172 with pponk 180 or C182?

Unit74

Unit74

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Unit74
172 with Pen Yan 180 or C182?

Both birds basically identically equipped, mid time engines and the same price. 182 has an old single axis A/P.

Insurance is more on the 182 and burns 12gph. The 172 is burning 9gph.

But all things considered, is 15-20 kts worth the extra maint costs, 100lbs more, gas and insurance.

I was all but set on the 182 until this local bird fell in my lap. Now I'm torn...:idea:
 
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Unit74 said:
Both birds basically identically equipped, mid time engines and the same price. 182 has an old single axis A/P.

Insurance is more on the 182 and burns 12gph. The 172 is burning 9gph.

But all things considered, is 15-20 kts worth the extra maint costs, 100lbs more, gas and insurance.

I was all but set on the 182 until this local bird fell in my lap. Now I'm torn...:idea:
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Do you see yourself flying with 2 or more passengers occasionally? Lots of longer cross countries? Just messing around in the pattern?
 
Unit74 said:
Both birds basically identically equipped, mid time engines and the same price. 182 has an old single axis A/P.

Insurance is more on the 182 and burns 12gph. The 172 is burning 9gph.

But all things considered, is 15-20 kts worth the extra maint costs, 100lbs more, gas and insurance.

I was all but set on the 182 until this local bird fell in my lap. Now I'm torn...:idea:
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What autopilot does the 172 have?

A 180hp 172 is a fine bird, but that extra 20 knots makes all the difference in the world. Consider that climb, winds aloft, etc. will reduce your average airspeed by about 15 knots under the cruise TAS, and you're looking at the 182 being a good 20% faster on average.

The 182 will probably carry a higher load, it will be wider and more comfortable and more stable. You can't upgrade the width or stability of a 172.

Unless the 172 has a really nice 2-axis autopilot, everything I've heard so far still points toward the 182. What are the prices?
 
I own a 172 and am happy to be a owner. My friend who is older and no medical has thrown me the keys to his 182. I put much more hours in the 182 then my plane. I am now trying to find a way to buy the 182 and sell my plane. There has been no time while flying the 182 have I thought " I wish I was in the 172 now".
 
2 + people several times a year for long XC. About 5 times a year min from LIT to JAX area.

No A/P in the 172.

Both birds are $65ish and look outstanding.
 
Unit74 said:
2 + people several times a year for long XC. About 5 times a year min from LIT to JAX area.

No A/P in the 172.

Both birds are $65ish and look outstanding.
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In that case, absolutely go with the 182. I was thinking that *maybe* if the 172 was less than half the price of the 182, or at least $40K cheaper, it might be worth thinking about. If they cost the same and the 182 is equipped slightly better, this one's a no-brainer. Go with the 182, you won't regret it.

The 182 is one of the best all-around airplanes ever built - It's not the best at anything, but it's pretty darn good at EVERYthing. I've got about 450 hours in 182's, and they're hard to beat in terms of experiencing everything flying has to offer. 1000nm in a day? No problem. Haul hundreds of pounds of people and stuff? Easy. Get off a 1000-foot unimproved strip? Piece of cake. (Just don't do those last two at the same time - If you're heavy, 1500+ is probably a better idea.)
 
Unit74 said:
2 + people several times a year for long XC. About 5 times a year min from LIT to JAX area.

No A/P in the 172.

Both birds are $65ish and look outstanding.
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If there's nothing wrong with the 182 when you have it checked out, and you can afford it, get the 182. If 12gph kills you then power down a little. But most people don't buy airplanes to fly efficiently :)
 
What's a pponk 172? Never heard of it...

Pponk 182...sure.

(Not being a smart a***...serious question)
 
Never heard at the airport: "Man, I really wish I would've bought the smaller and slower plane with less useful load".

Get the 182 if you can afford it. You can always dial the 182 back to get better GPH but you can never power up the 172 to the 182 performance.
 
I fly a T-41B, 210HP IO-360 on a C-172 frame, cruise at 125KTAS, 10k MSL, 9-10GPH. Taken on two very long across the cross country flights. Climbs great with that HP with one or two on board.

But it still does not fly like a C-182. I also fly 182s fixed gear and retract. They handle different enough to make a great IFR platform.

You are comparing the cost of fuel, insurance, and maintenance on 180HP vs 235HP and a nicer ride in the 182.

If you can make the $number$ work, get the 182.
 
BillTIZ said:
I fly a T-41B, 210HP IO-360 on a C-172 frame, cruise at 125KTAS, 10k MSL, 9-10GPH. Taken on two very long across the cross country flights. Climbs great with that HP with one or two on board.

But it still does not fly like a C-182. I also fly 182s fixed gear and retract. They handle different enough to make a great IFR platform.

You are comparing the cost of fuel, insurance, and maintenance on 180HP vs 235HP and a nicer ride in the 182.

If you can make the $number$ work, get the 182.
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Wow, I can't believe this lol. I own a 172 and tell owners of 210 HP 172's I am looking at a 182 and they spend the next hour telling me the 210 hp 172 out performs the 182 and carries a better payload. I used to argue with them then I remembered that if I quit hitting my head against a wall it stops hurting.
 
how many here believe over the life of the aircraft a 182's maintenance costs will be the same as a 172?

I know several owners that believe they bought an aircraft that is too big because the maintenance costs are too high.
 
Go with the 182, larger cabin more speed,if your worried about fuel burn,pull the throttle back. You can always go slower.
 
kgruber said:
Me neither!
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Just pulled the spec sheets...it's a Pen Yan. :yes: I saw the "P" and assumed PPonk.

I just came back from looking at a 162m and the A/P basically said the same thing.... Dollars to doughnuts, it's foolish to buy a 172/180 over a 182 with the same dashboard. Now, if you already had the 172 and were timed out, only a fool would not consider the 180 conversion.


What I have noticed in all my research is a common denominator..... Wherever my search takes me on various platforms, I keep coming back to the 182's. I've looked at Archers, Dakotas, 172s, an M20J, Warrior and even an SR20.

Maybe I should just stop trying to find something else at my price point and accept the 182s. I'm not a high wing fan but you just can't beat the value in a 182.
 
Tom-D said:
how many here believe over the life of the aircraft a 182's maintenance costs will be the same as a 172?

I know several owners that believe they bought an aircraft that is too big because the maintenance costs are too high.
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I've never heard anybody flying a 182 wish they had a 172 instead.

Question for Tom:

Outside of feeding the larger engine, is there any difference in maintenance costs between a 172 airframe and 182 airframe?
Both are pretty simple, rugged, and familiar to any A&P.
 
You've two more cylinders and a constant speed prop, otherwise they are pretty much the same airframe, just different sizes. :D But, I'm not Tom. :D

Non Compos Mentis said:
I've never heard anybody flying a 182 wish they had a 172 instead.

Question for Tom:

Outside of feeding the larger engine, is there any difference in maintenance costs between a 172 airframe and 182 airframe?
Both are pretty simple, rugged, and familiar to any A&P.
Click to expand...
 
Unit74 said:
Maybe I should just stop trying to find something else at my price point and accept the 182s. I'm not a high wing fan but you just can't beat the value in a 182.
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This. I generally prefer high wing over low wing, but nobody ever really built an equivalent to the 182. Sure, Piper had the Cherokee 235/Pathfinder/Dakota that's got the same performance numbers, but it also has the same tiny Cherokee cabin.

182's are popular for a reason. A lot of reasons, actually.
 
Luvrv8 said:
Wow, I can't believe this lol. I own a 172 and tell owners of 210 HP 172's I am looking at a 182 and they spend the next hour telling me the 210 hp 172 out performs the 182 and carries a better payload. I used to argue with them then I remembered that if I quit hitting my head against a wall it stops hurting.
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A 210HP C172 may out climb, but the Max GW is lower on the 172.
I don't think the 210HP 172 will pass a 235HP at cruise speed.
 
Non Compos Mentis said:
I've never heard anybody flying a 182 wish they had a 172 instead.

Question for Tom:

Outside of feeding the larger engine, is there any difference in maintenance costs between a 172 airframe and 182 airframe?
Both are pretty simple, rugged, and familiar to any A&P.
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tires, oil usage, batteries, most of the accessories found on the engine. prop overhaul costs, If it is an early version servicing the stab trim. its the little stuff that will eat into your budget.
 
Never heard at the airport: "Man, I really wish I would've bought the smaller and slower plane with less useful load".

Get the 182 if you can afford it.
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If you can afford it is the key, as Tom is alluding to. It will cost you more to fly a 182, but if you have sufficient discretionary funds, go for it. The 182, in that case, will definitely make you happier. Tom - do you have a guesstimate for year-in/year-out how much more a 182 would be for maintenance??
 
somorris said:
It will cost you more to fly a 182, but if you have sufficient discretionary funds, go for it.
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Per hour, the 182 will cost more to fly. Per mile, it's a wash, if not maybe even a hair in favor of the 182. Get the 182.
 
N747JB said:
You've two more cylinders and a constant speed prop, otherwise they are pretty much the same airframe, just different sizes. :D But, I'm not Tom. :D
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different sizes cost different prices. compare the batteries as an example.

A fixed pitched 172 will probably never need an overhaul, but the 182's prop will at some point.

There are 12 spark plugs to buy about every 500 hours, vs 8 on a lycoming powered 172.

The costs of the 2 extra cylinders isn't much of a factor because the Lycoming and the 0-470 cylinders coast about the same, but you will do more lycoming cylinders over the life of the engine (TBO)

I have one customer that would trade down in a heart beat, IF he could find as nice of a 172 that his 182 is. He has learned he does not need the work horse the pony will do.
but he can't dump the 182 for what he has in it. so he is stuck, flying less due the cost per hour (fuel burn)
 
somorris said:
Tom - do you have a guesstimate for year-in/year-out how much more a 182 would be for maintenance??
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Do you know what's in Pandoria's box? because it really is an individual thing, each owner will spend money differently, each aircraft will require different things. But generally the parts for a 182 are more expensive than 172 parts, Yes I know many of the parts are the same. but check the price of replacement starters for the 182, plus the starter clutch.
 
Cylinder costs, 182
0-470-R, $1274.44 new (0-520 about the same).

C-172
0-300- $900.00
0-320-H2AD $1569.29
0320-A1B $1149.94

Starters
182,
0-470 699 retail, I get them for 513 (both rebuilt)
Starter adaptor $1663.53 my cost rebuilt

Lycoming starter
$ 488. my cost rebuilt, no adaptor
 
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