VFR around a congested downtown area

[RileyMitchum]

Hey guys, I am looking into doing a flight around downtown Oklahoma City. My only problem is most of my flying is done outside the Class C and in non-congested areas, so I'm a little uncomfortable in this congested airspace. I have taken the VFR corridor between KOKC and KTIK before, but only straight from point A to B, never any sightseeing around north downtown (Cooridor takes you through S OKC unless you approach from the North). So my question is if a takeoff from say, KPWA and want to sight see around downtown, how would I request that? Also, if I was coming from KOUN and just wanted to go up, circle the area, and head back? I know this is probably a really simple thing, I just want to make sure I don't get the police called on me becuase I'm circling a building too close.

 

[MAKG1]

Class C is not Class B. Flight following is recommended, but not required. Talking to Approach while in Class C is required.

Tell them you want to sightsee around downtown OKC (if that's true). They are quite likely to respond with "squawk XXXX" and ask for your current altitude. At some point, if you get close to jet traffic, you may get asked to say your intentions. You may occasionally get vectored for traffic avoidance, but if you know the active runway, just avoid the extended centerline. If you need to cross it, directly over the airport may be the easiest way.

Class C is not a big deal. Treat it like a really big Class D.

As for the obstruction cops, stay 1000 above the highest obstruction within 2000 feet. Looking at the chart, 3000 MSL ought to do it, except on the north side of town where you'll need another 1000 (TV towers?). You do not need to use VFR altitudes at less than 3000 AGL.

 

[bobmrg]

Hey guys, I am looking into doing a flight around downtown Oklahoma City. My only problem is most of my flying is done outside the Class C and in non-congested areas, so I'm a little uncomfortable in this congested airspace. I have taken the VFR corridor between KOKC and KTIK before, but only straight from point A to B, never any sightseeing around north downtown (Cooridor takes you through S OKC unless you approach from the North). So my question is if a takeoff from say, KPWA and want to sight see around downtown, how would I request that? Also, if I was coming from KOUN and just wanted to go up, circle the area, and head back? I know this is probably a really simple thing, I just want to make sure I don't get the police called on me becuase I'm circling a building too close.

"Oke City Approach, Buzzbomb 1234X, over (landmark, altitude), request flight following for sightseeing tour around the city." Approach: "Cleared as requested, squawk (whatever), maintain VFR below 2500 feet (or whatever), monitor this frequency."

That's pretty much the way it works around Seattle's Class B.

Bob Gardner

 

[RileyMitchum]

Thanks for the quick response! I figured it would be something simple like that, just wanted to verify. I haven't had much experience flying in there so I'm kind of nervous, but I guess the best way to learn is to just do it! Thanks again!

 

[ClimbnSink]

Someone is going to take a picture right? Tell atc it is a photo flight, sounds better then sightseeing and they assume you have the business.

 

[MAKG1]

I really really doubt ATC is going to care, aside from what it might do to his flight track.

If he says it's a photo shoot, they may ask where he wants to orbit. Better have an answer.... When you intend to deceive, you have to be ready.

ATC is not tourist control. All they care about in Class C is keeping you off the obstructions, terrain, and other aircraft, and out of the way of the part 121 traffic. That last part is the point of Class C, though I suspect lots of folks would be upset if the first part went awry.

 

[AggieMike88]

The only thing I'll add is be very aware of any obstacles in your area, especially the towers depicted on the chart.

Looking at the sectional, there are a few near the downtown area up to 1800-ft, and some really tall ones north of the city.

If you want to get some local knowledge, seek out RussR on this board.

 

[Brad Z]

"Oke City Approach, Buzzbomb 1234X, over (landmark, altitude), request flight following for sightseeing tour around the city." Approach: "Cleared as requested, squawk (whatever), maintain VFR below 2500 feet (or whatever), monitor this frequency."

That's pretty much the way it works around Seattle's Class B.

Bob Gardner

I would agree with Bob, except I would substitute "proceed as requested" for "cleared as requested". Controllers dont provide separation of IFR from VFR in class C airspace, and consequently no clearance.

 

[bobmrg]

I would agree with Bob, except I would substitute "proceed as requested" for "cleared as requested". Controllers dont provide separation of IFR from VFR in class C airspace, and consequently no clearance.

I agree. Poor choice of made-up words on my part.

Bob

 

[Tony_Scarpelli]

when I first started I would do these early evening flights as all the commercial traffic has left Wichita by 7pm. Maybe you can go at 8pm and they will have nothing better to do than talk to you. I even practiced some touch and gos on the big airport like that as well and Night landings after 9-10pm. There is very little stress as their is very little traffic.

 

[jpower]

I would agree with Bob, except I would substitute "proceed as requested" for "cleared as requested". Controllers dont provide separation of IFR from VFR in class C airspace, and consequently no clearance.

Haha well it seems like it depends where you are. I was cleared into the Class D just the other day!

 

[Clark1961]

when I first started I would do these early evening flights as all the commercial traffic has left Wichita by 7pm. Maybe you can go at 8pm and they will have nothing better to do than talk to you. I even practiced some touch and gos on the big airport like that as well and Night landings after 9-10pm. There is very little stress as their is very little traffic.

Similar experience around Denver 'though traffic clears out a little later. We used to get t-n-gs at the big airport after 10 pm or so. I've heard they won't do that anymore but haven't tried. Of course you don't have to talk to anyone to do an air tour of downtown Denver at any time of day. Just make sure there isn't a Rockies or Bronco game...they get a little touchy on the stadium TFRs (I have heard those conversations on the radio - not with me, other people).

 

[MAKG1]

Haha well it seems like it depends where you are. I was cleared into the Class D just the other day!

Sometimes Approach uses that language when transiting Class D. The correct phraseology is actually "transition approved." You never need a clearance to enter Class D. You need two-way communication with the entity providing control -- and it isn't always the Tower (there are a handful that don't even have towers -- e.g. KVUO). Approach is trying to tell you they have coordinated it.

 

[Fly-Fla]

I'm a new pilot and have taken several people for a downtown tour over Tallahassee, FL, which is not a big city but is contained within the class C airspace for TLH. I make contact with approach well out from the class C and ask for Flight Following and intention to sightsee over downtown. They usually ask me to stay below 1500 and to call when I am finished and ready to depart the downtown area. We have the Florida State Seminoles Football and Baseball stadiums everyone wants pictures of and sometime the State Capital. I usually just set up a slow circular orbit and when halfway through my last pass call up approach and tell them I'm ready to depart to wherever I'm going next. If I head to the coast (which is the other thing everyone wants to see) I have to pass over the airport and they usually again give me specifics on what they want me to do until I'm clear of traffic. Always a crowd pleaser and I have many photos of Tallahassee now from the air.