situation back in 1986, there were at least three airliners that assisted during that night. Though, they may have also had some encouragement by ZMP.
 
AWACSEng said:
If you ever need a relay and hear a SENTRYxx on freq, give 'em a call. God knows we get SUPER bored sitting in the orbit for hours on end.
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Ya know, there's a ton of MOAs around that area, and we have fast movers all the time. I've heard what I think are tank aircraft, next time I'll get their call sign. They're often on the upper freqs though. Never heard a 'Sentry' yet. Thanks.
 
There are no less than 5 areas we operate in with ABQ center alone. You won't find us in the MOA's, that space is used by fast movers. We don't like to be in the area with those guys any more than you do, and we even know where they are...most of the time.
 
AWACSEng said:
If you ever need a relay and hear a SENTRYxx on freq, give 'em a call. God knows we get SUPER bored sitting in the orbit for hours on end.
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Are you actually on the civilian frequencies? (118-136 MHz) I hear the tower here talking to military folks quite a bit (Firefly 1, arresting gear shows up, clear to land runway 18...) but I never hear the other side of the conversation. :dunno:
 
Yes, we operate on VHF freq's. When you only hear one side of the conversation it usually means CTR is simulcasting on VHF and UHF. As for being on "civilian frequencies" all heavy military aircraft and some fighter types are VHF equipped.
 
AWACSEng said:
Yes, we operate on VHF freq's. When you only hear one side of the conversation it usually means CTR is simulcasting on VHF and UHF. As for being on "civilian frequencies" all heavy military aircraft and some fighter types are VHF equipped.
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Using PAX approach and other military approach frequencies, I hear the controllers only, never the military aircraft. They must be broadcasting and receiving on UHF.
 
Anthony said:
Using PAX approach and other military approach frequencies, I hear the controllers only, never the military aircraft. They must be broadcasting and receiving on UHF.
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You are correct. Sometimes when I talk to center on UHF it is the same thing. I can hear the controllers but not the aircraft.

Some or most military VHF radios have a larger band than the civilian radios. For example our internal VHF is 142.6. That sucks because I would like to contact our base ops with the club airplane but have to use other means to set up a car for a burrito run.
 
I lost my ability to transmit on my Comms in my old Cherokee in NYC Class B airspace once. There was a bad connection from my Mic. Anyway, I switched to my handheld to transmit, well NY Approach couldn't hear me as I didn't have it connected to an external antenna, but an airliner heard me and volunteered to relay. He was great and really saved my *ss in the congested airspace. I had already switched the transponder to 7600 so App knew I had a lost comm. The pilot was able to relay I coud receive and we ended up with me communicating via the transponder by identing when asked a question. Pretty cool.
 
FWIW, I have heard plenty of airliners relay calls, and have even been able to relay for one once, too.

Hard to believe, but airline pilots are people too. Their poop doesn't stink, but other than that...
 
Yep, most everyone is good about relays around the big rocks. They have for the most part been very helpful, and I'm always complementary. This was a unique situation. I'm trying to think of anything that would account for the 'unable' part. I've been asked to standby before, but never an unable. Added to this that they remained on freq for at least 20 minutes from my request.
 
I've had good luck with relays, too. That area near the junction of ABQ center and HOU center can get tough sometimes. I've had Houston forget about me - and as a result I have flown out of range of their receive sites. Often there is an alternate frequency available (check the charts and/or green book) - when HOU forgot about me one time, I called ABQ center on the frequency I'm normally handed off to and they arranged the hand-off.
 
docmirror said:
Yep, most everyone is good about relays around the big rocks. They have for the most part been very helpful, and I'm always complementary. This was a unique situation. I'm trying to think of anything that would account for the 'unable' part. I've been asked to standby before, but never an unable. Added to this that they remained on freq for at least 20 minutes from my request.
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You just don't know. They might have been having some sort of passenger emergency and the person on the radio was also flying and pretty busy. I'd hate to be too judgmental (in this instance--I don't have anything against being judgmental in general) without more information.

Judy
 
I asked an AA pilot friend of mine if AA has a policy restricting its pilots from providing COMM relay functions to lower-flying pilots. His reply:

Nope. This guy's just being a jerk.
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So, doc, try again with the next guy. I hope you get better service next time.
 
Yeah, I don't generally want to bash AA. All in all, a decent airline. Just one turd among the chocolate bars. I'm over it.
 
Ease up guys, he was probably playing with his iPhone. :D
 
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