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Michael

Michael

Pattern Altitude
Joined
Feb 27, 2005
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1,735
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Cape Cod, MA
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CapeCodMichael
My partner asked me this week if I wanted to go in on a hanger for the mooney, I jumped on it and said yes. Well, turns out, there is a third party involved who we share the hangar with, and he so kindly moved my mooney into the hanger and locked it up. he gave my partner a key, who gave me a copy, and it doesnt work. this third party who has the only friggin key is out of town for a week and i need to get my plane out tonight to pick up my daughter in california. I called the airport manager and he said I am not on the lease, he cannot let me in, unless said third party man calls him. I have left several phone messages and just get voice mail. Since i have reported the problem to the airport manager i dont dare break the lock now. Im pretty much screwed waiting on this guy to call...if he ever will.

GRRRRR

Michael
 
I think you have a legal right of access and if its a padlock, boltcutters could free your airplane! (there are often other ways to defeat hangar security without leaving a trace, sad to say) but be sure about the legal thing first, wouldn't want to end up in the hoosegow over it.
 
I dunno michael - if he's gonna be gone for a week, I'd cut the lock, and replace it with another one. When he gets back into town, give him a copy of the key.

Its your airplane.
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
I think you have a legal right of access and if its a padlock, boltcutters could free your airplane! (there are often other ways to defeat hangar security without leaving a trace, sad to say) but be sure about the legal thing first, wouldn't want to end up in the hoosegow over it.
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Dave,

I'm not so sure. Unless there is paperwork to document it, there may be no legal right of access. And despite the airplane being in there, busting in can earn a breaking and entering charge.

Lawyers: pay 'em now or pay 'em later....
 
While you may be on the title of the property inside the hanger, it does not give you the right to tamper with or damage someone elses property to gain access to what is legally yours. You do not have any paper to substantiate your claim to the legal use of the hanger. IOW, you may find yourself in a criminal suit with the hanger owner. Ixnay the bolt cutters. In this day and age, bolt cutters on an airport could land you in hot water. At least, you'll be explaining yourself to aprt admin/security.

An alternative would be to get a locksmith involved after you have notified aprt admin what you are ablut to do. Have the locksmith make you a key that does fit the existing locks or to rekey with new locks. Locksmith charges backcharged to the 3rd party and you're on your way to get your daughter. 3rd party was negligent to issue you a key which does not work and then leave no contact info to address problems.

Where is your partner in all of this???
 
Well. I had enough. Called the Airport manager again and asked what would happen if I was to cut the lock off. He told me that he would not pursue it unless the owner of the hangar (which is the nit wit who gave us the bad key) complains. So i went out and bought a combination lock and told my partner the combo. I am heading out to the airport in an hour to cut off his lock and free willie...err the mooney.
If this guy has a problem with me cutting the lock...then I guess I will have a problem, but at least I will be able to spend the weekend with my daughter. That would be worth a weekend in jail or whatever they want to throw at me. I guess he shouldve been more careful in the handling of the keys.

Michael..aka jail bird..maybe.
 
if you get any complaints or threats of B&E Michael, just tell them your lawyer is going to charge them with both theft of property over $100,000 value, and a civil suit for loss of use, pain and suffering. Have a good weekend with your daughter!
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
if you get any complaints or threats of B&E Michael, just tell them your lawyer is going to charge them with both theft of property over $100,000 value, and a civil suit for loss of use, pain and suffering. Have a good weekend with your daughter!
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The aircraft represents the FREEDOM to go. We resist encroachments upon that freedom.
 
Was going to suggest the locksmith alternative myself, but the cutting of the lock seems fine too. If this guy would really expect you to go a week without your airplane due to an error of his (I always try key copies multiple times before relying on them!) then you may want to reconsider if he's the sort you'd want to share a hangar with anyway (does he have a plane in the same hangar?). My guess is he will feel terrible about his error and have no problem with the cutting.

Enjoy the weekend!
 
Thanks for the support guys. I got her out, and parked her in my regular outside spot. All fueled up and ready for a 6am takeoff. w00t.

Michael
 
Funny thing Michael: just reading that your plane was locked up, out of your reach, made me cringe. And it ain't even my plane!

I was going to recommend bolt cutters too, but common sense prevailed early.
 
gibbons said:
I would not hesitate. Enjoy your weekend.
Click to expand...

Yep, cut the lock. I wouldn't have given it a second thought. At most you'd be liable for the cost of a new lock unless someone else was able to get past your new lock and steal what's inside.
 
Michael;

I am glad you got your bird out. Like the others I would have not hesitated. Have a great weekend.

John
 
You went about it the wrong way.. well NOT really, but I think my way would have been alot more interesting. :D

Called the third party and left ONE message that said the following..

"Hi, Third Party. I've been given a key to the hanger door lock where my plane's stored. Unless I hear otherwise from you in the next 20 minutes, I can only conclude I have your permission to access my plane that's inside. Bye.."

..Then 20 minutes later I would cut the lock.

Now I'm NOT a lawyer, but I would think by giving you a key (even though it was bad), third party has indirectly given you permission to access the hanger. After all.. if he DIDN'T want you to get in, you wouldn't have been given a key in the first place.

Dakota Duce

"May All Your Flights Be Of Good Weather!"
 
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Dakota Duce said:
You went about it the wrong way.. well NOT really, but I think my way would have been alot more interesting. :D

Called the third party and left ONE message that said the following..

"Hi, Third Party. I've been given a key to the hanger door lock where my plane's stored. Unless I hear otherwise from you in the next 20 minutes, I can only conclude I have your permission to access my plane that's inside. Bye.."

..Then 20 minutes later I would cut the lock.

Now I'm NOT a lawyer, but I would think by giving you a key (even though it was bad), third party has indirectly given you permission to access the hanger. After all.. if he DIDN'T want you to get in, you wouldn't have been given a key in the first place.

Dakota Duce

"May All Your Flights Be Of Good Weather!"
Click to expand...

Mr. 3rd party DIDN'T give Michael a key. Michael's partner accepted a facsimile of a key, which he then issued to Michael. A non-working key is not tacit approval of access to the hanger.

I am not a lawyer but I have been on both sides of these kind of things--you'd be surprised by the myriad twists and turns these things take in the courtroom.
 
Richard said:
Mr. 3rd party DIDN'T give Michael a key. Michael's partner accepted a facsimile of a key, which he then issued to Michael. A non-working key is not tacit approval of access to the hanger.
I am not a lawyer but I have been on both sides of these kind of things--you'd be surprised by the myriad twists and turns these things take in the courtroom.
Click to expand...


What lock?
 
Yeah, Mike be sure to tell us how it turns out. I can bake a good cake-with-a-file-hidden-in-it!
J/K!
 
Richard..

It's obvious YOU didn't read into the situation and think out your reply. Look what Michael post said..

1.) There is a Third Party who Michael and his partner SHARE a hangar with.

(Seeing all three SHARE the hanger together and nothing was stated otherwise, then all three have given the other two their unspoken permission to access/use the hanger.)

2.) Mr Third Party moved Michael's Mooney into the hanger and locked it up.

(If Mr Third Party did NOT want Michael to access/use the hanger and thus be able to fly his own plane, then he would NOT have moved the plane into the hanger in the first place).

3.) Mr. Third Party WILLINGLY gave Michael's partner a key.

(Just add both #1 and #2 above. It's self-explanatory. That's why they equal 3!)

Dakota Duce

"May All Your Flights Be Of Good Weather!"
 
We could arrange a protest! "FREE THE MOONEY!! FREE THE MOONEY!!"

I'll make the signs.

Everyone else in CA protests, might as well do one for a good cause! :)
 
Well everything turned out good. I recieved a call while i was flying back from California from the 3rd party guy and he left a message saying sorry for the problems. I almost wish I had left the plane locked in the hangar, my daughters school clothes shopping cost me almost 1000.00 bucks :hairraise:
But she is very happy and that makes me happy too :)
 
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