Do you loan out your airplane?

John Baker

John Baker

Final Approach
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Oct 4, 2008
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San Diego, California
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Display name:
John Baker
I let my flight instructor use my Warrior pretty much anytime he wants, all I ask is that he leave the plane as he found it, gas, oil, etc. He does not take advantage of this, and uses it rarely. We are both older guys. My medical expired three days after I passed my check ride and I am waiting for the FAA's decision on it.

I have a few minor medical issues that had required a bunch of hospital level tests and work ups, which I did, and am now waiting for my certificate. So I have to fly with my instructor. He does not charge me, so we both get air time. I feel letting him use my plane is the right thing to do.

So, my question is, do any of you guys loan out your airplanes, and why?

John
 
I would, under the right circumstances.
The "loanee" would obviously be someone I trusted with that plane, and would be named on my insurance policy.
Other than that, I can't think of anyone I'd loan it to.
 
I let my CFI borrow my Aztec so he could get his MEI and teach me to fly it. :)

While I'm getting someone trained to fly my Aztec, I won't let just anyone borrow it. Primary reason is because I take care of it the way I do, and anyone who flies it I want to make sure takes care of it the way I do, too.
 
my students let me borrow their 150 from time to time which i really appreciate. i've only used it twice in 2 years.

Kim let me fly the bird dog without her a few times. what was she thinking!?!?

a friend started letting me borrow his glider last year. that was really neat. neat glider too.

i let pete fly my glider in september.
 
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I don't own - but if I did - there are numerous people on PoA I would trust to loan it.
 
I went 35 years between getting my PPL and getting my biennial review. during that time, I had never considered that an airplane could be borrowed. My perception was that one had to be Rented.

To think I could have kept current simply by borrowing airplanes, wow, I've missed out!

Now an owner, I still can't perceive the concept of loaning it out...
 
Yes I have, when I had my first 150 I let a friend of mine use it for lessons, but he was a named pilot, plus he had a non owners policy. I loaned my 172 to a friend so he and his partner could fly to Tulsa and pick up their 182 from an avionics shop.

I let my A&P fly it whenever he wanted, I figured if he was flying it, he would be pickier on things!
 
You really need to have your insurance ducks in a row to to this. If I did this, I'd even go so far as setting up and LLC.
 
Yes, to a local instructor friend with 30k+ hours as an ag pilot - but he's on the insurance and we stipulate NO PRIMARY TRAINING to be conducted. The airplane is a creampuff and it needs to stay that way. He just bought an old 152 for primary students.

Actually, that brings a thought to mind - if the aircraft is borrowed without compensation, can an instructor use it for paid training without ensuring the aircraft has 100 hour inspections? In other words, can an aircraft be "borrowed" to perform a commercial activity by a commercial pilot?
 
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dmccormack said:
I'm shocked. :eek:

Not really. :rolleyes2:
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Do what you want with your property, I honestly could care less. Can't figure out why you would care anything about mine. I pay out the nose to keep my airplane cherry. No way am I loaning it out to some moocher for free.

Actually, I don't have the potential legal and financial hassles of someone auguring into a schoolyard full of kids with my aircraft, since it's in an LLC. I hope those of you who loan out your aircraft have done likewise. I wouldn't ask my least favorite person to take that level of exposure for me.
 
steingar said:
Do what you want with your property, I honestly could care less. Can't figure out why you would care anything about mine. I pay out the nose to keep my airplane cherry. No way am I loaning it out to some moocher for free.
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Let's see -- where did you get your cherry airplane again?
 
steingar said:
Do what you want with your property, I honestly could care less. Can't figure out why you would care anything about mine. I pay out the nose to keep my airplane cherry. No way am I loaning it out to some moocher for free.

Actually, I don't have the potential legal and financial hassles of someone auguring into a schoolyard full of kids with my aircraft, since it's in an LLC. I hope those of you who loan out your aircraft have done likewise. I wouldn't ask my least favorite person to take that level of exposure for me.
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Don't hold it in....
Let us know how you really feel.:thumbsup:

Sheesh.
 
dmccormack said:
Let's see -- where did you get your cherry airplane again?
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Let me get this right, you think that because I won the Free Bird, I should be happy to loan it out to random freeloaders? Have I got that right?

It's not like I pay for hangar, maintenance, insurance, and all those other assorted goodies. It's not like I paid more in taxes than a lot of airplanes are worth.

However, despite all these facts I have used the FreeBird and my own meager talents to pay forward and support the EAA (the guys who awarded it to me in the first place) in its mission more times than I could easily count.

But despite all that, I can't figure out why you would give a rat's six about how someone else uses their property. I was asked a question and gave an honest answer.
 
dmccormack said:
I'm shocked. :eek:
















Not really. :rolleyes2:
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Hey, come on, it's a Cherokee! That's a complicated aircraft that not just anyone can fly.

Funny thing, the last Cherokee I flew (a very nice, very pretty one that she'd put a ton of money into) I flew unwillingly when my friend who owned it, having never previously observed me pilot any aircraft, threw me the keys and said "Go take [a person who'd never been in a small plane before] flying!"

It was a horrifying experience. I started the engine and... THERE WASN'T A SECOND ONE TO START! I didn't know what to do with so few levers! :cryin: :hairraise: :cornut:
 
steingar said:
Let me get this right, you think that because I won the Free Bird, I should be happy to loan it out to random freeloaders? Have I got that right?

It's not like I pay for hangar, maintenance, insurance, and all those other assorted goodies. It's not like I paid more in taxes than a lot of airplanes are worth.

However, despite all these facts I have used the FreeBird and my own meager talents to pay forward and support the EAA (the guys who awarded it to me in the first place) in its mission more times than I could easily count.

But despite all that, I can't figure out why you would give a rat's six about how someone else uses their property. I was asked a question and gave an honest answer.
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That's fine, Michael. You are free to do whatever you like.

But those I've lent my airplane to and airplanes that I've borrowed have not been "moocher" transactions.

They've been exchanges between trusting friends.
 
airguy said:
if the aircraft is borrowed without compensation, can an instructor use it for paid training without ensuring the aircraft has 100 hour inspections? In other words, can an aircraft be "borrowed" to perform a commercial activity by a commercial pilot?
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If the instructor "borrows" the plane in order to give a lesson, it seems to me that it is the instructor, not the student, who is "provides" the plane for the instruction. If that's so,then 91.409(b) would seem to require a 100-hour inspection:


(b) Except as provided in paragraph (c) of this section, no person may operate an aircraft carrying any person (other than a crewmember) for hire, and no person may give flight instruction for hire in an aircraft which that person provides, unless within the preceding 100 hours of time in service the aircraft has received an annual or 100-hour inspection and been approved for return to service in accordance with part 43 of this chapter or has received an inspection for the issuance of an airworthiness certificate in accordance with part 21 of this chapter.
 
steingar said:
Let me get this right, you think that because I won the Free Bird, I should be happy to loan it out to random freeloaders? Have I got that right?

It's not like I pay for hangar, maintenance, insurance, and all those other assorted goodies. It's not like I paid more in taxes than a lot of airplanes are worth.

However, despite all these facts I have used the FreeBird and my own meager talents to pay forward and support the EAA (the guys who awarded it to me in the first place) in its mission more times than I could easily count.

But despite all that, I can't figure out why you would give a rat's six about how someone else uses their property. I was asked a question and gave an honest answer.
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LOL, I agree I would not loan mine out either. I do find it funny though that you got a free plane and try to put down others b/c your "taxes" are more than their plane cost. LMMFAO
 
Ted DuPuis said:
Hey, come on, it's a Cherokee! That's a complicated aircraft that not just anyone can fly.

Funny thing, the last Cherokee I flew (a very nice, very pretty one that she'd put a ton of money into) I flew unwillingly when my friend who owned it, having never previously observed me pilot any aircraft, threw me the keys and said "Go take [a person who'd never been in a small plane before] flying!"

It was a horrifying experience. I started the engine and... THERE WASN'T A SECOND ONE TO START! I didn't know what to do with so few levers! :cryin: :hairraise: :cornut:
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It isn't that I think it's a technically sophisticated thing or anything. First, I am very particular about my aircraft, and I think it shows. Second, even though it's in an LLC, if someone fraks up badly enough in it, that could wind up being insufficient protection. Airplanes are lightening rods for lawsuits, and we all know it. Last, if someone really wants to go flying, there are lots of aircraft for rent or sale. Sorry that my feelings about this are fairly strong, but they are.
 
dmccormack said:
Ok, I gotta take you flying in the Chief.

There are no buttons and very few gauges.

Oh -- and you have to hand prop it (no keys)

:D
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It sounds like a horrific experience, I don't know what I'd do. :hairraise:

You're on! We should find a time to go flying. A few weeks ago I got to fly a J-3 on floats and loved it. Would love to get some time in an old tailwheel. Those old airplanes are where real stick and rudder is at. :)

steingar said:
It isn't that I think it's a technically sophisticated thing or anything. First, I am very particular about my aircraft, and I think it shows. Second, even though it's in an LLC, if someone fraks up badly enough in it, that could wind up being insufficient protection. Airplanes are lightening rods for lawsuits, and we all know it. Last, if someone really wants to go flying, there are lots of aircraft for rent or sale. Sorry that my feelings about this are fairly strong, but they are.
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You apparently missed my smileys, and the fact that I also stated I don't loan my aircraft out, either, and my reasons why. Jerking your chain, remember? :D
 
dennyleeb said:
LOL, I agree I would not loan mine out either. I do find it funny though that you got a free plane and try to put down others b/c your "taxes" are more than their plane cost. LMMFAO
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All I was saying is my situation is more complex than "hey, the guy got a free airplane". Nothing in aviation is free. I wasn't trying to put anyone down at all. Sorry you read it that way.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
You apparently missed my smileys, and the fact that I also stated I don't loan my aircraft out, either, and my reasons why. Jerking your chain, remember? :D
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Heck, I'm so clueless I didn't even realize it was you. You keep changing your blasted avatar.
 
steingar said:
Heck, I'm so clueless I didn't even realize it was you. You keep changing your blasted avatar.
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First change in about 15 months. But I'm still iFlyTwins. I thought about changing it to "iFreezeTwins" to match the picture of the 310, parked on ice with sleeping bags over the engines and extension cords for the Tanis heaters sticking out of the cowls in -20C weather. :D
 
I don't loan mine out for several reasons.

1)liability
2)I like mine flown a certain way and I would worry it would not be flown the way. It would hurt my peace of mind. (safety)
3)It cost me money to fly my plane besides fuel. (engine time, 50 hr etc.)
4)It would not be there if for some reason I wanted to fly it
 
steingar said:
It isn't that I think it's a technically sophisticated thing or anything. First, I am very particular about my aircraft, and I think it shows. Second, even though it's in an LLC, if someone fraks up badly enough in it, that could wind up being insufficient protection. Airplanes are lightening rods for lawsuits, and we all know it. Last, if someone really wants to go flying, there are lots of aircraft for rent or sale. Sorry that my feelings about this are fairly strong, but they are.
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Everything is a lightning rod for a lawsuit if you have assets worth taking.
 
My answer is: I never have, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't, to the right person, under the right circumstances. Normally they would have to be named on my policy too, but as I understand it the OPW is just as good as named pilot, so I don't see that it would really matter if they met the OPW.

But either way, they would have to be someone I trust implicitly.

And I don't know anyone who is still flying that I have that level of trust in.
 
For the people who don't want to loan out their airplane because of liability, how do you feel about lending our your car?

I've never had an airplane to lend but I'm pretty sure I've never borrowed one. I think I would feel strange about that.

I did let someone borrow my Jeep recently while his own vehicle was in the shop... after he rear ended someone. :eek:
 
dennyleeb said:
LOL, I agree I would not loan mine out either. I do find it funny though that you got a free plane and try to put down others b/c your "taxes" are more than their plane cost. LMMFAO
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Wouldn't take too much for his taxes to be worth more than my plane, for sure.

There is this one guy who has asked to borrow it a few times to "finish up" his ppl.
Had to politely decline, each time.
Nuttin' personal, no need to get all snotty. Just had to decline.
I did have to pay $866.65 in sales taxes though. :wink2:
 
I have loaned both my airplanes to my next door neighbor and he's on the policy for each. For the Baron I usually ask for about what my total costs per hour run, for the Porterfield just gas.
 
Good Friends share things, airplanes are replaceable, good friends are not.

I care for a couple aircraft for the use of them. I put 12 hours on 1 and nothing on the other last year, I leave them as I found them I always ask If I can use it, and I will fix anything that goes wrong, and if It gets totaled while I'm Flying it, I'll pay the deductible, and then we will talk about other things.
 
Tom-D said:
Good Friends share things, airplanes are replaceable, good friends are not.

I care for a couple aircraft for the use of them. I put 12 hours on 1 and nothing on the other last year, I leave them as I found them I always ask If I can use it, and I will fix anything that goes wrong, and if It gets totaled while I'm Flying it, I'll pay the deductible, and then we will talk about other things.
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Well said -- precisely my view.

:thumbsup:
 
tonycondon said:
i let pete fly my glider in september.
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I still suprised I conned Tony into that :)

I'd loan my plane to the right people in the right circumstances. Tony can fly the Ka-6 any time. I've been talking to some of my gliderbuddies I trust at our club about swapping rides. Again I know them and they are good pilots.
 
vontresc said:
I still suprised I conned Tony into that :)

I'd loan my plane to the right people in the right circumstances. Tony can fly the Ka-6 any time. I've been talking to some of my gliderbuddies I trust at our club about swapping rides. Again I know them and they are good pilots.
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sweet i'll take it from may to september next year. thanks!
 
Tom-D said:
Good Friends share things, airplanes are replaceable, good friends are not.

I care for a couple aircraft for the use of them. I put 12 hours on 1 and nothing on the other last year, I leave them as I found them I always ask If I can use it, and I will fix anything that goes wrong, and if It gets totaled while I'm Flying it, I'll pay the deductible, and then we will talk about other things.
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If someone doesn't want to be my pal because I don't want to lend them my aircraft they weren't really my pal to begin with.

Another poster asked if I (or anyone who didn't lend aircraft) would lend out a car. The funny thing is I'll lend out my car in a heartbeat.
 
jesse said:
Everything is a lightning rod for a lawsuit if you have assets worth taking.
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Something special about aviation in this regard. Keep in mind that the only limitation to filing a lawsuit ever passed is limits against suing airplane manufacturers (not that it's doing any good, but hopefully you see my point).
 
steingar said:
If someone doesn't want to be my pal because I don't want to lend them my aircraft they weren't really my pal to begin with.

pals usually aren't really true friends

Another poster asked if I (or anyone who didn't lend aircraft) would lend out a car. The funny thing is I'll lend out my car in a heartbeat.
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I rather lend them my gun, at least I'd know what they are going to do with it.
 
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