EFB compatible GPS

Chad Phillips

Chad Phillips

Filing Flight Plan
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Jul 26, 2016
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Chad
Student pilot here, wanting to get a Foreflight compatible GPS. Can someone suggest the CHEAPEST way to go about this? I have read about the XGPS150A, anyone have any reviews on that? Or have a better option? Or why or why not to go with this one. ANY helpful insights.
 
Get an iPad with cellular capability and don't bother with an external GPS. You need not purchase cellular service.
 
I have an ipad with Cellular service. I was under the impression that i wouldnt be able to count on that in the cockpit? is that not true? i know some areas im driving through doesn't get any cellular signal, and i plan to be flying through those areas(mainly because of mountains and such). So being up in the air i dont have to worry about dropping signal?
 
You won't get updated WX or other info with no cellular service, but Foreflight itself doesn't require a signal to function. The maps are all loaded.

The internal GPS in the cell-enabled Ipad works perfectly fine, if that's what you're asking. I use it with no issues.
 
It will likely lose the cellular signal in the air, but will continue to receive gps signals.
 
Why wouldn't you just buy a used stratus,which is meant to drive foreflight?
 
stratus 1? and honestly,just been spending a lot of money being a student pilot and just trying to find the cheapest way, hahaha. Im one of the most frugal people ever, now i want to fly and have harleys and such, but i try to go about it the cheapest way......i bought my 15k harley for 7k at a no reserve auction(just an example)
 
I have a XGPS150 I could part with as I put a stratux together
 
Bad Elf Pro offers additional flexibility beyond the XGPS150 at a similar price point: it has a screen (so you can see GPS details & battery state) and up to 16 hours of logging (say, if you like to track your hiking/boating). And it can pair with multiple iPads/iPhones simultaneously, should you be so fortunate as to have multiple devices (or say if you fly with someone who also needs GPS).
 
I have a cheap Ellipses 8 that has an internal GPS running free Avare. Rarely use it but it works great in the air.
 
i guess i should say that i have 2 ipads and a iphone all wifi capable
 
Chad Phillips said:
i guess i should say that i have 2 ipads and a iphone all wifi capable
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Not sure if you'd lose a signal in the air with cellular. Mine uses an internal GPS and never had a signal issue. Actually pay less on my phone bill with Verizon once I added the Ellipsis. I'm sure it would run FF fine.
 
+1 for using your IPad. Worked like a charm on both my student XC flights.
 
iPad with cell service will do the job for your initial pilot training....
 
The CHEAPEST way?

Don't use one at all.

Wait until you know how to fly without one.

Honestly, it should not be necessary. If it is, you aren't ready to solo away from your home field.
 
Did you check to see if your CFI will let you use foreflight or EFB for private training? I don't let my students use them. A few other instructors I know don't allow private students to use them.
 
Chad Phillips said:
thats what my father in law just told me..... then get a stratus later on?
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If you wish.. But you might also wind up in an aircraft where the ADSB equipped transponder talks to ForeFlight (the Garmin GTX345 and the L-3 Lynx as examples).

But really at this stage, don't worry about it. It's too early in the game to consider purchasing such an item. Wait until training is done, and you have additional hours of experience and wisdom. It's too easy right now to spend money on something that you later decide doesn't serve you as well as you thought it would.
 
TommyG said:
Did you check to see if your CFI will let you use foreflight or EFB for private training? I don't let my students use them. A few other instructors I know don't allow private students to use them.
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I have to agree that this is a good idea. My instructor did allow me but only after I could prove the other way. However, once you use the iPad, and there is no going back to the paper methods. One thing I think about is that after a while, you forget how to use the paper method!
 
Take both of your iPads out to the garage. Set one under each of your back wheels. Back up.

Then go learn to fly an airplane.

Once you have a pilot certificate (or license as many call it) you can waste all your money on iPads, elphs, unicorns, and what have you.

Student's don't need to play with their gadgets. They need to master the fundamentals.
 
Chad Phillips said:
I have an ipad with Cellular service. I was under the impression that i wouldnt be able to count on that in the cockpit? is that not true? i know some areas im driving through doesn't get any cellular signal, and i plan to be flying through those areas(mainly because of mountains and such). So being up in the air i dont have to worry about dropping signal?
Click to expand...

You can turn off the data cell portion and save the battery, leave the GPS on.
The GPS is from overhead, not ground based cell towers.
 
My Gen1 iPad had the data service and internal GPS. Turn off the data to save battery. Depending on where in the aircraft I would loose GPS information from time to time. Flew with a pilot with an iPad mini on his left knee pad, Cessna with the pad against the left door frame. Lost GPS signals.

My current set up is iPad Air2 wifi only. I run Bad Elf Pro for GPS data over Bluetooth connection. Turn the wifi off to save battery. Keep the bad elf on the glareshield under a towel, no signal loss.
 
I use the Bad Elf Pro. It's pretty cheap and works fine. But my IPad doesn't have a GPS or else I probably wouldn't have bothered. My IPhone works fine without the Bad Elf.
 
I don't think a private pilot student should use an iPad.
However, if somebody is looking for an ultra cheap way to get going, I would go into eBay and get a used iPad 2 with 3G (a 3G subscription is not required to use the gps) one can be had for roughly $100. Install the fltplan app and download the local data (free). Now you have a low profile, one piece, capable efb for about $100, electricity, and a wifi network (the later two can both be found for free)
 
I'm an old fuddy-duddy CFI (since 1980) who thinks you should train the way you're going to fly. With me, you'd master paper with plotter along with the manual E6B...then you'd master your iPad. I hope you've found a CFI of the same mind.

The built in GPS works just fine.
 
LDJones said:
I'm an old fuddy-duddy CFI (since 1980) who thinks you should train the way you're going to fly. With me, you'd master paper with plotter along with the manual E6B...then you'd master your iPad. I hope you've found a CFI of the same mind.

The built in GPS works just fine.
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Hate to tell you this, but they're not going to fly with paper. :)

If you're "training like you're going to fight", all the fighting after they leave the check-ride, is likely to be done on a tablet now.

I'm also a fan of learning paper before gadgets but I do see that at $12 a pop for a chart, and constant renewals of them, there's a definite break point where just buying the paper becomes dumb once you start going further away from home than two VFR charts.

We all remember paying Jepp a few hundred bucks just for approach plates for a few State region. I'd never recommend an instrument student pay for paper chart books nowadays.

We are about to see a new phenomenon too. Vector graphics are going to declutter the gadgets but you're going to have to force folks backward to the actual chart image to learn what's on it and when/why they'll need to look at it.
 
Chad Phillips said:
I have an ipad with Cellular service. I was under the impression that i wouldnt be able to count on that in the cockpit? is that not true? i know some areas im driving through doesn't get any cellular signal, and i plan to be flying through those areas(mainly because of mountains and such). So being up in the air i dont have to worry about dropping signal?
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Sticking with your question rather than the paper vs plastic sidebar (I prefer stone tablets), people have had different experiences with the reliability of the internal GPS. Based on my experience with my backup Android tablet (with internal GPS) I suspect most of the difference has to do with placement).

Personally, I made an early decision to go with an external, so all of my iPads (I am on my third) have been WiFi only. But if I already had a cellular iPad, and I were a VFR-only pilot, I would not bother with an external for GPS without some real indication I needed one.

My reasons:
  1. The internal GPS does not depend on the availability of cellular service. As others pointed out, better to shut off the cellular and save the battery.
  2. If I lose the GPS signal once in a great while so what? I still have a nice clear, resizable sectional chart on my tablet. If it becomes common enough to be an annoying distraction, go get one.
  3. I might want in-flight weather at some point and those units include GPS capability.
 
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denverpilot said:
Hate to tell you this, but they're not going to fly with paper. :)

If you're "training like you're going to fight", all the fighting after they leave the check-ride, is likely to be done on a tablet now.

I'm also a fan of learning paper before gadgets but I do see that at $12 a pop for a chart, and constant renewals of them, there's a definite break point where just buying the paper becomes dumb once you start going further away from home than two VFR charts.

We all remember paying Jepp a few hundred bucks just for approach plates for a few State region. I'd never recommend an instrument student pay for paper chart books nowadays.

We are about to see a new phenomenon too. Vector graphics are going to declutter the gadgets but you're going to have to force folks backward to the actual chart image to learn what's on it and when/why they'll need to look at it.
Click to expand...
Great post. The only very slight difference we have may be the value of "learning" paper, and we might not even disagree on that.

I think a paper chart has immense value on the ground in the training environment. CFI and student sitting side by side, pointing at things and discussing them just strikes me better than hovering over an iPad. Although I guess being able to project the tablet on a screen would be even better (if the app has draw-on-the-sectional capability). In the air, I don't really care, although a traditional draw-on-the-sectional cross country definitely had value (anyone want to guess the only item still left on my Foreflight wish list? :) And, yes, I know some other apps have that).
 
I suppose there is training value in unfolding, flipping and digging for the next required paper chart as you need it, but hands down, I prefer electronic to paper, even if I didn't also use the electronic device for navigational purposes. I have yet to spill coffee all over my passenger because I swiped the coffee mug with an errant sectional or enroute chart since using the Ipad.
 
rolivi said:
Take both of your iPads out to the garage. Set one under each of your back wheels. Back up.

Then go learn to fly an airplane.

Once you have a pilot certificate (or license as many call it) you can waste all your money on iPads, elphs, unicorns, and what have you.

Student's don't need to play with their gadgets. They need to master the fundamentals.
Click to expand...

Now that's a little bit harsh. The Ipads are still useful for Pokeman Go.
 
midlifeflyer said:
Great post. The only very slight difference we have may be the value of "learning" paper, and we might not even disagree on that.

I think a paper chart has immense value on the ground in the training environment. CFI and student sitting side by side, pointing at things and discussing them just strikes me better than hovering over an iPad. Although I guess being able to project the tablet on a screen would be even better (if the app has draw-on-the-sectional capability). In the air, I don't really care, although a traditional draw-on-the-sectional cross country definitely had value (anyone want to guess the only item still left on my Foreflight wish list? :) And, yes, I know some other apps have that).
Click to expand...

Definitely in "violent agreement". I just wonder how long we have until nobody stocks anything but the local charts and they're $50/copy because they're only used on the desk in the ground school. Haha.

If FF adds "draw on it" capability, it sounds like you'll need a new iPad Pro for ground school work and a smaller one for in flight. LOL!

(Nobody has mentioned the Pro for a while and I only ever saw one person crazy enough to mount one above the sun visor on the right side ceiling of a plane in photos. Hahaha. That thing is just massive.)

Sac Arrow said:
Now that's a little bit harsh. The Ipads are still useful for Pokeman Go.
Click to expand...

You used Pokemon Go and "useful" in the same sentence. Ten demerits and go see the Principal who'll issue detention after school. :)
 
denverpilot said:
Definitely in "violent agreement". I just wonder how long we have until nobody stocks anything but the local charts and they're $50/copy because they're only used on the desk in the ground school. Haha.

If FF adds "draw on it" capability, it sounds like you'll need a new iPad Pro for ground school work and a smaller one for in flight. LOL!

(Nobody has mentioned the Pro for a while and I only ever saw one person crazy enough to mount one above the sun visor on the right side ceiling of a plane in photos. Hahaha. That thing is just massive.)



You used Pokemon Go and "useful" in the same sentence. Ten demerits and go see the Principal who'll issue detention after school. :)
Click to expand...

As long as he keeps his hands off my blue knob.
 
Sac Arrow said:
They don't appear to support AHRS, at least yet, which is the only reason why I would spring for a Stratus in the first place.
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Accelerometers and solid state gyros have been done with Stratux. So have magnetometers, but I would give them ZERO credibility given the very noisy locations. A real AHRS is placed much further from the TC, compass, and various gauges, usually in a wingtip or above the cargo area.
 
denverpilot said:
Hate to tell you this, but they're not going to fly with paper. :)

If you're "training like you're going to fight", all the fighting after they leave the check-ride, is likely to be done on a tablet now.

I'm also a fan of learning paper before gadgets but I do see that at $12 a pop for a chart, and constant renewals of them, there's a definite break point where just buying the paper becomes dumb once you start going further away from home than two VFR charts.

We all remember paying Jepp a few hundred bucks just for approach plates for a few State region. I'd never recommend an instrument student pay for paper chart books nowadays.

We are about to see a new phenomenon too. Vector graphics are going to declutter the gadgets but you're going to have to force folks backward to the actual chart image to learn what's on it and when/why they'll need to look at it.
Click to expand...

We're in complete agreement. I teach paper because the FAA mandates it. But I teach the iPad because that's what they're going to use. I want them using it in training.
 
denverpilot said:
If FF adds "draw on it" capability, it sounds like you'll need a new iPad Pro for ground school work and a smaller one for in flight. LOL!
Click to expand...
I think I'll stick with paper or a projector.

I'm actually doing some "draw on" now as notes for a student lesson. It's to point out big/easy checkpoints in a practice area for a relatively new student as an early intro to pilotage. Drawing on the map is available in FltPlan Go!
 
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