University of Dubuque Plane Crash

The pilots and their families are in our prayers.
 
More and more GA airplanes are now equipped with smoke hood and goggles for the crew. We have them in the King Air, but I haven't put them in the 180--yet.

Back when, we made a set of "smoke goggles" with nearly opaque lenses that we smuggled into the sims to demonstrate impaired vision. Pilots were astounded by the sudden helpless feeling.

I learned how quickly smoke can fill a compartment while still in college. Borrowed a friend's 51 Ford for a date, parked under a secluded bridge with current squeeze, leaning back in seat with knees on dash when all hell broke loose. Smoke, flames, strange odors filled the entire car in an instant. Found later that my knee was holding the cigarette lighter against the contact, causing it to overheat and ignite all the tobacco particles and whatever else were back in the hole. We drove back to town, figured out the problem and had a good laugh. She then said she had a headache and wanted to go back to the dorm.

flyingcheesehead said:
Ugh... Another one where it sounds like the fire may have started in the air and they tried for the closest airport. :(



http://www.thonline.com/article.cfm?id=214832
Click to expand...
 
kevin47881 said:
ROFLMAO, that's one hell of a story Wayne. :rofl::yes::rofl::yes:

No disrespect to the thread intended.
Click to expand...

Thanks, and in the interest of full and fair disclosure I should also divulge that this event occurred during the period that Richard Pryor accurately (for me anyway) referred to on HBO as "the great ***** drought of the 50's."
 
Greg Bockelman said:
Not too many places to go up there, IIRC. :(
Click to expand...

Well Greg, I think if I was on fire I'd probably put it in the big frickin' river that runs right next to the runway at Cassville, rather than into cabins. You may have heard of it, it's called the Mississippi...

You're right though, lots of terrain and trees in that area. If it was simply "smoke" I can't say that I'd go for a swim right away, and that may have been their exact thought process.
 
Kent the cabin could have been thick with smoke and perhaps they couldn't see past their nose.
 
Is it speculation of a fire while airborne? I believe I met Grant once while preflighting our club plane. Seemed like a good guy. Sad that something like this happened so early in his career. Greg is correct...not too many places to go where they were. As for a water landing....I went through DUNKER training for heli's and have some sort of feeling/respect how bad it is to go in the drink. Then you have to issue of swimming until rescued. Not a good situation no matter how you look at it.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
Well Greg, I think if I was on fire I'd probably put it in the big frickin' river that runs right next to the runway at Cassville, rather than into cabins. You may have heard of it, it's called the Mississippi...

You're right though, lots of terrain and trees in that area. If it was simply "smoke" I can't say that I'd go for a swim right away, and that may have been their exact thought process.
Click to expand...

It sounds like they thought they wanted to try and make the runway and came up short. Something happened. It's always more than one thing that leads to it. Hopefully soon they will figure something out.
 
Last I checked the two were still in critical condition.

I have many hours in that particular plane and another Trinidad at UD. I cannot imagine what they must have gone through. I am thankful these people are still alive and hope they pull through. The University of Dubuque is a very small college, so when something happens to anyone there, it hits home to everyone. I don't know the people involved, but just knowing it happened at my school with a plane I used to fly gives me a sick-in-the-gut feeling. I have been into and out of Cassville with it, which was quite a challenge in normal conditions.

I will be very interested to find out what caused the accident.
 
Last edited:
skyflyer8 said:
Last I checked the two were still in critical condition.

I have many hours in that particular plane and another Trinidad at UD. I cannot imagine what they must have gone through. I am thankful these people are still alive and hope they pull through. The University of Dubuque is a very small college, so when something happens to anyone there, it hits home to everyone. I don't know the people involved, but just knowing it happened at my school with a plane I used to fly gives me a sick-in-the-gut feeling. I have been into and out of Cassville with it, which was quite a challenge in normal conditions.

I will be very interested to find out what caused the accident.
Click to expand...

How was the fly-in breakfast at DBQ today? The flying club from school was thinking about flying up there for it, but I mentioned that the mood might be fairly solemn for a fly-in.
 
As of yesterday (Monday) the victims were still in critical condition. There are still rumors of smoke in the cockpit possibly due to an electrical problem.
 
skyflyer8 said:
As of yesterday (Monday) the victims were still in critical condition. There are still rumors of smoke in the cockpit possibly due to an electrical problem.
Click to expand...

With a friend who was just released from the hospital, fully two months after being badly burned in a plane crash, I know what these poor fellows (and their families) must be going through. It's not fun, or pretty.

Our prayers go out to the families...
 
None of the Trinnies I've flown had window vents - everything came through the lever controlled-scoop on the side of the plane into ducts and out eyeball vents. And the emergency procedures call for shutting the cabin air off, which is good in one way, but bad in another - you've got no air circulating around the panel area to feed a fire, but no air circulating around to clear smoke around the pilots.

Think I might buy one of those smoke hoods. The Evacu-8 models were recalled, but Sporty's has the Drager unit for a decent price.

I look forward to more information, and hope for the recovery of the pilots. Sounds like they did well, maintaining a reasonable level of control when they might not have been able to see anything.
 
Last edited:
TMetzinger said:
Think I might buy one of those smoke hoods. The Evacu-8 models were recalled, but Sporty's has the Drager unit for a decent price.
Click to expand...

If the Drager unit is of the same quality as the SCBA equipment of theirs I learned on years ago, it should be solid.
 
Ghery said:
If the Drager unit is of the same quality as the SCBA equipment of theirs I learned on years ago, it should be solid.
Click to expand...

Looks like a good unit. While having it would be better than NOT having it, getting it out, prepped and properly put on, while trying to maintain control of the airplane, is still a huge effort. And, if you had no way to vent the smoke, how would see the instruments to control the aircraft to the ground? (Just wondering...)

Here's a video that describes the use of it:

http://www.draeger.com/ST/internet/video/player.jsp?video=/ST/internet/video/MH/parat-c_en.flv
 
Last edited:
TangoWhiskey said:
Looks like a good unit. While having it would be better than NOT having it, getting it out, prepped and properly put on, while trying to maintain control of the airplane, is still a huge effort. And, if you had no way to vent the smoke, how would see the instruments to control the aircraft to the ground? (Just wondering...)

Here's a video that describes the use of it:

http://www.draeger.com/ST/internet/video/player.jsp?video=/ST/internet/video/MH/parat-c_en.flv
Click to expand...
I wonder whether the TSA will freak out with one in my flight bag? So far the only flight bag items I've had to check have been the fuel tester/screwdriver and the D-cell flashlight. The radio, headsets, chart, scale, etc are all looked at but passed.
 
To bad they weren’t wearing Nomex suits and gloves; may have helped with the burns. I see more and more civilians wearing Nomex. The chair of the Dubuque aviation department is ex military so he knows the value of fire resistant clothing. Hope he reexamines his policies.
 
Unregistered said:
I see more and more civilians wearing Nomex.
Click to expand...

Where do you see civilians wearing Nomex? Racetracks and dragstrips notwithstanding.

I can't say that I ever have, except a civilain warbird pilot or two, and even then it's rare. Certainly not any regular GA types.


Trapper John
 
It's pretty standard to wear Nomex in the civilian helicopter EMS (HEMS) world, and the Red Star Pilots recommend them as well (the Yak guys).

William Wynne, the Corvair guy, talks about wearing nomex on his website after an incident years ago where he sustained burns in a Pietenpol crash.

Food for thought...

-Ryan
 
MedFlightDoc said:
It's pretty standard to wear Nomex in the civilian helicopter EMS (HEMS) world, and the Red Star Pilots recommend them as well (the Yak guys).

William Wynne, the Corvair guy, talks about wearing nomex on his website after an incident years ago where he sustained burns in a Pietenpol crash.

Food for thought...

-Ryan
Click to expand...

Interesting - thanks for the info.

I suppose the Nomex isn't of much value if you're knocked unconscious during the crash, so a helmet would probably need to be part of the ensemble...


Trapper John
 
Unregistered said:
To bad they weren’t wearing Nomex suits and gloves; may have helped with the burns. I see more and more civilians wearing Nomex. The chair of the Dubuque aviation department is ex military so he knows the value of fire resistant clothing. Hope he reexamines his policies.
Click to expand...

WHO ARE YOU? You think HIS policies are at fault? Oh give me a break.
 
I still have one set of USCG blue rompers that I've kept for sentimental reasons. I'm going to visit CAP tomorrow and start the process of joining a squadron, if I like what I hear.
 
Trapper John said:
Where do you see civilians wearing Nomex? Racetracks and dragstrips notwithstanding.

I can't say that I ever have, except a civilain warbird pilot or two, and even then it's rare. Certainly not any regular GA types.


Trapper John
Click to expand...

A friend of mine always wears his Nomex suit that he got when he was racing cars whenever he flies the Glasair he built. He told me he started this when the plane was new and unproven and just got in the habit.
 
TMetzinger said:
I still have one set of USCG blue rompers that I've kept for sentimental reasons. I'm going to visit CAP tomorrow and start the process of joining a squadron, if I like what I hear.
Click to expand...
No more blue rompers. Those are fazed out it is the sage green bags that everyone else wears nowadays.

Even the new ADCs are not blue, they are international orange.
 
Unregistered said:
To bad they weren’t wearing Nomex suits and gloves; may have helped with the burns. I see more and more civilians wearing Nomex. The chair of the Dubuque aviation department is ex military so he knows the value of fire resistant clothing. Hope he reexamines his policies.
Click to expand...

This is perfect example of Monday morning quarterbacking. Maybe you can elaborate on his policies? Did someone want to wear Nomex and was rejected and forced to wear a shirt and tie? Also remember the military flies different missions that vary greatly with the GA population that would require a more proactive approach to fire burn prevention.
 
Last edited:
Report is out - Open door in flight, diverted to close it, had to go around which ripped the door back open, loss of control.

There is no open-door procedure in the POH, just a prohibition on flying with the door open. No flight testing of the airplane was done with doors open either. :hairraise:

Having had a door open on me in flight in a couple of different airplanes, this seems rather surprising - And the gull-wing doors on the Trinnie aren't just going to sit there either, like an open door would on most airplanes.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
Report is out - Open door in flight, diverted to close it, had to go around which ripped the door back open, loss of control.

There is no open-door procedure in the POH, just a prohibition on flying with the door open. No flight testing of the airplane was done with doors open either. :hairraise:

Having had a door open on me in flight in a couple of different airplanes, this seems rather surprising - And the gull-wing doors on the Trinnie aren't just going to sit there either, like an open door would on most airplanes.
Click to expand...

Sad.

The top hinged doors on my LSA lift up against the bottom of the wing (wham!) if they come unlatched in flight - I would assume that gull wing doors on a low wing aircraft might do something similar - open all the way. I would also assume that on a "real" airplane, the drag / air flow disturbance over the tail from that type of door being open would be a lot worse.
 
Old Thread: Hello . There have been no replies in this thread for 365 days.
Content in this thread may no longer be relevant.
Perhaps it would be better to start a new thread instead.
Back
Top