“Student pilot of the year” award

NordicDave

NordicDave

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NordicDave
http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2020/...t4CEravAa5iu9hhjgSM8o5Opd8IE6KUkg7LED-Akc&m=1


Student pilot. Looks like no multi rating, no ADSB in ruled airspace, leaking fuel, fuel imbalance, flying VFR in class A, fatigue, plane out of annual, moonless night flight over mountains, no contact with ATC, altimeter check 6 years ago, etc.

He might have wanted to go high to get over the mountains and tried to use his new oxygen system and he didn’t realize it wasn’t working. If everything that that report is true, it seems he seriously temped fate.

Almost a miracle if he would have arrived safely.
 
NordicDave said:
http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2020/...t4CEravAa5iu9hhjgSM8o5Opd8IE6KUkg7LED-Akc&m=1


Student pilot. Looks like no multi rating, no ADSB in ruled airspace, leaking fuel, fuel imbalance, flying VFR in class A, fatigue, plane out of annual, moonless night flight over mountains, no contact with ATC, altimeter check 6 years ago, etc.

He might have wanted to go high to get over the mountains and tried to use his new oxygen system and he didn’t realize it wasn’t working. If everything that that report is true, it seems he seriously temped fate.

Almost a miracle if he would have arrived safely.
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How would the line guy be able to look inside and verify ADS-B?
 
Interesting. He also owned a 310, among other things. I do know pilots that have completed instrument training but never took the test, same with commercial. I don't know anyone who never got a private and then flew a multi-engine plane on his student. Sounds as if he had more dollars than sense, as they say.
 
The plane wasn't out of annual. The annual was done on November 21, 2019 and the accident was the next April. The transponder was about six years overdue though.

Nothing prevents student pilots in twins. It's not obligatory to start in singles. Of course, you're solo flight is limited as a student pilot regardless of what the type of aircraft is.
 
Wow, that's insane. So glad he didn't kill his wife and kids, as it looks like they flew with him regularly. I am certain there's more to this guy's story, since I can't imagine a mom letting her kids fly with a unlicensed pilot, even if it was her husband.
 
Don't let the pictures with the family in the plane fool you. The reflection in the sunglasses seems to appear that the pictures were taken on the ground.
 
flyingron said:
The plane wasn't out of annual. The annual was done on November 21, 2019 and the accident was the next April. The transponder was about six years overdue though.

Nothing prevents student pilots in twins. It's not obligatory to start in singles. Of course, you're solo flight is limited as a student pilot regardless of what the type of aircraft is.
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And your solo flight doesn't include soloing new types.
 
Zeldman said:
Don't let the pictures with the family in the plane fool you. The reflection in the sunglasses seems to appear that the pictures were taken on the ground.
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There's pictures of them together in multiple aircraft on different days. Could have been preflight, could have been posed. We'll never know. But owning five airplanes, including several higher performance, with no certificate....there's more to the story.
 
Lindberg said:
Wow, that's insane. So glad he didn't kill his wife and kids, as it looks like they flew with him regularly. I am certain there's more to this guy's story, since I can't imagine a mom letting her kids fly with a unlicensed pilot, even if it was her husband.
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She may not have known.
 
I don't think he was a student pilot... just a dude flying with no certificate.
 
flyingron said:
Huh? You can solo all the types your instructor is willing to sign you off for.
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The 'without the approval of an instructor' was left unsaid, as I thought it to be obvious that there's zed chance an instructor would sign off a student in an Aerostar, for a long cross-country, no less.
 
Kenny Phillips said:
The 'without the approval of an instructor' was left unsaid, as I thought it to be obvious that there's zed chance an instructor would sign off a student in an Aerostar, for a long cross-country, no less.
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I was addressing Kenny's statement that "nobody flew a twin on a student pilot." It's not true. There are people who have gotten their private in a twin first.
 
flyingron said:
I was addressing Kenny's statement that "nobody flew a twin on a student pilot." It's not true. There are people who have gotten their private in a twin first.
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Re-read my statement; I know that it's possible, I just never knew anyone that did it. And I used to be at the flight school every day hanging out, back when I didn't have to work.
 
Mountains ate another one. Sad to see it was an A-Star. Someone tossed this one at me in e-mail when it happened.

Guy didn’t know enough to know he was in trouble. Fatigue, moonless night, big rocks, barely got here without running out of fuel...

What’s the pressurization differential in the A-Star? FL220, what’s the cabin at?

Tired enough he asked for Red Bull but got coffee instead, mild hypoxia, lives at sea level, pitch black outside.

Shades of the guy who plowed in over near Glenwood Springs last year and took the family and their dog with him

The rocks really don’t care if you can see them or not. Usually easier to avoid them when you can see them, however.
 
Hopefully he was self insured, I'd hate for my premium to go up yet again due to the actions of a moron like this.

I would also guess he didn't get a check out in the airplane and just got in it and left for the west coast. Probably not the best idea in a complex airplane like the Aerostar
 
Groundpounder said:
Hopefully he was self insured, I'd hate for my premium to go up yet again due to the actions of a moron like this.

I would also guess he didn't get a check out in the airplane and just got in it and left for the west coast. Probably not the best idea in a complex airplane like the Aerostar
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I bet he doesn’t have insurance for the aircraft. all cash transaction like he had removes do usual bank requirements for whole insurance.
 
Given his erratic flying in class A after takeoff from Fort Collins, I bet his oxygen system was not working when he thought it was.

Member from the NTSB report; he flew commercial that same day from California to New York, then travel to Jersey shore PA and spent a few hours with the aircraft seller, then flew across the country to Fort Collins with his Destiination of California. It would appear hypoxia mixed with severe fatigue probably caused him to pass out and auger into the ground.
 
NordicDave said:
Given his erratic flying in class A after takeoff from Fort Collins, I bet his oxygen system was not working when he thought it was.

Member from the NTSB report; he flew commercial that same day from California to New York, then travel to Jersey shore PA and spent a few hours with the aircraft seller, then flew across the country to Fort Collins with his Destiination of California. It would appear hypoxia mixed with severe fatigue probably caused him to pass out and auger into the ground.
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Holy smokes. Evidently he was missing the gene that gives people decision making ability.
 
flyingron said:
I was addressing Kenny's statement that "nobody flew a twin on a student pilot." It's not true. There are people who have gotten their private in a twin first.
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The late comedian Danny Kaye was one.

Bob
 
NordicDave said:
Given his erratic flying in class A after takeoff from Fort Collins, I bet his oxygen system was not working when he thought it was.
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Wait. You caught that and I skimmed over it. The FBO saw an O2 bottle. And I assumed the A-Star was pressurized.

Another busted system on that airplane, and he was trying to do it with a bottle at FL220?

It was already in the “play stupid games, win stupid prizes” pile.

This one is getting moved to the “he died doing what he loved” award contenders, barring any complaints from the “don’t speculate until the final report is out” crowd.
 
Bacho said:
How would the line guy be able to look inside and verify ADS-B?
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The line guy described the transponder “with round knobs“. Probably an old King transponder and the line guy assumed the plane didn’t have ADSB, was my guess. The NTSB did confirm the the plane was not ADS-B equipped. I imagine flying across the country; this was a feature for this pilot, as not to be tracked.
 
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You can't look at my plane and determine if it has ADSB or not. There are no knobs or buttons or anything else on the transponder. It's remote into the GPS.
 
NordicDave said:
The line guy described the transponder “with round knobs“. Probably an old King transponder and the line guy assumed the plane didn’t have ADSB, was my guess. The NTSB did confirm the the plane was not ADS-B equipped. I imagine flying across the country; this was a feature for this pilot, as not to be tracked.
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Its just irritating when people state assumptions as fact. Kinda throws out his credibility for all of the other statements he made.
 
Bacho said:
Its just irritating when people state assumptions as fact. Kinda throws out his credibility for all of the other statements he made.
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flyingron said:
You can't look at my plane and determine if it has ADSB or not. There are no knobs or buttons or anything else on the transponder. It's remote into the GPS.
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The NTSB doesn't include transcripts of the interviews. Maybe the lineman noticed an old transponder and had a chat with the pilot about ADS-B requirements for this trip. At at my field, many of the line guys are student pilots.

The bigger tragedy ADS-B issue here is NTSB confirmed the pilot was flying in ruled airspace without ADS-B, especially up in class-A.

The NTSB report could be better written, and to me reads more like a draft. They included the lineman's comments, but didn't finishing joining a point of view towards a conclusion.

The take-away from the report seems like "this pilot was going to kill himself 1 of 12 different ways that afternoon, and this is how it happened".
 
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NordicDave said:
he flew commercial that same day from California to New York, then travel to Jersey shore PA and spent a few hours with the aircraft seller,
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I had to look that one up...I had no idea there was a Jersey Shore, PA, 150 miles inland from the Jersey Shore. But, sure enough...
 
GaryM said:
I had to look that one up...I had no idea there was a Jersey Shore, PA, 150 miles inland from the Jersey Shore. But, sure enough...
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Not that far from Piper
 
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