Living in an Airpark?

AuntPeggy

AuntPeggy

Final Approach
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Namaste
Hubby and I are seriously looking for a new home in Oklahoma. One possibility is an airpark within a few miles of one of the kids. So, another threads says that living on an airpark is HOA on steriods. My question, what are the downsides to living in an airpark? I know the benefits: walk to the airplane from the house.
 
i think it ranges from a community of reasonable airplane minded people who like to have fun to a bunch of nazi's. buyer beware i suppose.

the more i read the more i see the value in buying some land and having a runway all to myself.
 
Living on an airpark is sort of like having partners in an airplane.
 
Unless it's full of people you like, with similar kinds of aircraft and goals, AND you plan to live out your days there, I wouldn't do the airpark thing. It's just too limited of a market to sell your home in the future should you need to move or unload the asset.
 
There seems to be a tremendous range from older more established communities such as Spruce Creek to new developments with a developer who just puts in a sod runway behind some 'estate' lots and calls it an airpark without much thought about further governance.

If you go for this, make sure to do your due dilligence on all the actors involved. Have a local legal research firm check court records on the developer, the board members, the HOA, the neighbours.....

There are a couple of airparks (Crest is probably the worst) where people in aggregate spend more money on lawyer bills than Avgas.

I ran accross one local proposed airpark a couple of years ago. Nice plat, all the legwork with permitting etc. was already done. I somehow never managed to get hold of the developer. Turns out he had died under suspicious circumstances while under investigation for drug trafficking. His partners in the venture had gone to federal prison......
 
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And yet you still wonder about that gray crown vic with all the antennae that seems to always be in your neighborhood . . .
weilke said:
There seems to be a tremendous range from older more established communities such as Spruce Creek to new developments with a developer who just puts in a sod runway behind some 'estate' lots and calls it an airpark without much thought about further governance.

If you go for this, make sure to do your due dilligence on all the actors involved. Have a local legal research firm check court records on the developer, the board members, the HOA, the neighbours.....

There are a couple of airparks (Crest is probably the worst) where people in aggregate spend more money on lawyer bills than Avgas.

I ran accross one local proposed airpark a couple of years ago. Nice plat, all the legwork with permitting etc. was already done. I somehow never managed to get hold of the developer. Turns out he had died under suspicious circumstances while under investigation for drug trafficking. His partners in the venture had gone to federal prison......
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TangoWhiskey said:
Unless it's full of people you like, with similar kinds of aircraft and goals, AND you plan to live out your days there, I wouldn't do the airpark thing. It's just too limited of a market to sell your home in the future should you need to move or unload the asset.
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weilke said:
There seems to be a tremendous range from older more established communities such as Spruce Creek to new developments with a developer who just puts in a sod runway behind some 'estate' lots and calls it an airpark without much thought about further governance.

If you go for this, make sure to do your due dilligence on all the actors involved. Have a local legal research firm check court records on the developer, the board members, the HOA, the neighbours.....

There are a couple of airparks (Crest is probably the worst) where people in aggregate spend more money on lawyer bills than Avgas.

I ran accross one local proposed airpark a couple of years ago. Nice plat, all the legwork with permitting etc. was already done. I somehow never managed to get hold of the developer. Turns out he had died under suspicious circumstances while under investigation for drug trafficking. His partners in the venture had gone to federal prison......
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We spoke to the airport manager, who seemed nice. We're planning to fly out to Oklahoma to burn in the new engine and he said we can leave the plane there. The place was established at least 40 years ago when my oldest son was a baby. Back in those days, my first husband was a friend of one of the owners. Quite possibly he was friends with all of them. There's a potential problem. Maybe not, though, as we have a relatively peaceful relationship.

Where do you find a research firm to check out the neighbors? I'm trying to find out about easements, restrictions, but the realtor isn't being very helpful. She'd rather sell us something much more expensive.

As far as unloading it, we'll leave it to our estate to figure that out.
 
wabower said:
And yet you still wonder about that gray crown vic with all the antennae that seems to always be in your neighborhood . . .
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No. Those guys are from the TSA. Two weeks ago, I committed the crime of having ticketing switch first and middle name on my wifes ticket for an international flight on the day of departure. The good news is we had an airmarshal to help us babysit the kids during the flight ;).
 
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AuntPeggy said:
Back in those days, my first husband was a friend of one of the owners. Quite possibly he was friends with all of them. There's a potential problem. Maybe not, though, as we have a relatively peaceful relationship.
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Lol, now THAT sounds like a potential issue.

Where do you find a research firm to check out the neighbors? I'm trying to find out about easements, restrictions, but the realtor isn't being very helpful.
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The easements and restrictive covenants should be available wherever the deeds are registered in Oklahoma. Don't know whether they are available to anyone interested or whether you have to be an interested party of some sort. This is stuff a realtor should have in their file on a particular property, you may not get your commissions worth here.

If you have the time to dig through some public tax and property records, you should be able to get most of the information you need yourself. Court records (at least names of parties) are often available on the court system website. Also, get copies of the last couple of years HOA meeting minutes. If there is litigation going on, the minutes should reflect that (e.g. through approval of legal fees etc.).
 
Read the covenants, If you don't like them, don't buy.
 
I lived on an airpark as a kid for about 10 years. My folks still live there. I'd say that it was no worse than any other HOA. There was drama, but never any lawsuits.

My current neighborhood has been in a lawsuit for over 10 years, so I'm not sure the unpleasantness is limited to airparks.

I think the aviation community is well worth the minor headaches. There is always someone who has the tool you need, or has experience fixing whatever you are working on. And there is plenty of hangar flying.
 
Public or Privately owned? E45, Pine Mountain Lake, wanted an AWOS. Feds said no to funding one since the airport was re-classified as an airpark due to limited through-the-fence access for the public.
 
You might want to contact Jeb Burnside from Aviation Safety Magazine / Uncontrolled Airspace Podcast for his take on it. He's been living on an airpark near Sarasota, FL for a little over a year now.
 
TangoWhiskey said:
Unless it's full of people you like, with similar kinds of aircraft and goals, AND you plan to live out your days there, I wouldn't do the airpark thing. It's just too limited of a market to sell your home in the future should you need to move or unload the asset.
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+1... especially if you find after a few years you really don't like it (meaning the specific location/people/etc) all that much.
 
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AuntPeggy said:
Where do you find a research firm to check out the neighbors? I'm trying to find out about easements, restrictions, but the realtor isn't being very helpful. She'd rather sell us something much more expensive.
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Check and see if the county assessor has a website. If so, you can find out assessed values, if taxes are current, and sometimes sales data. If you want the codes, covenants and restrictions, ask the association. If they know you're interested, they shouldn't have any problem giving you a copy.

As far as unloading it, we'll leave it to our estate to figure that out.
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Ability to get a medical certificate doesn't last forever. Would you still want to live there if you, your hubby or both had to stop flying?
 
I know people at most of the Airparks around here. I intend to be on one of them in a few years. The typical attitude will vary substantially depending on which one you are considering. Some have a mix of older, run-down hangars and new hangars, and the occasional junky lot. At those, no one is going to care what you do. At the nicer airparks, there will be rules of course, but I've never known of any fights that erupted due to those rules, and I know a lot of pilots at airparks around here, and discuss these things with them because I intend to be on one of them in the future.

It can be like an HOA, but I'd say that is the exception around here. Most are pretty easy to get along with. If you have concerns, I'd recommend asking several people about any problems or issues they've had with occupants or neighbors in the last 10 years. Of course there are issues, but almost all that I know of are neighbor vs. neighbor, typical stuff that occasionally happens in any neighborhood. On average though, I'd say I'll get along better with people at an airpark around here than with the typical neighbor...and I'm good friends with several neighbors. Don't have any enemies where I live.

PM me if you have a specific question, I might be able to help since I know most of the air parks around here.
 
I would suggest
1. Check the CC&Rs to determine if you can accept and abide with them.
Ditto for the fees and asessments

2. Observe the runway environment. Is it an easy strip with clear approaches, long enough, lit at night, is it aligned with the prevailing wind
etc. Who owns the runway--the residents or the HOA

3. Check the court records for any litigation concerning the airpark. HOA against resident, resident against HOA, resident against resident, etc.

4. Question current residents on their opinions concerning their neighbors, the HOA, the airpark in general. Question enough people so you get both sides of any issue.

5. If possible lease with option to buy. If the airpark turns out to be a ball of snakes you can cut your losses.

Good luck

Paul
N1431A
2AZ1
www.indianhillsairpark.com
 
I must have missed it. What's "HOA"?

Wells
 
Anthony said:
And some of them are De Debil and some of them work. Choose wisely.
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Yeah. We are in a PUD (Planned Unit Development) with an HOA. So far, we've had no issues. We had to get the deck and initial landscaping "approved", but it was a non-issue. There are a couple of rules I don't necessarily agree with, but am willing to put up with in order to make sure that the overall character and quality are maintained. The only time I've called in a coplaint was when a neighbor abandoned the property and the weeds that were ostensibly the lawn were over a foot. It was taken care of.
 
Uh oh.

http://tinyurl.com/pure-madness111

IMG_1485.JPG
 
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AuntPeggy said:
As far as unloading it, we'll leave it to our estate to figure that out.
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Hate to be negative, but maybe maybe not. You may need to sell it to move into an "assisted living" community. Old age isn't always kind and you don't always die when you think you should or when it would be "optimum" for you.

Luckily my sister is in that business and she found our folks a really nice place near her.

As far as airparks themselves are concerned, they're all different. Perhaps the ones that are managed by a "non owner" company and have a rule book that looks like a city charter are the most stable. Someone mentioned Spruce Creek which is a major development, there is another in Jupiter FL that is 5-12 acre mini ranches surrounding a core of airpark homes and a runway. I knew a couple of people who lived there both airplane people and horse people, and they liked it just fine, didn't seem to have problems. It all kinda depends on the community of people who are there at any given time, and the entire atmosphere can change with the change of occupancy of one residence.

So it's pretty much a crap shoot where even if all the technical issues work out fine, the social dynamic may suck or OTOH the technical issues may be wishy washy but nobody cares and everyone hangs out in each others hangars.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
Congratulations, Richard! :goofy:

I'm officially jealous. :yes:
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Well we're not there yet. Still deciding if we're crazy enough.

It's just four houses on a tenancy in common airstrip. No HOA, no nothing. $500 buys your share of the bushhog.
 
alaskaflyer said:
Well we're not there yet. Still deciding if we're crazy enough.

It's just four houses on a tenancy in common airstrip. No HOA, no nothing. $500 buys your share of the bushhog.
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Im guessing this scenario is not the typical airpark in the lower 48.. justahunch...
 
I've never liked HOAs, have never owned anything that had such BS attached to it. It's bad enough having to deal with local governments as it is without adding another one. Buy a house where you make the rules, not someone else. Drive to the airport. You'll sleep better, it's quieter on weekends.

John
 
I've never liked HOAs, have never owned anything that had such BS attached to it. It's bad enough having to deal with local governments as it is without adding another one. Buy a house where you make the rules, not someone else. Drive to the airport. You'll sleep better, it's quieter on weekends.


I have to completely disagree. The noise is airplane noise. Where are we going to fly out to today? No loud Rap stereos, no police sirens. no loud neighbors, just some airplane noise.

I Hear a plane taking off and I run to the kitchen window and look out--Who is it--is it Roger or Wayne--No Steve has his new airplane up this morning. Wow ! Time to open the hangar door and go flying.

Yes the HOA is a PITA. But all in all it's worth it. I can walk out to my hangar in 10 seconds, I can be doing my preflight in another 10 seconds.:thumbsup:

Yeah there are some disadvantages. If you make such a squeeker that the tires don't even chirp no one notices. But just drop it in and everyone will be watching:eek:

But wait it was that way at the airport that I was hangared at before we moved to an airpark.:confused:

Just do your homework to make sure that the airpark is the right one for you and you'll love it.

Cheers:

Paul
N1431A
2AZ1
www.indianhillsairpark.com
 
And especially attractive if you only have to drive 60 miles to the nearest Walmart?

pmanton said:
I've never liked HOAs, have never owned anything that had such BS attached to it. It's bad enough having to deal with local governments as it is without adding another one. Buy a house where you make the rules, not someone else. Drive to the airport. You'll sleep better, it's quieter on weekends.


I have to completely disagree. The noise is airplane noise. Where are we going to fly out to today? No loud Rap stereos, no police sirens. no loud neighbors, just some airplane noise.

I Hear a plane taking off and I run to the kitchen window and look out--Who is it--is it Roger or Wayne--No Steve has his new airplane up this morning. Wow ! Time to open the hangar door and go flying.

Yes the HOA is a PITA. But all in all it's worth it. I can walk out to my hangar in 10 seconds, I can be doing my preflight in another 10 seconds.:thumbsup:

Yeah there are some disadvantages. If you make such a squeeker that the tires don't even chirp no one notices. But just drop it in and everyone will be watching:eek:

But wait it was that way at the airport that I was hangared at before we moved to an airpark.:confused:

Just do your homework to make sure that the airpark is the right one for you and you'll love it.

Cheers:

Paul
N1431A
2AZ1
www.indianhillsairpark.com
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And especially attractive if you only have to drive 60 miles to the nearest Walmart?

Who drives? Jump in the plane and land at Parker, AZ a hop & a skip and a short walk to Walmart, Safeway, & other interesting attractions.

Paul
N1431A
 
I don't shop at Walmart but if I did I'd have to drive 123 miles give or take.

Does that mean living on an airstrip makes more, or less, sense?
 
alaskaflyer said:
Well we're not there yet. Still deciding if we're crazy enough.

It's just four houses on a tenancy in common airstrip. No HOA, no nothing. $500 buys your share of the bushhog.
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Allow me to be of assistance.


DO IT MAN WHAT ARE YOU, NUTS? WHAT ARE YOU WAITING FOR?????? DO IT!!!!! LIVE THE DREAM, SEIZE THE DAY!!!
 
We just made an offer.
 

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That seems to be a common lament among airplane owners. Most financial advisors just tell them to keep on working and hope prices come down until they can afford to shop there.

alaskaflyer said:
I don't shop at Walmart but if I did I'd have to drive 123 miles give or take.

Does that mean living on an airstrip makes more, or less, sense?
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I'm guessing it probably makes as much sense now as it ever did.:D
 
Well our borough is the approximate size of Maryland and has 1800 or so people living in it. Our official census density is 0 people per sq. mi. I guess it makes as much sense here as anywhere :)
 
flyingcheesehead said:
Congratulations! On both the airpark, and leaving the craziness that is the Northeast. ;)
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It will take awhile to settle our affairs here, retire, and get the NY house sold. In the meantime, the kids have already found a renter for the airpark house and a buyer for the house in Tulsa that we had originally planned to move back into.
It looks like you'll just taxi across 126th and then you're on the runway?
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Right! Hubby stated he could land in the backyard, but the airport manager said please don't.
So, I'll look left, then right, then left again for cars before driving my plane to the airport or driving it back home.
 
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