Why are so many people afraid to fly in small airplanes?

Big Mustache

Big Mustache

Filing Flight Plan
Joined
Feb 20, 2012
Messages
24
Location
Fort Lupton, CO
Display Name
Display name:
Bushy Mustache
It always amazes me that so many people will not fly in a GA aircraft. Is this because of the media? Flying is supposed to be safer than driving or riding in a car right? Or is it flying commercial is safer than riding or driving a car?
 
Last edited:
Big Mustache said:
It always amazes me that so many people will not fly in a GA aircraft. Is this because of the media? Flying is supposed to be safer than driving or riding in a car right? Or is it flying commercial is safer than riding or driving a car?
Click to expand...

Part 121 is safer than a car. Part 91 is about as safe as a motorcycle.
 
It may even be worse than that. All the numbers I have seen lump all of part 91 together, the C150 all the way to the G550. If you seperated out all turbine aircraft flown by a professional crew I think it would be much worse than a motorcycle. A person might be considered to be quite wise to not want to fly in a small single engine plane.:dunno:
 
My first experience in a plane without a bathroom was in a Cessna 172n. It was in July and there was turbulence. I felt like I was in a carnival ride that was being shaken by King Kong. I know why they call them discovery flights. It's your opportunity to discover if you can cope with the feeling of flying through the air in a chevy vega. Lucky for me, my discovery flight has been my absolute worst experience in a GA plane and that was a great place for me to start because it could only get better.
 
Oddly enough my worst turbulence was in Hawaii. My CFI flew through a few rough clouds on purpose to demonstrate what clouds mean what. You can tell what to expect by their shape. I slammed my head upon the insides of that 182 a few times. I already had some 150 hours by that time, but wasn't shaken that bad even by Texas thermals.
 
Well, the flip side is many people drive on a two lane road with no seat belt. That's a 100+ MPH closure rate.

A poorly maintained C-150 with a buzzed pilot has to be safer than that.
 
I think I've read about 5 or 6 hairy plane crashes just this week alone, and I haven't been looking for them. And this is outside of aviation fora. For each of them, I'm sure there were hours of sensational media coverage in a huge radius around the scene which alerted the populace to each horror show, leaving indelible imprints about how dangerous this flying thing is, lock up your daughters, etc..

I'm waiting for one of the types with a PETA-style brain to figure out that aluminum rain is the next hazard to their health, and go on a serious warpath.

If aviation was perfectly safe and boring, frankly, I probably wouldn't be in it. I like it when people look at me aghast when they learn I'm a pilot and fly in those "little planes". With some of them, I'd get a calmer reaction if I told them I shot heroin into my eyeball for breakfast.
 
schmookeeg said:
If aviation was perfectly safe and boring, frankly, I probably wouldn't be in it.
Click to expand...

Yep!! Snow boarding, scuba diving, mountain bikiing, white water rafting, sky diving, bungee jumping...pick your poison. If there's not even the slightest chance of ending up on the wrong side of the grass, it's probably not that much fun.
 
schmookeeg said:
I think I've read about 5 or 6 hairy plane crashes just this week alone, and I haven't been looking for them. And this is outside of aviation fora. For each of them, I'm sure there were hours of sensational media coverage in a huge radius around the scene which alerted the populace to each horror show, leaving indelible imprints about how dangerous this flying thing is, lock up your daughters, etc..
Click to expand...

How many hundreds of fatal automobile crashes happened over the same time period / geographical area? How much news coverage did they recieve?

(600 - 700 fatalaties per week in the US)
 
pdonahue said:
Part 121 is safer than a car. Part 91 is about as safe as a motorcycle.
Click to expand...

Seems about right - but then some motorcyclists wear helmets and boots and don't lane split whereas others drive 75mph on a crowded freeway and pass between cars . . . and GA pilots are pretty much the same in terms of risk as in - its always flown ok before with that problem . . .
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
How many hundreds of fatal automobile crashes happened over the same time period / geographical area? How much news coverage did they recieve?

(600 - 700 fatalaties per week in the US)
Click to expand...

Without question, but nearly everyone has seen a car wreck... boring!

So maybe if the sheeple saw multiple plane crashes every day, we could de-sensationalize things? :D
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
How many hundreds of fatal automobile crashes happened over the same time period / geographical area? How much news coverage did they recieve?

(600 - 700 fatalaties per week in the US)
Click to expand...
How many millions of drivers are there compared to small airplane pilots?
 
Is all about size. The perception is the bigger the safer/better. Not only on planes but on boats, houses, hospitals, stores, body guards you name it. It is in the human nature.

José
 
Piloto said:
Is all about size. The perception is the bigger the safer/better. Not only on planes but on boats, houses, hospitals, stores, body guards you name it. It is in the human nature.

José
Click to expand...

However, the perception is a false one. The safer one is the one that will survive the conditions better. With both boats and planes it's easier to build high levels of strength in smaller/lighter structures than larger heavier ones. With a boat the trick is to have the hull stay dry and return to upright, preferably with a rig and ready to go even after it going upside down. You'll be more comfortable on a big well built boat, but you'll be safer in a well built 13'er than a crappy 300'er. Google Sailboat Jester crossings. Mind you, the dude is nuts when you meet him.
 
Last edited:
schmookeeg said:
Without question, but nearly everyone has seen a car wreck... boring!
So maybe if the sheeple saw multiple plane crashes every day, we could de-sensationalize things? :D
Click to expand...

Maybe if the news went on a 3 hour rampage about the dangerous deadly cars every time there was a very minor fender bender and do it on absolutely every single minor car problem, people would have the same mindset about cars. (OMFG, a car had a flat tire, everyone is going to die die die maim, everyone is dead, ban the death traps, eeek, ban them before someone else dies - like they do aviation)

I've read about 5 or 6 hairy plane crashes just this week alone
Click to expand...

So what. That's dribble nothing. On the 11 mile drive to/from work (22 mile round trip), I see at least 5 wrecks per week that involve emergency crews and a wrecker. Last thursday night alone, I saw 4 wad the cars up smashbangers on the way home and based on the emergency crews and the state of one of the vehicles, someone likely died in that one. My mindset was "oh sheesh anther blocked road due to some idiot ramming into some other idiot" -- It's so common that you don't even get upset over it in much the same way you don't get upset over steeping on an ant. And that is just one minor routine nothing road in Denver....
 
I had read that for x miles traveled a GA plane was 5 times less likely to crash than a car.... but that the crash was 5 times more likely to be fatal.

But it's all relative too right? Which is worse, an experienced 1,000hr pilot flying through the mountains or a 100hr pilot flying across the Midwest in perfect weather?
 
Big Mustache said:
It always amazes me that so many people will not fly in a GA aircraft.
Click to expand...
Why does it amaze you? The opposite actually would have been much more amazing. A typical GA aircraft has less room inside than Honda Civic and often looks/feels like it was put together by Groucho brothers in a barn. And people (often instinctively) feel that flying in such small aircraft is going to be less safe than any commercial flying and they are right, and they may have suspicions about competency of the pilot even if they can tolerate the airplane. For many it is almost like doing bungee jumping.
 
Last edited:
After driving from Savannah to Memphis via Atlanta and Birmingham, I'm of the opinion the flying is safer, for that route anyway. Was the first time in 3 or 4 years I had driven farther than 60-100 miles, only did then due to cargo needs. I'll get on a dirt bike and race it all day long, huck off a 20' cliff in the Montana backcountry, shoot rapids in the lochsa river in a 12' raft but I will not ride a street bike, not on roads. If I'm going to do something risky, I'd rather hedge my bet on myself.
 
There are likely thousands of pilots in Arizona alone. Lots of flight training down here. So many of those pilots are students and low time. I hear about less fatal aircraft crashes here than I do car crashes. Flying is a risk, but we reduce the risks as much as possible with preflight, runups, currency and proper training.
 
bartmc said:
After driving from Savannah to Memphis via Atlanta and Birmingham, I'm of the opinion the flying is safer, for that route anyway. Was the first time in 3 or 4 years I had driven farther than 60-100 miles, only did then due to cargo needs. I'll get on a dirt bike and race it all day long, huck off a 20' cliff in the Montana backcountry, shoot rapids in the lochsa river in a 12' raft but I will not ride a street bike, not on roads. If I'm going to do something risky, I'd rather hedge my bet on myself.
Click to expand...

I raced motocross for about 10 years... 130' jumps, no problem. Riding on the street? Did some on friend's bikes and enjoy it but I think it's too risky for me to do every day so I never owned a road machine. I don't ride around scared or anything.. Enjoy it a lot actually but I do not like the idea of getting plowed by a car.

I want really badly to get back into some form of racing but I think my motocross days are probably over. Still have the most vivid dreams and I remember all my favorite tracks turn by turn. I quit riding because my friends grew out of it, gas was up to 4 bucks and I didn't ride enough and every time I felt rusty. Just like flying if you are rusty your risk goes up big time.
 
We had a female firefighter that refused to get in the helicopter during training evolutions. Not because she was afraid it would crash, she was afraid the pilots were going to fly crazy to scare her. No amount of reassurance would convince her.
 
flightmedic said:
We had a female firefighter that refused to get in the helicopter during training evolutions. Not because she was afraid it would crash, she was afraid the pilots were going to fly crazy to scare her. No amount of reassurance would convince her.
Click to expand...

Was she right?
 
Henning said:
However, the perception is a false one. The safer one is the one that will survive the conditions better. With both boats and planes it's easier to build high levels of strength in smaller/lighter structures than larger heavier ones. With a boat the trick is to have the hull stay dry and return to upright, preferably with a rig and ready to go even after it going upside down. You'll be more comfortable on a big well built boat, but you'll be safer in a well built 13'er than a crappy 300'er. Google Sailboat Jester crossings. Mind you, the dude is nuts when you meet him.
Click to expand...

Try crossing the Mona Channel with 20' waves on that 13' dinghy vs the Allure of the Seas and you tell me which one would your wife would feel safer.:rolleyes:

José
 
flightmedic said:
We had a female firefighter that refused to get in the helicopter during training evolutions. Not because she was afraid it would crash, she was afraid the pilots were going to fly crazy to scare her. No amount of reassurance would convince her.
Click to expand...

In that same vein, we had a person ask how long it would be until a boat got to them because they didn't want to get in the basket. She was willing to stay on a sinking boat rather than "risk" riding in a helicopter. :dunno:
 
Threefingeredjack said:
In that same vein, we had a person ask how long it would be until a boat got to them because they didn't want to get in the basket. She was willing to stay on a sinking boat rather than "risk" riding in a helicopter. :dunno:
Click to expand...

I can understand that
 
Scared when flying: seldom.
Scared when driving 75mph on the freeway with 6-8 cars/trucks within 20 feet: Always.
Way more people die from falling while walking or standing on a chair (National Safety Council says 25,000 died in 2009 from "falls", 8.9 million trips to the emergency room)
Almost twice as many people die from boating accidents as GA accidents.

I blame the media. I get the same thing from people when I talk about flying in Mexico... "OMG, and nobody in your group got killed?"
 
Last edited:
I would say many aircraft accidents in the future will be from lack of currency. Flew .8, mainly tng's today. Topped off with 9 gallons at $6.20 + Tax. I saw two planes while at the airport four hours and flying.
 
Fear of the unknown. GA has a much smaller footprint in comparison to the gen population these days that few people are familiar with it. Fear of advanced technology. Yes, you and I know that our GA planes are not really advanced tech, but the gen population sees it as untested, untried, and lacking basic safety devices that we have in cars(airbag, ABS, safety glass, heavy doors). Fear of lack of control. In a car, nearly everyone could be the driver, even if one is only a pax at the time, they could technically drive the car they are sitting in. In a GA plane they see the yoke sitting RIGHT THERE, but they have almost no idea what to do with it, or if they would die, if you die while flying. Fear of enclosed spaces. Fear of heights.
 
ronnieh said:
It may even be worse than that. All the numbers I have seen lump all of part 91 together, the C150 all the way to the G550. If you seperated out all turbine aircraft flown by a professional crew I think it would be much worse than a motorcycle. A person might be considered to be quite wise to not want to fly in a small single engine plane.:dunno:
Click to expand...

If you're going to get selective, consider that experimentals account for a much larger portion of the accidents than their share of the flying aircraft let alone hours flown. I suspect much of that is the result of the typically low time for pilot of homebuilts. If in addition to homebuilts you exclude pilots running out of fuel (or engine stoppages due to a lack of fuel delivered to the engine) and non-IR or non current pilots flying in clouds, the safety record starts to close in on automobile safety.
 
My mother in law is this way. She is extremely afraid of this kind of thing. When I took the wife up for a flight a while back, she was super worried. Forget the fact that I've been doing this for 11 years in everything from a Cessna to an F/A-18, she was clearly horrified. Then again, I'm not exactly the best light single pilot these days, so maybe her concern was warranted :) seriously though, I chalk it up to the news, to idiots going out and doing dumb things in airplanes that gets them and their pax killed, and to a general fear of things that they don't understand. I think the vast majority of the non flying public thinks this is some sort of magic, or amazing luck at the very least.
 
Gizmo, to follow in your train of thought just exclude all pilots that crash and the safety record gets real good. There is a certain amount of risk in any activity. Many will try to explain it away as the above post does. I know, "I won't run out of gas, I won't go into weather VFR" nd the list goes on and on. Private pilots (especially low time) in small airplanes are dangerous compared to many activities. Much more dangerous than driving an automobile, much more than traveling by airline, I am quite sure setting in your recliner watching TV is safer.

Are we only going to do those activities we deem safe by some arbitrary standard? I choose to not fly in small single engine aircraft yet, I ride a motorcycle on the street. You will never hear me say that a motorcycle is safe for me because I don't split traffic, I always wear a helmet, I dress accordingly. Not me, it IS NOT safe compared to many activities, for example, going by automobile. I of course try to mitigate the dangers in this activity but the numbers don't lie. Riding a motorcycle on the street is hazardous to your safety as is flying by low time private pilots in small airplanes. Perhaps you feel safer by hiding from the facts, it is what it is.
 
Sometimes it helps to put a number on things...
http://www.aopa.org/whatsnew/stats/safety.html

And here's an old but highly informative powerpoint with statistics broken down quite a few ways
http://www.ghafi.org/download/GA-Analysis.1.pdf


My takeaway is that I need to learn the basics and learn them well and be really particular about when I'm willing to fly and plan carefully once I have my certificate.

Also that this isn't just chucking me and any pax who choose to go along into a proverbial abyss or meat grinder either. Yeah there's danger and you've gotta be aware of that and be honest about it. Then again if you never take risks in life you probably won't have much fun. In the long run, we're all dead anyway.
 
Big Mustache said:
It always amazes me that so many people will not fly in a GA aircraft. Is this because of the media? Flying is supposed to be safer than driving or riding in a car right? Or is it flying commercial is safer than riding or driving a car?
Click to expand...

Perhaps it is not the perception of GA at all, but rather the perception of the PIC. Most people I know have no problem with GA.
 
My friend/mentor/cfi, flying since WWII, would laughing say 'cheated death again' after a flight.:eek:
 
Because cars are built to be safer than airplanes. When was the last time you saw a crash dummy video of a small airplane? What is (would be) the outcome of such a video?

The consequences of a fender-bender on the highway is usually a totalled car and a lost day of work for some people.

The consequences of a fender-bender in the pattern is usually 2 fatalities.

It takes less skill to drive a car or ride a bike safely than an airplane. It takes less intelligence to drive a car or ride a bike safely than an airplane.

Safety improvements for cars can be purchased or added whenever you want. Safety improvements for an airplane cost ten times as much and cannot be added without Federal approval and delay.

The average age of an automobile is significantly younger than the average age of our aircraft. They look old and cheap.

Flying in general has lots of people scared. It seems unnatural and we haven't grown up sitting in a plane-seat the same way we grew up sitting in a car-seat.

The unfamiliar is always scary. Humans are not capable of thinking logically when determining risk. If something seems strange, then it is to be avoided. Evolution has made that an imperative.
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
How many hundreds of fatal automobile crashes happened over the same time period / geographical area? How much news coverage did they recieve?

(600 - 700 fatalaties per week in the US)
Click to expand...

Actually, about 2,600 killed in car wrecks each week. This year is the lowest fatality rate since the 40's due to the economy and price of gas. ;)
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top