A close call

58_Super_Cub

58_Super_Cub

Pre-Flight
Joined
Feb 12, 2007
Messages
42
Location
South
Display Name
Display name:
John
V
I just go a call a few minutes ago from a friend at our airport. It started like this. “Man you now how to get them talking at the airport”. I was immediately thinking what did I do this time. I was running the morning through my mind. Then he said it was noting I did, But what almost happened. Lets just say he has my ear now.
Hear is a quick run down of my weekend log.
4/27 DTN to DTN touch and goes .6hr
4/28 DTN to 2L0 Pineville Fly-in 1.4hr
4/28 2L0 to DTN back home 1.8hr
4/29 DTN to ATA Fly-in food .9hr
4/29 ATA to 4F2 $3.00 100LL 1.1hr
4/29 2F2 to DTN not direct 1.4hr
So all in all 7.2 hr of fun flying with my son’s one on Saturday and one on Sunday. On Sunday I called ground let them know who I was, Where I was and were I wanted to go with radar. My hanger is a real close taxi to the active. I will sit a minute and listen to all the traffic to get an idea of what is going on. While I was taxiing to the runway I got my squawk code. After my run-up I called to say I was #1 @ G and 14. My friend was just landing that called me today. After he landed I called and said “good day Kevin” That was about out talk for the day. Tower then called 96D cleared for 14 exit right down wind. Right after that traffic called left base 2 miles. As soon as I was straight and started the throttle forward. The tower then said no hesitation on ground roll. Right then I was thinking 2 miles I have a lot of time, WHY? When I was wheels up and a about 200’ AGL the tower said as calm as he could turn right downwind now. So I rolled a sharp 90 deg and got a big thank you. I then turned my attention to finding the plane on final. About 2 miles from the airport when I went to departure. Departure was trying to contact a Diamond Aircraft. He asked me to relay a message to the Diamond “taxi to parking”. I was sitting there going why is approach/departure having tell someone to taxi to parking???? Were was this guy? Then I went back to flying and talking to my son. Thinking how hungry I was and how good that food will be when I get to ATA.

It was no till I got the call from my friend that it all came together and I was glad I went to church and said my prayers. There was a DUMB A#$S that go a new Diamond and was not familiar with the plane. Did not call the tower and turned in front of the guy on a 2 mile left base. I was told if I had waited any extra time making that right turn it would have been a midair. That dumb guy flew a go around down the middle and did not see me till I turned. I bet he was looking at his glass panel.
I am glad I did not know what was happing. If I would have I would have wanted to talk to the other pilot or clean my shorts. The guys that saw it said it was too close. And to think I talk to that SOB and told him were to park. If I would have know I could have told him a better place to go.
I did have a good time flying with my sons this weekend
John
ISTA VENTS
 
Glad you and son are OK. Good for you. Comply, then question.
 
I'll bet that brand new airplane is defective. I'll bet the video game screen up front didn't show another airplane in the way. And the headset obviously didn't get auto-tuned properly to the tower frequency.
 
mikea said:
I'll bet that brand new airplane is defective. I'll bet the video game screen up front didn't show another airplane in the way. And the headset obviously didn't get auto-tuned properly to the tower frequency.
Click to expand...

You saw my Lidle post, eh?
 
Bill Jennings said:
You saw my Lidle post, eh?
Click to expand...

I don't know how close other towered fields are in your area, but is it possible that he was talking to the wrong tower?

On FL's East coast VRB and FPR are very close. It's not unusual for a pilot to be talking to the one where he plans to land but actually head toward the other. Although every time it's happened when I'm there, the controllers are able to figure out what's happening and inform the pilot that it looks like he's approaching the neighboring airspace.
 
John, I'm glad things ended up with all of you safe.

As much as this guy ticked ya off, I hope there's a time maybe you could help him learn. As I departed Winder on Saturday, some kid piped up and announced he was "taxiing to the active." What active? Which active? Oh, you mean the runway in use? Does it have a number? I didn't say a word but I was tempted. Before I switched, I did hear him at least announce he was crossing the other runway.

Right after, I got cut off again at my home field by a guy who entered on an "extended base." Right after him was another on a long final from outside the pattern (not an IAP), I have no choice but to do a right 360 while another CFI behind me comes up close and has to extend downwind. All this because two pilots can't follow simple standards and practices; one of which I'm sure applies to your encounter... be very familiar with an aircraft and its systems before you fly it.
 
glad you made it.

you didnt say if you did or not, but i bet you take a look at final from now on, even if youve got a tower "watching" you
 
Btw, John, I was at 2L0 for lunch on Saturday, too. Sorry I missed you (or in this case, glad I missed you! :) ).

Monday I had a KA 350 complain about me causing him to go-around after he called a 5 mile straight in while I was on downwind at MBO. I could have cleared the runway in time but the parallel txwy was blocked off for construction and I had no where to go but to back taxi.
 
jesse said:
"the active" usually equates to "I forgot the runway number"
Click to expand...

:redface: I did that once or twice except I called it "favored" runway. I felt like a complete dunce. I take more time planning before moving the plane now.:redface:
 
I don't know--maybe some of these new high-tech flyin' flivvers are just too complicated, y'know what I mean?

Sigh
 
Here's a couple of things that popped into my mind when reading about this... 1) Doesn't the Diamond DA40's G1000 have a TCAS? and 2) Aren't you supposed to stay the hell away from a controlled airport if the tower hasn't given you pattern entry instructions (unless you're squawking 7600)?
 
I did take a look at final. From what I found out he came in moving on a real short left base. There are some other fields close one is real close Barksdale AFB. That should have been the one he blasted into. He was still on approach when he came in over and back in on the ground.

I R A_I A R Pilot I did see your plane and rembered it from the photos I saw from Gastons-2006. I will see you there this year.

Mybe I just need a tail gunner.
John
 
t0r0nad0 said:
Here's a couple of things that popped into my mind when reading about this... 1) Doesn't the Diamond DA40's G1000 have a TCAS? and 2) Aren't you supposed to stay the hell away from a controlled airport if the tower hasn't given you pattern entry instructions (unless you're squawking 7600)?
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It's not TCAS but TIS or Traffic Information Service. You're only alerted to information provided by the other aircraft transponders as relayed by Mode S radar. It's meant to be informative, not directive. Visual separation is still dependent upon the PIC.

http://www.aopa.org/whatsnew/air_traffic/tis.html
 
Ah. My mentor pilot's Bonanza and Baron both have Garmin GNS530's with that function... it's pretty helpful to see which direction traffic is coming from while you're scanning, especially on hazy days. The Mode S makes sense... we were flying one time and ATC informed us of an opposite-direction Glassair about 3 miles away, but we didn't see him on the 530. It could be that he doesn't have a Mode S transponder.
 
t0r0nad0 said:
Ah. My mentor pilot's Bonanza and Baron both have Garmin GNS530's with that function... it's pretty helpful to see which direction traffic is coming from while you're scanning, especially on hazy days. The Mode S makes sense... we were flying one time and ATC informed us of an opposite-direction Glassair about 3 miles away, but we didn't see him on the 530. It could be that he doesn't have a Mode S transponder.
Click to expand...
Sometimes, there's traffic that won't show on TIS. Likewise, you'll see TIS targets that you can't find. The other day, I had to stop maneuvers a few times because of targets but I could never spot them.

A while back, I was on an IFR flight across northeast Georgia. I saw a TIS target show for just a few seconds then suddenly went yellow on me. It was within 500 feet below and a half mile. I couldn't spot a thing. I called Atlanta and asked to verify traffic. They said it was behind me and not a factor. Until they showed it tracking away from me, my head was everywhere but on the instruments. He might have been a fast climbing aircraft from below. Either way, nothing beats eyes outside the cockpit.
 
luckily my instructor warned me about another "interesting" thing that happens with the TIS equipped G1000 at my home airport. On climbout, sometimes as your a/c is entering the radar service area, it detects you as a traffic conflict, and basically shows the target (which is you in this case) right on top of you.. for obvious reasons...
 
sbonek said:
luckily my instructor warned me about another "interesting" thing that happens with the TIS equipped G1000 at my home airport. On climbout, sometimes as your a/c is entering the radar service area, it detects you as a traffic conflict, and basically shows the target (which is you in this case) right on top of you.. for obvious reasons...
Click to expand...
I've had that happen several times, particularly in steep turns or steep spirals.
 
t0r0nad0 said:
Here's a couple of things that popped into my mind when reading about this... 1) Doesn't the Diamond DA40's G1000 have a TCAS? and 2) Aren't you supposed to stay the hell away from a controlled airport if the tower hasn't given you pattern entry instructions (unless you're squawking 7600)?
Click to expand...

There are three levels of traffic available on DA40's:

1) No traffic.

2) TIS, which uses a Mode S transponder and receives data from ATC radar. Other aircraft do NOT need a Mode S transponder to be detected - Just your aircraft needs it to receive the data. However, any aircraft that are not on radar will not show up on your screen. If you're not in radar coverage, a small yellow "Traffic Unavailable" flag will appear in the bottom left corner of the MFD.

3) The DA40XL incorporates "Active" traffic. I forget if they use Skywatch or Avidyne. This is not dependent on ATC radar, it actually pings other transponders by itself. It's very similar to TCAS except it does not provide (or negotiate) resolution advisories with the other plane. It's about as good as you can get in a GA airplane.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
There are three levels of traffic available on DA40's:

1) No traffic.

2) TIS, which uses a Mode S transponder and receives data from ATC radar. Other aircraft do NOT need a Mode S transponder to be detected - Just your aircraft needs it to receive the data. However, any aircraft that are not on radar will not show up on your screen. If you're not in radar coverage, a small yellow "Traffic Unavailable" flag will appear in the bottom left corner of the MFD.

3) The DA40XL incorporates "Active" traffic. I forget if they use Skywatch or Avidyne. This is not dependent on ATC radar, it actually pings other transponders by itself. It's very similar to TCAS except it does not provide (or negotiate) resolution advisories with the other plane. It's about as good as you can get in a GA airplane.
Click to expand...
The IL distributor told me that the non-XL model can be software upgraded to provide this functionality too.
 
gprellwitz said:
The IL distributor told me that the non-XL model can be software upgraded to provide this functionality too.
Click to expand...

The IL distributor is full of crap, then... There is a hardware component, and an extra pair of antennas as well. There's a reason it's a $20K plus option on most planes. You don't charge $20K for a software upgrade... And a software upgrade doesn't weigh 11.5 pounds either. ;)

Even the TIS is optional (was, rather, on the pre-XL DA40), the requisite Mode S transponder component of the G1000 is a $3113 exchange for the Mode C in my latest DA40/G1000 price list.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
The IL distributor is full of crap, then... There is a hardware component, and an extra pair of antennas as well. There's a reason it's a $20K plus option on most planes. You don't charge $20K for a software upgrade... And a software upgrade doesn't weigh 11.5 pounds either. ;)

Even the TIS is optional (was, rather, on the pre-XL DA40), the requisite Mode S transponder component of the G1000 is a $3113 exchange for the Mode C in my latest DA40/G1000 price list.
Click to expand...

Well, he promised me a ride in the DA-42 back in January, and I still haven't heard from him to schedule! So I'm not standing up for him right now! :rofl:
 
t0r0nad0 said:
Ah. My mentor pilot's Bonanza and Baron both have Garmin GNS530's with that function... it's pretty helpful to see which direction traffic is coming from while you're scanning, especially on hazy days. The Mode S makes sense... we were flying one time and ATC informed us of an opposite-direction Glassair about 3 miles away, but we didn't see him on the 530. It could be that he doesn't have a Mode S transponder.
Click to expand...

It doesn't matter if he (the target) has a Mode S transponder--only the plane with TIS needs one to process the data. Now if it's TCAS, if both planes have the mode S and TCAS, they'll both get directiions that are coordinated on how to avoid a collision (climb or dive).
 
As a point of clarity, the TIS traffic produced by ASR Radar, not TIS radar. Approach Surveillance Radar (ASR) radar is available in approach areas only, i.e. you only have traffic on your screen within (almost exactly) 55nm from the antenna. TIS is actually uplinked via the G1000 or the Garmin GTX 330, which overlays the traffic data on the MFD.
 
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