Transition through the MOA

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Jason608

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Jason608
I am planning two XCs over the next week and one has to go through a MOA (via ADIZ). The other I will easily go 10 minutes out of the way and avoid the edge of the MOA.

Couple questions I have:

1. What are your thoughts on going through an active MOA?
2. Will Flight Following provide flight seperation from military traffic?
3. Would military traffic show up via ADS-B/Stratus?

I have always avoided active and non active MOAs.


Thanks,
Jason
 
Going through an active MOA is usually a non-event. There are a bunch squished together in the middle of the state between KSRQ (Sarasota) and the east coast. I fly through them all the time.

The restricted areas I usually have to ask about whether they are hot or not, if they are that's an annoying re-route, but necessary.

I can't say about ADS-B indications of military. For flight following if you are VFR you are responsible for your own separation. Flight following isn't a guarantee of separation from anything. ATC will give you traffic alerts, but that doesn't mean they'll alert you to EVERYTHING nearby. You are still solely responsible for looking outside the plane and avoiding other VFR traffic.

If you are IFR that may be another situation entirely.
 
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1. I do it all the time.
2. Maybe, but wouldn't rely on it.
3. I don't know, no experience not equipped.
 
Jason608 said:
1. What are your thoughts on going through an active MOA?
2. Will Flight Following provide flight seperation from military traffic?
3. Would military traffic show up via ADS-B/Stratus?
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1. Definitely doable. If it is small I will avoid it because I have been on the other side of the equation where I had to stop working because a Cessna was going through the area.
2. He will give you the same traffic advisories as he will in any other airspace.
3. Maybe, maybe not. Depends on what they are doing. I will say when you get a traffic call out, fighters will be very hard to see.
 
There is a difference between active and hot...just cuz it is active does not mean that it is being used when you wanna transition.

I always just plan on plowing straight through. If ATC advised that there is indeed hot and being used I will vector around but that has been rare that I have had to make any deviations through an active MOA.

Even though you have every right legally to barge through hot or not...unless there is a VERY substantial reason why I can not divert around...I will give them space if they are in the area. Don't be jerk just cuz you can!
 
I went though an "inactive" MOA in upstate New York once (a long time ago...) Just as I crossed over the magenta line two F-4 Phantoms filled my windshield as they dove past. I did a 180 and went around.... I still go through them if it means a long trek around but never take for granted the "inactive" designation at the time of entry... I guess I should never take "anything" for granted when flying, eh?
 
Going through those MOAs are a non-event. For REAL fun sometime, go down through Gila Bend and AJO, straight through the active restricted area. Really. There is a provision to transition the active restricted area if you contact the gunnery range controller "Snake-Eye" (127.75 or 122.775) and get permission. You fly from Gila Bend to Ajo, directly of the highway, at 500 AGL... while they conduct missions over you or to the sides! We've done it a couple of times. Actually, the controllers told us they'd rather have you go directly through the restricted area, so at least they know where you are. Through the MOA, it's see-and-avoid for everyone.

Snake-eye tele is 623-856-8818. If they don't answer, the office is closed and the Restricted area is inactive, so call Albuquerque to confirm.

I'm not sure I'd count on FF to protect you... one time, they allowed us to get within seconds from busting active R-2304, without saying a word! It happened to be a Saturday when they were active.
 
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As others have said, passing through a MOA while VFR is a non event. Never hurts to ask of it is active though. I will ask if a restricted area is hot or cold before going through.

Here in the south west if I went around every MOA or restricted area then I would never get where I need to go.
 
What about going under Sells low? Looks like plenty of room. Of course, you can go through if you like.
 
We've done Sells before, without a problem, coming back for customs at Tucson. 'Nice views of Kitt Peak. Lots of Phoenix flyers do Sells when going to Rocky Point or points South.
 
Sells is the MOA I was planning on going through. Thanks for all the replies.
 
You can always asked. I regularly go through MOAs and even hot restricted areas. Often the controllers (if you can get to the actual guys using the facility) are pretty reasonable.

About ten years ago we had the Navion society convention at Southport, NC. We had a fly-out to FFA and your options are to either snake your way around all the areas inland or go way out to sea. With a little research, Margy found out who at Lejeune to call. Sure enough they had no problem. With a little discussion with them staring at a Sectional, I found their Point Mike and Point Kilo reporting points. We briefed our flight and headed up the coast. Wilmington Approach warned us about the R-areas but we told them we had prior permission.

Margy was flying the lead and we had the planes in trail behind. I call Lejeune and let them know we were at Point Mike and they clear us in. The #2 ship calls in and everything is going well until Lejeune tells the #2 ship to hold a minute while they stop firing. Now I'm a mile ahead of him. I quickly ask if I need to hold too. Oh yeah, that would be a good idea.

We all got in. We managed to stuff like 20 Navions onto the FFA ramp (if you have been there you'd know that's tight. We did have to move a plane to let a 172 that was already there out when he wanted to go.
 
Transitioning through a hot Restricted Area is the exception, not the rule. I'm surprised that it ever occurs as it's quite expensive to hold up activities inside a Restricted Area (and possibly hazardous) all for the convenience of some civilians. Now if the Restricted Area was cold, it's a different story.
 
Witmo said:
Transitioning through a hot Restricted Area is the exception, not the rule. I'm surprised that it ever occurs as it's quite expensive to hold up activities inside a Restricted Area (and possibly hazardous) all for the convenience of some civilians. Now if the Restricted Area was cold, it's a different story.
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Well I don't know where you fly, but it isn't uncommon around here on the east coast where we have some areas of wall-to-wall R-areas like the NC coast or the lower Chesapeake. I've been cleared through hot areas on quite a number of occasions.
 
flyingron said:
Well I don't know where you fly, but it isn't uncommon around here on the east coast where we have some areas of wall-to-wall R-areas like the NC coast or the lower Chesapeake. I've been cleared through hot areas on quite a number of occasions.
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Are you saying you were cleared through actual 'hot areas' or that you were cleared through Restricted Areas?

I've never heard of civilian aircraft IFR or VFR getting cleared through an active hot area east or west coast.
 
I try to stay out of MOA's while active. The best way to get up to the minute info about status is from the controlling ATC. Many are Notam'ed hot but only used part of that time, or at an altitude that isn't a factor.

Not saying I've never cut through the edge or took a small slice off the bottom.
 
Witmo said:
Transitioning through a hot Restricted Area is the exception, not the rule. I'm surprised that it ever occurs as it's quite expensive to hold up activities inside a Restricted Area (and possibly hazardous) all for the convenience of some civilians. Now if the Restricted Area was cold, it's a different story.
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Actually, the General Counsel issued a letter of interpretation about three years ago. The regs say you have to have "permission from the controlling agency" to transit a Restricted Area. But as everyone knows, if it's hot you stay out and if it's cold you can blast right on through. The letter stated that Restricted Areas only exist when they're hot. Interesting way to look at it.
 
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