What does an instrument proficiency check entail?

FORANE

FORANE

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FORANE
I need a few approaches for instrument currency - something which tends to happen for me about this time of year. I am considering getting with a CFII for an IPC rather than just do a few approaches. In less than 1 year I will be due for another BFR.

What is required for an IPC?

Does an IPC also satisfy a BFR?
 
The requirements to complete an IPC are in the Instrument PTS.
 
Would you be better off just working with a safety pilot (assuming you are current right now)?
 
nj-pilot said:
Would you be better off just working with a safety pilot (assuming you are current right now)?
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Yes, I guess this is the question I am asking. I am out of 6 month but not 1 year currency.
 
You have your answers. But it's really at the descrecion of the CFII how many and which approaches you do. If the first couple go well partial panel...you might end up doing fewer and less. YMMV :D
 
FORANE said:
Yes, I guess this is the question I am asking. I am out of 6 month but not 1 year currency.
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The answer to that question is more about about proficiency than it is about currency.

An IPC checks your skills against a series of required PTS tasks. Basic maintained currency can be accomplished with 6 identical approaches to the same airport and the familiar missed hold or HILPT with the autopilot flying the airplane the whole time.

That's a continuum, not a this or that. You can certainly do more in a safety pilot scenario than the bare minimum. Many do. Your question, which only you can answer, is where you fit in.
 
If money is no object, then have a CFI bring you current again.
If you're more cost-conscious, then start with a safety pilot and see how you do - but do try to test yourself on multiple approaches and holds, as well as executing an actual IFR flight plan.
 
In fact, when I did my IPC I printed out the summary page from the PTS and the instructor just told me to fly all the items in any order I wanted. After finishing, he just endorsed the bottom of it.
 
flyingron said:
In fact, when I did my IPC I printed out the summary page from the PTS and the instructor just told me to fly all the items in any order I wanted. After finishing, he just endorsed the bottom of it.
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There's an excellent point in this. An IPC does not have to take a huge amount of time. While not quite a "do what you want" I like the idea of pilot and CFI sitting down ahead of time to create a plan of action to combine tasks, cut down on duplication, and organize them in the most efficient way.

One can always do the same with a more personal currency flight whether for instrument currency or other purposes.
 
BTW, don't diminish the very great benefit of finding a flying buddy to keep each other current. When I was still in Denver, I flew with a friend about an evening a month to maintain currency. For years, we'd get together after work, fly a few approaches each, perhaps include some other tasks like partial panel, get back down withing about 2 hours and head out for dinner and a beer.
 
I like to go the safety pilot route,and actual.when using the safety pilot he can keep you honest on the approachs. Then I can be his safety pilot,and your still learning watching his approachs.
 
I'd go up with a CFII or even a non instructor, but I'd want someone who really knows IMC
 
I can tell you from personal experience, don't just go up and repeat the same old bad habits with a "safety pilot". Its actually worth it sometimes to go seek out that "Gold Seal" instructor and get him or her to school ya for a couple of hours. Especially if its been awhile since you've used your ticket for anything other than a VFR on top from the SoCal marine layer.
 
wilkersk said:
I can tell you from personal experience, don't just go up and repeat the same old bad habits with a "safety pilot". Its actually worth it sometimes to go seek out that "Gold Seal" instructor and get him or her to school ya for a couple of hours. Especially if its been awhile since you've used your ticket for anything other than a VFR on top from the SoCal marine layer.
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A friend of mine is an excellent pilot who flies his family (including two young daughters) around everywhere. His goal is proficiency, never merely currency. His system is to arrange an IPC periodically. I think it's every 6 months but I'm not sure because the other part of his system is to rotate CFIIs to get the benefit of different points of view and ideas for ways to emphasize certain tasks.
 
CFIs can also simulate ATC at non towered airports, and make it complicated with scenarios you won't get otherwise.
 
I've done two IPC's with two different CFII's in two different part of the country. There was nothing challenging about them, nor did I learn anything new. The one I needed becuse I was 2 years out of currency, the other I thought I could learn something, but it was really just like flying with a safety pilot other than some questions asked of me while flying.
 
EdFred said:
I've done two IPC's with two different CFII's in two different part of the country. There was nothing challenging about them, nor did I learn anything new. The one I needed becuse I was 2 years out of currency, the other I thought I could learn something, but it was really just like flying with a safety pilot other than some questions asked of me while flying.
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Sadly, I had that experience for the first time after moving here. He didn't even ask me any questions during the flight, except casual questions, chit-chat, that sort of thing. Main difference with flying with a safety pilot is, you have to pay the CFII. And this CFII was not worth it.

I assume though, that he is the exception rather the rule. I certainly never encountered anyone like that in MI and can refer you to at least 3 on my side of the state who are quite good. Seems traveling for an IPC is in my future too. :(
 
I think your odds of having a positive experience are greater with a double "I" than with a safety pilot. All you have to do is ask to be challenged. Or, you could just walk in with a swagger, say you're the best instrument pilot since Jimmy Doolittle and ask for a sign-off without actually flying and let nature take its course.

dtuuri
 
I strongly endorse the idea of a periodic IPC, and have an instructor whose IPC practices tend to challenge me well; he always comes up with new and different scenarios (as a contract pilot who flies all over the globe, he sees a lot of "stuff," and incorporates it into his training plan).

Maybe if, some fine day, my plane flies again, I'll get an IPC and BFR...
 
In terms of challenge, two observations.
First, I have discovered that many instrument pilots are challenged without having to come up with anything special. All they need is something different than they usually do.

A pilot who is used to flying with a modern GPS is likely to be challenged by a "simple" VOR-A approach with GPS inop. I don't one needs to create some unrealistic scenario other than for personal jollies.

Second, the better the pilot, the more likely to come up with her own challenges. Sticking with the same example, the good pilot is going to come up with the idea of doing that VOR-A approach.
 
midlifeflyer said:
A friend of mine is an excellent pilot who flies his family (including two young daughters) around everywhere. His goal is proficiency, never merely currency. His system is to arrange an IPC periodically. I think it's every 6 months but I'm not sure because the other part of his system is to rotate CFIIs to get the benefit of different points of view and ideas for ways to emphasize certain tasks.
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This was my practice, too. Fortunately, in my area there are a number of CFIIs to choose from - I asked a friend who is also a meticulous pilot for the names of a couple that were good and challenging. He gave me some names, and proceeded to tell me a couple to avoid.

It worked out well. We did some challenging stuff - stuff that I wouldn't otherwise have done - including using the #2 navcom (the #1 drove an HSI) under partial panel. Before we started, he asked what I hoped to accomplish - and we went from there. I was quite pleased with the experience and my routine was to do IPCs every 6 to 12 months depending on how much I was flying. Normally, we'd also knock off enough routine flying (since we were up...) to qualify for a Wings level, saving the effort for BFRs.
 
midlifeflyer said:
In terms of challenge, two observations.
First, I have discovered that many instrument pilots are challenged without having to come up with anything special. All they need is something different than they usually do.

A pilot who is used to flying with a modern GPS is likely to be challenged by a "simple" VOR-A approach with GPS inop. I don't one needs to create some unrealistic scenario other than for personal jollies.

Second, the better the pilot, the more likely to come up with her own challenges. Sticking with the same example, the good pilot is going to come up with the idea of doing that VOR-A approach.
Click to expand...

Which is why when I go out to do my 6 with a safety pilot I try and do at least 3 different types of approaches. Although the biggest challenge I have when doing and IPC or the 6+1 is not flying the approaches, but reconfiguring for the next approach while going missed since I usually cram them together and don't have much time between approaches.
 
midlifeflyer said:
In terms of challenge, two observations.
First, I have discovered that many instrument pilots are challenged without having to come up with anything special. All they need is something different than they usually do.

A pilot who is used to flying with a modern GPS is likely to be challenged by a "simple" VOR-A approach with GPS inop. I don't one needs to create some unrealistic scenario other than for personal jollies.

Second, the better the pilot, the more likely to come up with her own challenges. Sticking with the same example, the good pilot is going to come up with the idea of doing that VOR-A approach.
Click to expand...
Very true...the corollary to the Law of Exercise is "That which is not used is lost". Rather quickly, too, might add.

I think the better pilot still needs some outside input periodically, though...another set of eyes, another perspective, another experience base.
 
At this stage, all pilots are instructors, all instructors are students. I suspect the CFII would learn as much from me as I learn from him and vice versa.
 
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