Trip Report: San Diego to Las Vegas via L61

thebruce

thebruce

Pre-takeoff checklist
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the Bruce
After posting this question about VFR into LAS, and asking for advice on remote airfields here, I wanted to post a quick follow-up in the event anyone is interested. As a new PPASEL, I have learned quite a bit from this board and wanted to see if I could return the favor.

The purpose of the trip was to drop two friends off at Shoshone (L61) on Saturday for their legs of
a relay race that goes from Baker, California to Las Vegas, then continue on to Vegas to run my own leg later that night. Took off from KCRQ into beautiful CAVU conditions, and had a great flight to L61 at 9,500. Had flight following the entire way, as well as great visibility on other traffic via WingX Pro + Stratux w/ AHRS. As luck would have it, about 15 miles out of Shoshone I saw a contact from the ADS-B feed on the ground at Shoshone, so I switched to CTAF and sure enough heard him make a call that he was taking the active. I told him my intentions and asked for a quick wind check, which turned out to be exactly as I had anticipated. A nice centerline greaser (couldn't resist!) and we were on the deck in less than half the time it would have taken to drive. And of course flying somewhere that everyone else has to drive to is priceless.

After dropping off my passengers I climbed out of Shoshone and turned for Sin City. As expected, I could not raise Las Vegas approach until over the ridgeline to the West. Once I had established comm, I stated "VFR direct McCarran if able," having already planned for KHND if McCarran was too busy for a lowly Cherokee. I was given a squawk, and right as I hit the west edge of the Class B was told "make some left turns and I'l squeeze you in soon." I was about 270 degrees into my turns and got told to proceed for a four mile final for 1L and contact tower. Although I wasn't asked to keep the speed up I did anyway, and did a no flap landing since I had the full length of the runway to work with and I was parking at Atlantic which is at the extreme north end. Once clear of the runway Ground gave me some simple taxi instructions and off I went. About halfway to Atlantic I noticed their 'Follow Me' truck alongside me, and I was guided to parking, which was pretty cool to a me as a new guy showing up in a rented 1966 Cherokee. Super courteous staff at Atlantic had me in and out quickly, and as I waited for the free shuttle a couple pilots from EasyJet offered me a ride to my hotel. A nice finish to my best day so far in GA.

We departed KLAS on Monday, and other than a minor delay waiting for about 10 commercial airliners to depart, we got off the ground with no hassle. I will have to say that I would not have known to call up Clearance Delivery to ask for a VFR departure to the south had I not seen it on the board here. If I hadn't read that technique here I would have just called ground and asked to taxi with the ATIS like I do at my home drome Class D. Once in the air Tower gave me a course and altitude to stay out of the way of the departing traffic, and Departure Control did the same for a bit before permitting me to resume own nav. Easy flight home after that.

So to anyone who is reluctant to take his or her first trip to a busy airport, go for it! Do your homework, plan your contingencies, and if your experience is anything like mine you will have a great trip.
 
thebruce said:
We departed KLAS on Monday, and other than a minor delay waiting for about 10 commercial airliners to depart, we got off the ground with no hassle. I will have to say that I would not have known to call up Clearance Delivery to ask for a VFR departure to the south had I not seen it on the board here. If I hadn't read that technique here I would have just called ground and asked to taxi with the ATIS like I do at my home drome Class D. Once in the air Tower gave me a course and altitude to stay out of the way of the departing traffic, and Departure Control did the same for a bit before permitting me to resume own nav. Easy flight home after that..
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You call CD at every B and C airport before departing (unless staying in the pattern(not very common on class Bs though/and if AFD says otherwise).
Since you require a clearance to enter B airspace, the clearance you normally receive from CD is "cleared out of the Las Vegas class Bravo airspace".

Tower can sometimes coordinate this, but the "standard" procedure is to talk to CD before taxi at any airport where you contact departure controller after takeoff (so B/C airports).

I usually fly into the big airports when visiting a new city. It's fun. I've done 5 now (JFK, TPA, MIA, SAN, LAS). Always a great experience!
Landing to San Diego was fun, we got vectored around a bit to join the sequence between two 737's. And the approach to 27 is cool anyway :)
 
Glad you had a great trip! No report of fuel cost or ramp/parking fee?
 
BillTIZ said:
Glad you had a great trip! No report of fuel cost or ramp/parking fee?
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Great question Bill. I figured I'd wait to see if someone asked. I'm glad it came before any discussion of common purpose and if my friends paid me!

First let me say that service at Atlantic was top notch, both on the ramp and in their facility. First class all the way. Security Fee was $15.00, the Facility Fee of $40 was waived (presumably because I got fuel, but I didn't ask), and parking was $40 per night. Considering I walked to the plane from my hotel to fly out, the parking fee was paid for in the savings of not having to take a cab or uber from Henderson. The big hit money-wise was fuel. $8.52 per gallon for 100LL. The club I rent the plane from will reimburse me the cost of fuel at my home drome because I pay a wet rental rate, so I'm out about $1.80 per gallon because of the price at KLAS. If I do it again I will probably ask Atlantic for the minimum amount of fuel to get the fee waived instead of topping off and paying for 25 gallons. That's about the only change I would make.
 
mtuomi said:
You call CD at every B and C airport before departing (unless staying in the pattern(not very common on class Bs though/and if AFD says otherwise).
Since you require a clearance to enter B airspace, the clearance you normally receive from CD is "cleared out of the Las Vegas class Bravo airspace".
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Great info, thanks! Always learning.
 
Leg 13. My partners in crime (fighting) had 6 and 7, so Shoshone was perfect. I was sure there'd be some traffic there, but other than the pattern call as I was approaching, I had it to myself. Next year we're going to do 5, 6, and 7 and all fly on to LAS. Did you/have you run it?
 
thebruce said:
Leg 13. My partners in crime (fighting) had 6 and 7, so Shoshone was perfect. I was sure there'd be some traffic there, but other than the pattern call as I was approaching, I had it to myself. Next year we're going to do 5, 6, and 7 and all fly on to LAS. Did you/have you run it?
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Neg. The year I was going to run they donated me to the B2V staff to work a handoff spot. So I got dropped off at the OLD leg 17 or 18 (top of the mountain) which is now I think 16. 8pm Saturday night till 6am Sunday. Then I had to drive the follow vehicle because the people that were supposed to a) pick me up at 4am and b) supposed to follow the runner were too inebriated to function properly.

I got back to the hotel at 10am and fell asleep. Missed all the fun. And the LASD Homicide barbecue.

B2V did me wrong. I've vowed never to return. Lol
 
Sounds like a cool trip. I look forward to doing these types of trips once I get my PPL. Btw, pretty sure those weren't easyjet pilots lol
 
great PIREP. thank you for posting. It sounds like you were very well prepared. Good on ya for doing the legwork before the flight to make it smooth!
 
Thanks for the PIREP! I am planning to head out towards the Vegas area this coming weekend if the weather holds out and plan to do the same, plan on HND but pop into LAS if able. I'll be departing from MYF and heading up via the Cajon pass.. more or less following the 15 the whole pay. I am planning for 7,500 enroute in the SR20

**Questions about the ridges, I plan to be on flight following for most of the way, but will there be areas that I can expect to be out of radio comms? I imagine at 7,500 I should be fine most of the way but curious if anyone had some experience with this heading that way from the Socal area, thanks!
 
Tantalum said:
**Questions about the ridges, I plan to be on flight following for most of the way, but will there be areas that I can expect to be out of radio comms? I imagine at 7,500 I should be fine most of the way but curious if anyone had some experience with this heading that way from the Socal area, thanks!
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No, but 9500 would be better for other reasons. Bring sunglasses for the solar farm near WHIGG.
 
Thanks, depending on the DAs that day I'll push for 9,500.. 8,500 for the way back should be fine. It's an SR20 so the climb rates aren't spectacular but it will be just two of us so will be well below gross
 
Great report.

Busy airspace and and busy airports...even Bravos...are not at all scary of you know what to expect. Only times I have heard pilots shooed away were those fumbling on the radio totally unprepared. Come in with a clue and they will treat ya just like the big boys!
 
Tantalum said:
Thanks, depending on the DAs that day I'll push for 9,500.. 8,500 for the way back should be fine. It's an SR20 so the climb rates aren't spectacular but it will be just two of us so will be well below gross
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At those altitudes you may drop off LA Center radar coverage between Baker and the spring Mountain range, they normally let you know and will send you over to LAS TRACON. It's best to come in south of Mt Potosi (Goodsprings) gives more time before the Class B.

You will not get LAS ATIS until line of sight to the airport.
 
Shawn said:
Great report.

Busy airspace and and busy airports...even Bravos...are not at all scary of you know what to expect. Only times I have heard pilots shooed away were those fumbling on the radio totally unprepared. Come in with a clue and they will treat ya just like the big boys!
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Mmm. Kinda. It's Vegas. They're not great about VFR in the Bravo, but they also have a limited amount of space in the valley to vector stuff, so they're kinda stuffy about it.

They're not as bad as Chicago, but they're up there in the "VFR unfriendly" list.

Lots of Bravos are quite accommodating. Vegas, it's hit or miss.
 
Yeah the locals here mostly told me to skip LAS and head to HND. Which is fine by me to be honest.
 
Some may not know that Las Vegas gets 400,000 visitors a week. That's a LOT of flights. But as long as you make your radio calls properly and comply with instructions they will not treat you differently than any other flight. The biggest hazard in Vegas is wind and mountains, not the controllers.
 
citizen5000 said:
Some may not know that Las Vegas gets 400,000 visitors a week. That's a LOT of flights. But as long as you make your radio calls properly and comply with instructions they will not treat you differently than any other flight. The biggest hazard in Vegas is wind and mountains, not the controllers.
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Agreed. Flown in both IFR and VFR. Never had any issues with controllers.
 
Tantalum said:
Thanks for the PIREP! I am planning to head out towards the Vegas area this coming weekend if the weather holds out and plan to do the same, plan on HND but pop into LAS if able. I'll be departing from MYF and heading up via the Cajon pass.. more or less following the 15 the whole pay. I am planning for 7,500 enroute in the SR20

**Questions about the ridges, I plan to be on flight following for most of the way, but will there be areas that I can expect to be out of radio comms? I imagine at 7,500 I should be fine most of the way but curious if anyone had some experience with this heading that way from the Socal area, thanks!
Click to expand...
Did the flight from MYF to HND in a 172 in 06 didn't have anywhere we lost comms
 
sferguson524 said:
Did the flight from MYF to HND in a 172 in 06 didn't have anywhere we lost comms
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Cool, thanks, that's where I'll be leaving from. Weather looks like it should hold out this weekend, will be just checking the winds this week
 
Tantalum said:
Cool, thanks, that's where I'll be leaving from. Weather looks like it should hold out this weekend, will be just checking the winds this week
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I flew over JLI and up the desert.. had to thread a couple R spaces, but wasnt bad.. the way back, we followed 15 and diverted to f70 for weather.

IIRC my route was JLI TNP ZELMA I think i took that routing because my ex was afraid of the mountain passes, and the weather was not fantastic on the more direct route, but over the desert was fantastic
 
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MetalCloud said:
Agreed. Flown in both IFR and VFR. Never had any issues with controllers.
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I didn't want to give the impression I ever "had any issues" with them either. They're just busy, it's a small valley, and the phrase "Remain Clear of Class Bravo Airspace" is one of the tools they have in their Bat Belt, and use it fairly frequently.

There's plenty of ways in and out, anyway. It's just not the friendliest Bravo for VFR operators requesting services.

Given the choice, I'd rather be told to remain clear of the Bravo, than tangle with an airliner! ;)
 
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