Culmination of all of your piloting skills

Jaybird180

Final Approach
Joined
Dec 28, 2010
Messages
9,034
Location
Near DC
Display Name

Display name:
Jaybird180
Admittedly, I don't like pattern work. I don't care much for airwork either, but I am fond of steep turns, slips and a stall or few. I really like to go places, get out do stuff then go home. I smile and sleep well when I do that.

With disregard for the above said, what is the one drill (or skill) to practice that polishes the others? Some say pattern work, some say commercial manuevers.

PoA, what say you?

Please also explain why.
 
Last edited:
Engine-out practice. Both abeam the numbers and random times during flight.

It incorporates all of the fundamentals of pattern work but adds in the elements of decision making (picking landing spot), checklists, situational awareness (wind direction/fields), and control of the airplane with stick and rudder.

One tip that a CFI gave me is to chop power completely abeam the numbers for every landing (in a 172 at least). Doesn't always result in a greaser, but it is good practice for getting the feel and sight picture really drilled into your head in case of a real emergency. Also - keeps patterns nice and tight. I normally pull power completely, but still add power when needed. Should probably practice more with no power until stopped.
 
Last edited:
Admittedly, I don't like pattern work. I don't care much for airwork either, but I am fond of steep turns, slips and a stall or few. I really like to go places, get out do stuff then go home. I smile and sleep well when I do that.

With disregard for the above said, what is the one drill (or skill) to practice that polishes the others? Some say pattern work, some say commercial manuevers.

PoA, what say you?

I will ask my new CFI on Sunday. I am going to be doing pattern work at a minimum of three airports, maybe four, all but one of which are very challenging (for a new pilot like me). They are short, narrow, on a slope, and have obstacles. Though in another thread a pilot said go to narrow and wide, long and short, airports - doing all of that will get you to really fly the plane rather than always going to the same type of airport. Lucky for me the ones I'm going to on Sunday are untowered and relatively un-busy.
 
A couple times a year I place my aircraft 4-5K feet above an untrafficed airport, and pull the power. The idea is to stop on the first third of the runway in a full stall landing with full flaps without adding power at any point. Very good exercise in energy management, which is the core of aviation.
 
A couple times a year I place my aircraft 4-5K feet above an untrafficed airport, and pull the power. The idea is to stop on the first third of the runway in a full stall landing with full flaps without adding power at any point. Very good exercise in energy management, which is the core of aviation.

My primary CFI did this with me all the time. Funny I always did really well. I liked it too, very peaceful. He would turn the power back on every once in a while, apparently it is better for the engine.
 
Minimum controllable airspeed, don't let the stall horn turn off for at least 15 minutes. Practice controlling your rate of descent with the throttle while the stall horn screams.
 
first thermal of the year always teaches me how to turn again.
 
Minimum controllable airspeed, don't let the stall horn turn off for at least 15 minutes. Practice controlling your rate of descent with the throttle while the stall horn screams.

I used to kick butt at this but did poorly on the checkride. I remember one lesson I did it so well he kept loading tasks up on me until I failed. Things like turn, climb, descend, read a sectional, navigate, etc. A challenge for sure.

And having that horn go off the whole time is the hardest part.
 
My primary CFI did this with me all the time. Funny I always did really well. I liked it too, very peaceful. He would turn the power back on every once in a while, apparently it is better for the engine.

I put in some power every so often to ensure I can still do so. Nothing worse than turning a simulated emergency into a real one.
 
Culmination of piloting skills is more then your ability to fly the airplane, it's also your ability to manage the flight. Hands on skill comes with time, but the completion of every flight with a minimum of surprises is how I rate my skills.
 
Chop the power on a Pitts on downwind abeam the numbers, roll halfway down the runway on one main gear and the tailwheel, switch to the other main gear for another x thousand feet, and then take off before you hit something you couldn't see because the nose of the airplane was in the way.
 
I think you just keep working on stuff whenever something interesting arises. I'm living proof that you never know what's in the cards if you keep plugging along. I don't know if I've culminated yet, but it has been a great ride.

I shared your attitude for many years. PPL with IR, no other ambitions or desires, and bucket lists hadn't been invented yet. Flew ~500 hours/year chasing investment banking deals. Came home on Friday and parked the airplane, didn't want to see it again until next week. Played golf, roped calves, spent Monday in the office and went flying again the next week.

Flew BFR and/or IPC rides as required. Sometime later my airplane partner (who was by then a CFI) and the local DPE decided I would be a good instructor so they conspired to get me to do the training. Then he decided we should get ATP ratings since we had the plane and might as well do something interesting that would sharpen our skills. Or maybe that was before, not sure of the sequence.

Somewhere along the line I obviously did the commercial ticket too, but don't remember those details either, other than that the CFI and the DPE had totally different ideas about how 8's should be flown. I still don't know, probably never will. So far it hasn't mattered.

Bought bigger, faster, slicker airplanes as the business grew, owned a bunch of them over the years.

Some guy had talked me into getting a multi rating, but didn't fly them much (those available were no faster than my single, burned much more fuel and had dog-shlt panels) and lost interest. Then the business expanded geographically, so I bought some twins. Some good, some bad, some tragic but had to go and GA was better than the airlines, especially to small and mid-market destinations.

With ~9,000 hours in the logbook I was content with my aviation career, other than the POS Aerostar we bought new and that spent most of it's life in the shop.

Then a friend and business consulting client bought a King Air. We needed to be in different places at different times so I started flying the King Air from KC to Columbus, OH where I would drop him off and fly on to Toronto or other places where I was working on acquisition deals. One thing led to another, and one day I woke up in the left seat of a G-V as PIC of a trip enroute from Seattle to Rome.

"Toto, I don't think we're in Kansas any more."
 
Posted TMI. Sorry. No excuse, stone sober.
 
Last edited:
Minimum controllable airspeed, don't let the stall horn turn off for at least 15 minutes.

You've done that? What did your CHT's reach?

Perfect Hammerhead. Though, it's been quite a while.

Now we're talking. :) Such a simple looking maneuver. Most don't appreciate the subtlety and challenge of producing a perfect one.
 
Last edited:
Slow flight from takeoff to landing. Vx climbout. While up there puttering around, none of that classic high speed minimum controllable stuff. Vso+5 maximum, preferably less, if it's not trying to stall on you, you're going too fast.
 
A trip around the traffic pattern encompasses almost everything from slow flight to the full-stall landing. It's a ground reference maneuver, and it can be soft field, short field, you name it.

Slow flight is good practice, but treat your engine nicely. You want it to be nice to you.

I don't know that there's any training silver bullet that encompasses everything.

A good habit to have when you're trying to make the most of your training dollar is to prepare a flight card for your hour or two of flying. Know before you go fly what's intended. Have written down that you'll do steep turns in each direction, three stalls of each kind, fifteen minutes of ground reference, some s-turns, five minutes of transitioning into and out of slow flight, and specific kinds of landings. That's just an example, of course, but if you already have a game plan in mind and stick to it, you can knock out quite a bit in a short time. Rentals are expensive; make the most of your time and money.

Fly with an instructor from time to time. See if the instructor can spot weak areas that need improvement, and concentrate on those. You may be the world's best steep-turner, but may have difficulties with altitude loss in an approach to landing stall. Concentrate on the stall recoveries and slow flight. You may be the world's best at short field landings, but crosswinds may be kicking your butt. Pick the runway that has the most direct crosswind, and go practice on that one.

What you need to do when you fly really depends more on you than anything else. Always try to find your weakest areas and focus on those. Hour for hour, you'll see the most imporvement for your dollar and time if you know before you go fly what your flight card will be, and what your areas that need polishing are. Focus on those, and you'll come out ahead.
 
You've done that? What did your CHT's reach?



Now we're talking. :) Such a simple looking maneuver. Most don't appreciate the subtlety and challenge of producing a perfect one.

Not bad, it usually doesn't take that much power to maintain altitude when light.
 
Good one, does kind of bring is all together.

Short field practice is another good one.


I make every landing an attempt at a short field landing.

I try to pull the power every once in awhile and see if it wants to go in one of the fields I have an eye on. I can tell before I get very low. It's probably one of my big concerns, because the engine going out is something I don't have complete control of.
 
Why would one not make every landing 'short field'? It's a minimum energy landing is all.
 
Why would one not make every landing 'short field'? It's a minimum energy landing is all.

That really depends who you are, where you're flying, what you're flying, why, and when. If you're flying a minimum airspeed approach into a long runway, fully configured, you may not want to do it for fuel issues, noise issues, or because you're flying an instrument approach and don't want to drag it in.

A short field approach isn't the same as a short field landing. One may not want to make the short field configured drag-it-in approach in windshear conditions, and one may find less than full flaps advisable for certain aircraft and certain conditions.
 
That really depends who you are, where you're flying, what you're flying, why, and when. If you're flying a minimum airspeed approach into a long runway, fully configured, you may not want to do it for fuel issues, noise issues, or because you're flying an instrument approach and don't want to drag it in.

A short field approach isn't the same as a short field landing. One may not want to make the short field configured drag-it-in approach in windshear conditions, and one may find less than full flaps advisable for certain aircraft and certain conditions.

This is almost never. One does not have to do a "short field approach" to have ones energy down across the threshold. Short Field landing is about landing with the minimum energy possible. Landing any faster than that is a crutch that adds hazard. Coming across the threshold faster or with reduced flaps just extends the time for energy dissipation and difficulty for the new pilot flying out the flare. It's the causes of bounces and porpoises.
 
A short field approach isn't the same as a short field landing. One may not want to make the short field configured drag-it-in approach in windshear conditions, and one may find less than full flaps advisable for certain aircraft and certain conditions.

I dont know what a "short field approach" is.

:confused:

For every landing, I drop everything, every time, and land at the slowest speed consistent with airplane control.

I was warned on the EVSS that 55 degrees of flaps results in a very steep descent angle. So it does, at 55 KIAS, and I love it!
 
I like to keep up on stall recoveries and engine out procedures. Of course, I also enjoy crosswind landings.
 
I dont know what a "short field approach" is.

:confused:

For every landing, I drop everything, every time, and land at the slowest speed consistent with airplane control.

I was warned on the EVSS that 55 degrees of flaps results in a very steep descent angle. So it does, at 55 KIAS, and I love it!

I'd say a short field approach is maintaining flaps and speed in a configuration which gives you a steeper than normal descent angle, for landing short over an obstacle.

No, you don't need to do a steep approach to land short. Just pull the power earlier and get your airspeed down before you reach the threshold.
 
I'd say a short field approach is maintaining flaps and speed in a configuration which gives you a steeper than normal descent angle, for landing short over an obstacle.

No, you don't need to do a steep approach to land short. Just pull the power earlier and get your airspeed down before you reach the threshold.


Ahh, then I'd call that an "Obstacle Clearance Maneuver."

I think the description above is a "Drag it in" maneuver and I really don't know when/why you'd do that.

A couple of weeks ago at Finleyville I did a short with obstacles -- Trees invade the normal glideslope and displaced threshold is 1/2 way down the 2500' runway. So I maintained my normal approach above the trees, then slipped down to the runway to touch down quite a it sooner than 1200' remaining.
 
He would turn the power back on every once in a while, apparently it is better for the engine.

Kim, it is all about carb ice. The reasons for the "goose" of power are two-fold.

When you are in a power off glide, the potential for carb ice is at or near the max. There is a maximum of pressure differential across the throttle, which means maximum cooling as the air flowing through the carb loses pressure. i.e., max potential for ice.

So your CFI added power to check for ice/make sure the engine was still capable of making power.

Second reason, was to add a little more heat to the exhaust/carb heat air to prevent or remove the ice.

I am skeptical of the second reason. The short goose of power is not likely to have a noticeable change in carb air temperature.

Surely, if the engine responds poorly - i.e., limited/no power available - the pilot response should be full throttle/carb heat on. Get all the heat the engine can produce to raise induction air temperature.

Pipers are less prone to icing than some other airplanes, but they are not immune. I had one possible icing incident on short final on a 80-ish degree humid day. I noticed a slight and growing roughness on short final.
Carb heat on full, land the plane - a non-event. But the engine stalled on touchdown. It started right up... I am sure the problem was carb ice.

-Skip
 
Last edited:
My happiest/proudest moments in aviation aren't what I've done -- it's what my students have done.
 
Yep -- gotta go with that one.

Maybe edited to: Successful outcome after an actual emergency.

Yep, and when it gets down to it; that success is influenced by your knowledge of, and comfort with the very bottom of your energy envelope. Kinetic energy goes up with the square of speed; kinetic energy is the stuff that does damage, the more you have, the more it does.
 
Well, with my emergency the cockpit filled up with smoke, and then the landing gear didnt come down. I used my knowledge of the system and emergency procedures to get the gear down and clear the smoke out. My resolve also helped, because I had large blisters and burns on my hand from the emergency gear handle. The hydraulic pump behind the panel had heated it up to over 215 degrees.
 
Kim, it is all about carb ice. The reasons for the "goose" of power are two-fold.

When you are in a power off glide, the potential for carb ice is at or near the max. There is a maximum of pressure differential across the throttle, which means maximum cooling as the air flowing through the carb loses pressure. i.e., max potential for ice.

So your CFI added power to check for ice/make sure the engine was still capable of making power.

Second reason, was to add a little more heat to the exhaust/carb heat air to prevent or remove the ice.

I am skeptical of the second reason. The short goose of power is not likely to have a noticeable change in carb air temperature.

Surely, if the engine responds poorly - i.e., limited/no power available - the pilot response should be full throttle/carb heat on. Get all the heat the engine can produce to raise induction air temperature.

Pipers are less prone to icing than some other airplanes, but they are not immune. I had one possible icing incident on short final on a 80-ish degree humid day. I noticed a slight and growing roughness on short final.
Carb heat on full, land the plane - a non-event. But the engine stalled on touchdown. It started right up... I am sure the problem was carb ice.

-Skip
When flying carbured planes, I was taught carb heat at initial power reduction in the pattern for this very reason. It was throttle, carb heat, flaps.
 
This is almost never. One does not have to do a "short field approach" to have ones energy down across the threshold. Short Field landing is about landing with the minimum energy possible. Landing any faster than that is a crutch that adds hazard. Coming across the threshold faster or with reduced flaps just extends the time for energy dissipation and difficulty for the new pilot flying out the flare. It's the causes of bounces and porpoises.

This is almost never in the limited circumstances and aircraft which you fly, but it's certainly applicable to a wide variety of aircraft in a wide variety of situations, both big and small.

In some small aircraft, one can afford to get creative and yank power from a normal approach to slow down across the fence, but in many aircraft in many circumstances, one is best configured and on speed for the approach. It's almost axiomatic that a good approach can lead to a good landing, but a bad approach often does not.

Reduced flaps is not the cause for bounces and porpoises. Poor piloting does that.

Exces speed is not the cause for bounces and porpoises. Poor piloting, again. Sometimes it's best not to try to salvage a bad landing; go-arounds still work.

If one is going to land normally, approach normally. If one is going to land short, then approach as though one is doing a short field landing. This may or may not mean approaching high, but you'll find that nearly all aircraft flight manuals provide approach speeds and configurations applicable to short field or soft field landings, and these generally differ from a normal approach.

Flying with less than full flaps is sometimes advisable in conventional gear airplanes, often in gusting conditions, especially in wind shear conditions. It may be preferable in a crosswind, too.

A short field landing is not about landing with minimum energy. It's about landing with minimum distance. There's a big difference. Particularly that it's about landing with the minimum distance, given the prevailing conditions (landing weight, weather, winds, density altitude, etc).

The larger and more complex the airplane, in many cases, the more the cheating one can get away with in light airplanes goes out the window. It doesn't need to be an airbus or a boeing. Moving to a Twin Commander from a 310 can make a difference, as can moving to a 210 from a 152.

Approaching as slow as one can and landing as slowly as one can isn't the be-all and end-all of a short field landing.

One also needs to realize that in many cases, truly short fields are often soft, and soft fields are often short, and in both situations, the fields are often bounded by obstacles. The customarily taught method of short field approaches involving dragging the airplane to 50', pushing over an obstacle, then landing with maximum braking is fine in a texbook, but poor practice in most cases in the real world.

Other factors often come into planning for a short field landing (including the approach) such as early gear extension for brake cooling (including preparing the brakes for a short field landing by pre-cooling them, or cooling them after a short flight), and techniques such as raising the flaps upon landing to put more weight on the wheels for adequate braking, or to reduce flap damage from loose or rough surfaces. These aren't simply things one does at the last minute. One may begin preparing for that short field landing in the descent phase of the flight.

Well, with my emergency the cockpit filled up with smoke, and then the landing gear didnt come down. I used my knowledge of the system and emergency procedures to get the gear down and clear the smoke out. My resolve also helped, because I had large blisters and burns on my hand from the emergency gear handle.

Did you learn the wisdom of carrying a pair of gloves in your flight bag?

When you are in a power off glide, the potential for carb ice is at or near the max. There is a maximum of pressure differential across the throttle, which means maximum cooling as the air flowing through the carb loses pressure. i.e., max potential for ice.

Yes, and no. You have an increased potential for icing across the throttle plate of the idle jet, but this isn't a factor once the throttle is opened. The greatest drop in pressure and the greatest temperature drop occurs at higher throttle settings, with greater airflow. It's also the biggest threat to interrupted engine operation.

A failed engine during a power-off descent may not be easy to recognize. In big-tailed twins like the Twin Commander, it may not even be felt in the rudder pedals or seen on the inclinometer (skid ball). Increasing power occasionally helps assure that power is still there, but it also transfers fuel feed from the idle jet to the main jet in the carb. There are multiple kinds of carburetor icing.

I dont know what a "short field approach" is.

:confused:

For every landing, I drop everything, every time, and land at the slowest speed consistent with airplane control.

I was warned on the EVSS that 55 degrees of flaps results in a very steep descent angle. So it does, at 55 KIAS, and I love it!

Again, you can get away with it in a light airplane, depending on the model, in many cases. In time, you may learn to tailor your technique and practice to the conditions the aircraft, and other factors. Simply because you do it that way in one aircraft doesn't mean you can or should in others.

As an example, in a Cessna 150 with electric flaps, you can land at flaps 40, and it makes a nice, short field landing. If you have a problem with a flap microswitch or the flap motor, however, you may not be able to retract those flaps. If you need to go around, you'll be doing so at flaps 40 which may give very poor climb performance. If you experience an engine failure during that process, especially while beginning the climb from a slow approach speed, you may lose your energy very quickly, and find yourself in a bit of a pickle.

I departed Eagle once in a Piaggio Avanti with an inexperienced pilot. During his briefing, I asked about his intentions with a problem, such as a partially retracted landing gear. He wasn't sure, but given icing conditions and weather in the area, we talked about the wisdom of trying to climb out IMC with a gear problem, given the potential for an engine-loss. He could do it with the gear handing out, but what if he lost an engine after that? He would be stacking the accident chain against himself, having already approved the weak link.

As it turned out, the gear failed to retract (the only time I ever saw that happen in the P180, in a thousand hours in the airplane). We later determined that it was likely ice on a microswitch, but sure enough after takeoff, the gear failed to indicate up, and the gear stopped part-way up. I mention this as an example of things one ought to consider: we don't plan what we do around everything working perfectly. We plan for what may go wrong. Landing with full flaps is such an example, in some aircraft. One may not be able to retract the flaps, and that could lead to a very serious problem.

One could be flying a light twin with reverse capability, such as a King Air 90. One may have additional tools at one's disposal other than brakes, for stopping, and for making a short landing. Dragging the airplane in may not be advisable or necessary.

One may be operating in an area with much faster traffic, and ATC may want you to keep your speed up, but get off the runway as soon as practical. Dragging the airplane in may not work. The Piaggio was a good example; ATC had us at airliner speeds for much of the approach, slowing and getting stopped as soon as we could, in close. We could do it because of the capabilities of the aircraft, but that's not true of all aircraft, or even all light aircraft. It's also not appropriate for all pilots flying the same type of aircraft: what's in your comfort zone may not be in another's.

Some emergencies represent a culmination of skills; others represent the conclusion of one's skill-building time. It's the last time.

Be very careful of learning experiences that stem from emergencies you create. These aren't necessary to learn: it's far better to learn before the emergency develops.
 
Well, with my emergency the cockpit filled up with smoke, and then the landing gear didnt come down. I used my knowledge of the system and emergency procedures to get the gear down and clear the smoke out. My resolve also helped, because I had large blisters and burns on my hand from the emergency gear handle. The hydraulic pump behind the panel had heated it up to over 215 degrees.

I would have landed it on the belly. A controlled belly in doesn't get people hurt.
 
Back
Top