What makes and IFR panel?

In addition to the VFR instrument requirements:

Sec. 125.205 — Equipment requirements: Airplanes under IFR.

No person may operate an airplane under IFR unless it has—

(a) A vertical speed indicator;
(b) A free-air temperature indicator;
(c) A heated pitot tube for each airspeed indicator;
(d) A power failure warning device or vacuum indicator to show the power available for gyroscopic instruments from each power source;
(e) An alternate source of static pressure for the altimeter and the airspeed and vertical speed indicators;
(f) At least two generators each of which is on a separate engine, or which any combination of one-half of the total number are rated sufficiently to supply the electrical loads of all required instruments and equipment necessary for safe emergency operation of the airplane; and
(g) Two independent sources of energy (with means of selecting either), of which at least one is an engine-driven pump or generator, each of which is able to drive all gyroscopic instruments and installed so that failure of one instrument or source does not interfere with the energy supply to the remaining instruments or the other energy source. For the purposes of this paragraph, each engine-driven source of energy must be on a different engine.
(h) For the purposes of paragraph (f) of this section, a continuous inflight electrical load includes one that draws current continuously during flight, such as radio equipment, electrically driven instruments, and lights, but does not include occasional intermittent loads.
(i) An airspeed indicating system with heated pitot tube or equivalent means for preventing malfunctioning due to icing.
(j) A sensitive altimeter.
(k) Instrument lights providing enough light to make each required instrument, switch, or similar instrument easily readable and installed so that the direct rays are shielded from the flight crewmembers' eyes and that no objectionable reflections are visible to them. There must be a means of controlling the intensity of illumination unless it is shown that nondimming instrument lights are satisfactory.
 
studiomusic said:
What minimum instruments are needed to make up a basic IFR panel?
:confused:
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91.205 Powered civil aircraft with standard category US airworthiness certificates: instrument & equipment requirements.

paragraph (d)
 
COFlyBoy said:
In addition to the VFR instrument requirements:

Sec. 125.205 — Equipment requirements: Airplanes under IFR.

No person may operate an airplane under IFR unless it has—

(a) A vertical speed indicator;
(b) A free-air temperature indicator;
(c) A heated pitot tube for each airspeed indicator;
(d) A power failure warning device or vacuum indicator to show the power available for gyroscopic instruments from each power source;
(e) An alternate source of static pressure for the altimeter and the airspeed and vertical speed indicators;
(f) At least two generators each of which is on a separate engine, or which any combination of one-half of the total number are rated sufficiently to supply the electrical loads of all required instruments and equipment necessary for safe emergency operation of the airplane; and
(g) Two independent sources of energy (with means of selecting either), of which at least one is an engine-driven pump or generator, each of which is able to drive all gyroscopic instruments and installed so that failure of one instrument or source does not interfere with the energy supply to the remaining instruments or the other energy source. For the purposes of this paragraph, each engine-driven source of energy must be on a different engine.
(h) For the purposes of paragraph (f) of this section, a continuous inflight electrical load includes one that draws current continuously during flight, such as radio equipment, electrically driven instruments, and lights, but does not include occasional intermittent loads.
(i) An airspeed indicating system with heated pitot tube or equivalent means for preventing malfunctioning due to icing.
(j) A sensitive altimeter.
(k) Instrument lights providing enough light to make each required instrument, switch, or similar instrument easily readable and installed so that the direct rays are shielded from the flight crewmembers' eyes and that no objectionable reflections are visible to them. There must be a means of controlling the intensity of illumination unless it is shown that nondimming instrument lights are satisfactory.
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Depends - 125 only applies t aircraft with 20+ pax or a max payload of 6K pounds.
 
Sec. 91.205 — Powered civil aircraft with standard category U.S. airworthiness certificates: Instrument and equipment requirements.

(a) General. Except as provided in paragraphs (c)(3) and (e) of this section, no person may operate a powered civil aircraft with a standard category U.S. airworthiness certificate in any operation described in paragraphs (b) through (f) of this section unless that aircraft contains the instruments and equipment specified in those paragraphs (or FAA-approved equivalents) for that type of operation, and those instruments and items of equipment are in operable condition.

(b) Visual-flight rules (day). For VFR flight during the day, the following instruments and equipment are required:
(1) Airspeed indicator.
(2) Altimeter.
(3) Magnetic direction indicator.
(4) Tachometer for each engine.
(5) Oil pressure gauge for each engine using pressure system.
(6) Temperature gauge for each liquid-cooled engine.
(7) Oil temperature gauge for each air-cooled engine.
(8) Manifold pressure gauge for each altitude engine.
(9) Fuel gauge indicating the quantity of fuel in each tank.
(10) Landing gear position indicator, if the aircraft has a retractable landing gear.
(11) For small civil airplanes certificated after March 11, 1996, in accordance with part 23 of this chapter, an approved aviation red or aviation white anticollision light system. In the event of failure of any light of the anticollision light system, operation of the aircraft may continue to a location where repairs or replacement can be made.
(12) If the aircraft is operated for hire over water and beyond power-off gliding distance from shore, approved flotation gear readily available to each occupant and, unless the aircraft is operating under part 121 of this subchapter, at least one pyrotechnic signaling device. As used in this section, “shore” means that area of the land adjacent to the water which is above the high water mark and excludes land areas which are intermittently under water.
(13) An approved safety belt with an approved metal-to-metal latching device for each occupant 2 years of age or older.
(14) For small civil airplanes manufactured after July 18, 1978, an approved shoulder harness for each front seat. The shoulder harness must be designed to protect the occupant from serious head injury when the occupant experiences the ultimate inertia forces specified in §23.561(b)(2) of this chapter. Each shoulder harness installed at a flight crewmember station must permit the crewmember, when seated and with the safety belt and shoulder harness fastened, to perform all functions necessary for flight operations. For purposes of this paragraph—
(i) The date of manufacture of an airplane is the date the inspection acceptance records reflect that the airplane is complete and meets the FAA-approved type design data; and
(ii) A front seat is a seat located at a flight crewmember station or any seat located alongside such a seat.
(15) An emergency locator transmitter, if required by §91.207.
(16) For normal, utility, and acrobatic category airplanes with a seating configuration, excluding pilot seats, of 9 or less, manufactured after December 12, 1986, a shoulder harness for—
(i) Each front seat that meets the requirements of §23.785 (g) and (h) of this chapter in effect on December 12, 1985;
(ii) Each additional seat that meets the requirements of §23.785(g) of this chapter in effect on December 12, 1985.
(17) For rotorcraft manufactured after September 16, 1992, a shoulder harness for each seat that meets the requirements of §27.2 or §29.2 of this chapter in effect on September 16, 1991.
(c) Visual flight rules (night). For VFR flight at night, the following instruments and equipment are required:
(1) Instruments and equipment specified in paragraph (b) of this section.
(2) Approved position lights.
(3) An approved aviation red or aviation white anticollision light system on all U.S.-registered civil aircraft. Anticollision light systems initially installed after August 11, 1971, on aircraft for which a type certificate was issued or applied for before August 11, 1971, must at least meet the anticollision light standards of part 23, 25, 27, or 29 of this chapter, as applicable, that were in effect on August 10, 1971, except that the color may be either aviation red or aviation white. In the event of failure of any light of the anticollision light system, operations with the aircraft may be continued to a stop where repairs or replacement can be made.
(4) If the aircraft is operated for hire, one electric landing light.
(5) An adequate source of electrical energy for all installed electrical and radio equipment.
(6) One spare set of fuses, or three spare fuses of each kind required, that are accessible to the pilot in flight.
(d) Instrument flight rules. For IFR flight, the following instruments and equipment are required:
(1) Instruments and equipment specified in paragraph (b) of this section, and, for night flight, instruments and equipment specified in paragraph (c) of this section.
(2) Two-way radio communication and navigation equipment suitable for the route to be flown.
(3) Gyroscopic rate-of-turn indicator, except on the following aircraft:
(i) Airplanes with a third attitude instrument system usable through flight attitudes of 360 degrees of pitch and roll and installed in accordance with the instrument requirements prescribed in §121.305(j) of this chapter; and
(ii) Rotorcraft with a third attitude instrument system usable through flight attitudes of ±80 degrees of pitch and ±120 degrees of roll and installed in accordance with §29.1303(g) of this chapter.
(4) Slip-skid indicator.
(5) Sensitive altimeter adjustable for barometric pressure.
(6) A clock displaying hours, minutes, and seconds with a sweep-second pointer or digital presentation.
(7) Generator or alternator of adequate capacity.
(8) Gyroscopic pitch and bank indicator (artificial horizon).
(9) Gyroscopic direction indicator (directional gyro or equivalent).
 
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In addition you need any equipment called out in the aircraft type certification for that mode of flight. For example, a heated pitot is not strictly needed under 91.205, but the type certificate may make it mandatory .
 
Beyond the legal mandatories, you need an avionics package that will provide sufficient equipment for safe, comfortable navigation and communication. 91.205(d)(2) doesn't specify how many of which boxes you need, so you have to sort that based on your own requirements, balancing that with suitability for the particular aircraft type. For example, you wouldn't put a full Category II ILS package in a Piper Cub, but on the other hand, having only a single nav/comm in a cabin-class twin would be serious underkill.

Also, there's probably not much point in putting a lot of fancy gear in an aircraft which you're only going to fly IFR for the purpose of getting on top and descending through a layer when it's marginal VFR underneath. That said, for the purpose of training for your instrument rating and the sort of IFR flying most folks do in light single-engine aircraft, the minimum would probably be dual nav/comms (one with glide slope), a transponder with altimeter encoder, and an audio panel/intercom.

Also, GPS is fast becoming a virtual standard for much IFR flying, especially with many airports served only by GPS approaches. In that regard, the Garmin 430 is fast becoming the baseline unit for the #1 radio, combining VHF comm, a VOR with full ILS, and an approach-certified GPS capability. Further, the day is coming when a WAAS GPS will be necessary for entry into much airspace, including all Class B areas. I realize that is nearly ten years away, but it's worth thinking about now.

One last point on the 430 -- five years ago, a light single for IFR use would command a sales premium if it had a 430 in it. It appears to me now that lack of a 430 (or its big brother the 530, or the new 650/750) is being viewed by many buyers as a negative even in a light single 4-seater. YMMV, but that's my perception.
 
I got flamed on the red board when i suggested that sellers might be being a little optomistic when advertising a plane as having an IFR panel with only a KR86 and KX170B. But, by God if it has a current static test, it's IFR, doesn't matter if you can't legally fly but one IFR approach in the country with it, it's legal and not misleading at all, especially if you are marketing it as "good IFR trainer" to a glassy eyed fresh PPL holder.

I'd say a VOR or two, 2 CDIs connected to something (VOR/GPS), One with a glideslope and something to measure distance would be my "minimum IFR panel", Oh and a comm. That is only my personal opinion and i realized its serious overkill to be considered IFR legally speaking but I don't know that I could with a straight face advertise a panel as IFR with anything less. Sure you'll catch some heart warming stories about ADFs etc....
 
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bartmc said:
I got flamed on the red board when i suggested that sellers might be being a little optomistic when advertising a plane as having an IFR panel with only a KR86 and KX170B. But, by God if it has a current static test, it's IFR, doesn't matter if you can't legally fly but one IFR approach in the country with it, it's legal and not misleading at all, especially if you are marketing it as "good IFR trainer" to a glassy eyed fresh PPL holder.

I'd say a VOR or two, 2 CDIs connected to something (VOR/GPS), One with a glideslope and something to measure distance would be my "minimum IFR panel", Oh and a comm. That is only my personal opinion and i realized its serious overkill to be considered IFR legally speaking but I don't know that I could with a straight face advertise a panel as IFR with anything less. Sure you'll catch some heart warming stories about ADFs etc....
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Letter vs intent:rolleyes:
 
bartmc said:
I got flamed on the red board when i suggested that sellers might be being a little optomistic when advertising a plane as having an IFR panel with only a KR86 and KX170B.
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Just goes to show that in flame city you can get torched for almost any opinion.:D
 
beyond 91.205:

1 NAV+1 COM (2 preferred) is the minimum I need.

1 NAV + G/S

I did fly back from Charlotte, NC to Grand Rapids MI on a single VOR and a single COM. 5.3 hours, 3.5 actual. GPS is nice, but not needed to make the panel IFR.

Then again we have quite a few GA weenies in the sky that won't fly IFR under any condition w/o an autopilot dual Garmin boxes, on board RADAR, TCAS, etc...
 
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I guess it all depends on what sort of IFR flying do you want to do:

1. Do you want to get your instrument rating or do an IPC in the plane?
2. Do you need to go to airports where GPS is really the only practical appraoch.
3. Do you want to fly to precision (or near precision) minimums?

Frankly more so than the GPS aspect of it, I'm a firm believer in the power of the moving map in promoting IFR safety.
All that will sway the choice of NAV equipment.
 
EdFred said:
beyond 91.205:

1 NAV+1 COM (2 preferred) is the minimum I need.

1 NAV + G/S

I did fly back from Charlotte, NC to Grand Rapids MI on a single VOR and a single COM. 5.3 hours, 3.5 actual. GPS is nice, but not needed to make the panel IFR.

Then again we have quite a few GA weenies in the sky that won't fly IFR under any condition w/o an autopilot dual Garmin boxes, on board RADAR, TCAS, etc...
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Guess it depends on where you are too, around here in the MT mountains you're options get real low if you don't have something GPS/DME to measure distance with. you won't be going into KMSO legally unless they have published something new in the past few months.
 
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