Teenage girl wearing a helmet dies in Breckenridge ski accident

Discussion in 'Medical Topics' started by Mtns2Skies, Nov 21, 2009.

  1. Mtns2Skies

    Mtns2Skies Super Moderator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2008
    Messages:
    3,410
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mtns2Skies
    I left Breckenridge a couple days before this happened, It was my favorite run (open, although a little on the easy side) and I was comfortable enough to do some weaving in and out of the trees. Here is what happens if I should miss :frown3: I believe I may have skied down with her once or twice, not entirely sure.

    From examiner.com
    http://www.examiner.com/x-4364-Skii...ng-a-helmet-dies-in-Breckenridge-ski-accident

    Haley Rose Gans, 14, from Colorado Springs, Colo., was killed in a ski accident Friday at Breckenridge Resort, according to an incident report from the resort. Initial findings of the Summit County coroner suggest that Gans' fatal injuries were related to blunt force trauma to the chest. The Summit County, Colo., ski area was in only its ninth day of operation for the 2009-10 season when the incident occured.
    A call was received by Breckenridge Ski Patrol at approximately 11:48 a.m. and the patrol responded immediately to the scene on Spruce, an advanced-intermediate trail under the Colorado SuperChair lift in the Peak 8 area.
    Ski patrol and Flight for Life provided advanced life support and transported Gans to an awaiting ambulance. She was then transported to the Breckenridge Medical Center, where she was pronounced dead. The Denver Post reported that the death is the first Colorado ski fatality of the season.
    Victim reportedly hit a tree
    Gans was wearing a helmet at the time of the incident. The coroner's report indicated that witnesses saw her hit a tree at a high rate of speed. Research has shown that high-speed collisions with stationary objects such as trees may often result in fatalities even when the skier is wearing a helmet. Consistent with the initial coroner's report in this case, blunt trauma to the body, rather than the head per se, is often severe enough to be fatal in such collisions.
    Although helmets can not prevent all fatalities, the National Ski Areas Association does recommend helmet use for recreational skiers and snowboarders. Vail Resorts, the owner of Breckenridge Resort, started requiring employees to wear helmets on the mountain for this ski season. Intrawest, another major ski area operator, also instituted such a rule for this season. Except for children's ski schools at several resorts, mandatory helmet rules for visitors are not in place at U.S. resorts.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2009
  2. AdamZ

    AdamZ Administrator Management Council Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2005
    Messages:
    15,491
    Location:
    Montgomery County PA
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Adam Zucker
    This is sad Austin but don't ever think that wearing a helmet can't save a life. Other things can kill you skiing but. Helmets significantly cut the risk of death or serious injury.
     
  3. Mtns2Skies

    Mtns2Skies Super Moderator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2008
    Messages:
    3,410
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mtns2Skies
    Definately I always wear one.
     
  4. twdeckard

    twdeckard Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2008
    Messages:
    268
    Location:
    Minneapolis
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    twdeckard
    I went to a Medical Advisory Board meeting for Neurosurgeon's that was hosted at a ski resort. It was interesting how the surgeon's all wore helmets (and this was some time ago before it was common).

    I was debating motorcyle helmet laws and liberatarianism and a friend of mine said very quietly "well I guess I should be against helmet laws" I was suprised that he would chime in on that side of the debate and when I asked him why he said "becuase my dad is waiting for a heart." If we had taped it, it would have made a helluva public service commercial.
     
  5. Ddayle

    Ddayle Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    May 15, 2008
    Messages:
    915
    Location:
    Des Moines, WA
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    DaveR
    Perception, it is all perception. People seem to think skiing is a "safe" sport" . People think fishing is Also 'safe'. Many parents would discourage thier kids from riding those dangerous off-road 'murdercycles' . FACTS are that skiing ,like High school football, is far more dangerous in # of lives lost per capita than dirt bikes. and FISHING is the most dangerous sport in the USA. Logic would have us putting a life vest on every fisherman to prevent drowning, 'for thier own good'. We as pilots know we are exposed to risk, we minimize it and accept it. If you are going to engage in risky dangerous sports like fishing & skiing , expect that death & injury are common results of this behavior. DaveR
     
  6. Mtns2Skies

    Mtns2Skies Super Moderator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2008
    Messages:
    3,410
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mtns2Skies
    Dave, you fail to take into account that it is normally drunk, or otherwise unsensible people that get killed.
     
  7. Ddayle

    Ddayle Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    May 15, 2008
    Messages:
    915
    Location:
    Des Moines, WA
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    DaveR
    I doubt high school football players are drunk or high during the game. I Do not ski, so I cannot say how many skiers are drunk. I do know alcohol was not invloved in a recent fishing drowning of father & young son, it was a small shallow lake , so they didn't bother with life jackets in the boat. I have also been nearly killed on streetbikes. I was not drunk, drinking , High, or riding in an unsafe manner when these idiots pulled in front of me. Was this girl drunk? Yes drunks kill themselves. I think your point is meaningless to the statistic's overall. I assert that there are roughly the same number of idiots morons drunks & stoners participating in most sports to even it out.DaveR
     
  8. Mtns2Skies

    Mtns2Skies Super Moderator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2008
    Messages:
    3,410
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mtns2Skies
    I am not speaking of stats, I posted this to show what a tragedy this was and that it very well could have been me should I not watch out, this hit home a bit closer than other deaths because I was there at the exact spot the day before and may have met her. I did NOT post this to argue.
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2009
  9. Everskyward

    Everskyward Administrator Management Council Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2005
    Messages:
    31,963
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Everskyward
    I know what you mean Austin. I skied into the trees as a teenager and was lucky that the only thing I broke way my leg. I was not wearing a helmet. No one ever heard of wearing helmets in those days.
     
  10. flyersfan31

    flyersfan31 Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2006
    Messages:
    14,280
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Freiburgfan31
    Tragic.

    I wear a helmet due to family pressures. Certainly, I never want to suffer a traumatic brain injury. I've explained that there are a lot of ways to die on a mountain, but, like the reporter in the news story, most folks seem to think helmets create a magic force field.

    I can't imagine what her parents must be going through.:nonod:
     
  11. gismo

    gismo Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2005
    Messages:
    12,676
    Location:
    Minneapolis
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    iGismo
    Skiers can easily reach 30 mph if they try to go fast and that much speed into a solid object is going to cause serious trauma to whatever parts of the body are involved in the impact, helmet or not. It's kinda like flying near thunderstorms, the key is to avoid running into one, not using the proper equipment to survive the encounter.
     
  12. gismo

    gismo Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2005
    Messages:
    12,676
    Location:
    Minneapolis
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    iGismo
    Kinda wakes you right up when someone dies doing what you've been doing. Do you expect this might make you more cautious when skiing near obstacles like trees?
     
  13. twdeckard

    twdeckard Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2008
    Messages:
    268
    Location:
    Minneapolis
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    twdeckard
    I know that when the amatuer NTSB crowd spools up to dissect a crash based on the color of the plane and the airport scuttlebutt (and I am guilty of this as well I guess) -- I always have that small voice in my head that offers "there but for the Grace of God..."
     
  14. flyersfan31

    flyersfan31 Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2006
    Messages:
    14,280
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Freiburgfan31
    Who says she was tree-skiing?

    Is Spruce a tree run? The report says it's a Blue-Black. The resort map seems to indicate it's a regular trail. The news says she hit a tree, at high speed. Hard to get high speed in a tree run.

    You could ski down a wide open slope, lose control, and hit a tree. Ask Michael Kennedy. Or Sonny Bono. It happens. In the blink of an eye it can happen. Sad.:nonod:
     
  15. Trapper John

    Trapper John Ejection Handle Pulled

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2008
    Messages:
    8,155
    Location:
    Headley Grange
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Bill Burkett
    Tragic it truly is. You're showing wisdom beyond your years in recognizing that, "Things That Are Really Fun" can be hazardous to your health. A heightened sense of self-preservation is a very useful skill for any pilot to possess, IMO.


    Trapper John
     
  16. gismo

    gismo Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2005
    Messages:
    12,676
    Location:
    Minneapolis
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    iGismo
    That sounds like what probably happened. I often ski along the sides of the trails because the new snow usually lasts longer there, but if I catch an edge I'm ready to do all I can to avoid going into the trees at speed.
     
  17. murphey

    murphey Final Approach PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2008
    Messages:
    8,342
    Location:
    Colorado
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    murphey
    More important than helmets - skiing in control and on runs appropriate to your skill level.
     
  18. fgcason

    fgcason En-Route

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    3,620
    Location:
    Nomad
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Frank Cason
    And when you screw up and get beyond your capabilities do something besides go along for the ride. Drop the poles, sit down and topple over sideways. Bail off the skis if necessary. It's snow, not pavement, you'll be all right though you may have to scrape snow out of your goggles and hike uphill for your skis.
     
  19. twdeckard

    twdeckard Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2008
    Messages:
    268
    Location:
    Minneapolis
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    twdeckard
    I'll go back to my original post ... a group of wealthy brain surgeons who didn't seem to flinch from double black diamonds and clearly had enough discretionary income to go on a lot of skiing vacations always seemed to have hard-hats on even when going down the milk-runs. Makes you think ...
     
  20. TMetzinger

    TMetzinger Final Approach

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2006
    Messages:
    9,885
    Location:
    Northern Virginia
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Tim
    I'm all for helmets. They just don't do any good against blunt-force-trauma on other parts of the body.

    <politics on>I'm also against helmet laws for adults, but for seat belt laws. Why? Helmets only protect the rider, and it's everyone's right to kill themselves in any way they find entertaining. Seat belts may protect other drivers by allowing the driver to retain control of the vehicle in an impact. <politics off>

    Regardless, it's always a sad thing when someone dies in an accident.
     
  21. Mtns2Skies

    Mtns2Skies Super Moderator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2008
    Messages:
    3,410
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mtns2Skies
    It is a blue-black, the hardest run they had open at the time. It is a normal trail but I've been off trail on it going into the woods next to the trail. I will have the video of this run up shortly.
     
  22. murphey

    murphey Final Approach PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2008
    Messages:
    8,342
    Location:
    Colorado
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    murphey
    I agree entirely - but no one should ever think/assume a helmet is a magical device that will always keep you safe & alive. Or any other protective item.
     
  23. Mtns2Skies

    Mtns2Skies Super Moderator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2008
    Messages:
    3,410
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mtns2Skies
    Granted, the video camera takes away from the steepness and speed of reality. This is the ski run Spruce that Haley was killed on. (This is about the ski run, not my ski style.) I would have uploaded the shot of me in the trees although I was not filming that day. The "That's just cool" in the video is pertaining to the view.

    http://vimeo.com/7758822
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2009
  24. flhrci

    flhrci En-Route

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2007
    Messages:
    4,587
    Location:
    Ashville, OH
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    David
    This is sad Austin.

    I have always told you that skiing is dangerous. Motorcycles on the other hand, are safe. It is the cage drivers out there that are dangerous to motorcyclists.

    Dave
     
  25. Mtns2Skies

    Mtns2Skies Super Moderator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2008
    Messages:
    3,410
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mtns2Skies
    There is the footage of that particular ski run (above) and shortly I will have my entire vacation on video, after sifting through 7 hours of footage.
     
  26. bbchien

    bbchien Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2005
    Messages:
    10,451
    Location:
    Bolingbrook, IL
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Bruce C
    I'm all for helmets. I can't believe I survived my Summit county days without one...helo skiing, all sorts of Rad stuff.

    But I'm afraid that the public reaction wiill be something like, "hey, DUDE, your airbag didn't go off...."

    I say, trees, son, TREES are the enemy...."
     
  27. jestertoo

    jestertoo Pre-Flight

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2008
    Messages:
    43
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    JesterToo
    I roadraced motorcycles for 10 years, crashing some 20 times. Almost every one of them required a helmet replacement. $300 is cheap insurance. Two of those gave me concussions. One of those was from an easy 30mph lowside where I whacked my head on the ground good.

    I can't stand to see people riding bikes & motorcycles w/o helmets. Packed snow isn't much softer.
     
  28. SkyHog

    SkyHog Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,463
    Location:
    Castle Rock, CO
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Everything Offends Me
    Wow, next we'll be wearing helmets to work down the street....afterall, you could trip and fall, and 5 feet is a long ways to fall if you hit your head.

    Bicycle helmets were when it went too far...now its just insane.
     
  29. Ghery

    Ghery Final Approach

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2005
    Messages:
    9,544
    Location:
    Olympia, Washington
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Ghery Pettit
    The one time I got hurt riding a motorcycle was when a car ran a stop sign and hit our motorcycle broadside. Helmets are the reason my wife and I survived that incident. And those helmets were retired immediately. I got a new one, my wife never got on a motorcycle again. Laws or no laws, anybody who rides a motorcycle without a helmet should have his head examined while he still has a head to examine.

    Oh, and we had a member of our son's Cub Scout Pack die when he fell off a bicycle and hit his head on the ground. A helmet might have saved him. Should they be mandatory? I'm not a fan of the nanny state, so I'll say "no". But, are they a good idea? Yes.

    Skiing? I haven't been on the slopes in years, but for over 30 years I managed to not kill myself, even though helmets were for racers (only) in those days. I gave it up when it got too hard to get back up after falling. :D
     
  30. Mtns2Skies

    Mtns2Skies Super Moderator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2008
    Messages:
    3,410
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mtns2Skies
    yeah maybe road riding is excessive, but thats not the biking I do. My kind of biking you WILL die should you not wear a helmet. Think outside the box there Nick.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2009
  31. SkyHog

    SkyHog Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,463
    Location:
    Castle Rock, CO
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Everything Offends Me
    I agree - extreme riding - mountain biking, speed skiing, etc, definitely, a helmet is useful. But for street riding on a bicycle or basic skiing?

    But people take these messages to the extreme, and all of our kids are wearing bicycle helmets now. Sheesh.
     
  32. Mtns2Skies

    Mtns2Skies Super Moderator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2008
    Messages:
    3,410
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mtns2Skies
    Well for skiing, helmets are just so light that they are just basically used to keep your head warm, necessary for protection or not, light, with built in ear muffs :)
     
  33. flyingcheesehead

    flyingcheesehead Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    22,216
    Location:
    UQACY, WI
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    iMooniac
    Actually, head injuries from bicycle accidents tend to be worse than motorcycle accidents - Apparently it's the vertical component that causes most of the problems, and you sit a lot higher on a bicycle than you do on a motorcycle.
     
  34. colomtnflyer

    colomtnflyer Cleared for Takeoff

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2007
    Messages:
    1,008
    Location:
    Guess it depends on what week it is!
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    iAM in AK!
    I'm going to weigh in on this one, despite that I should probably keep my mouth (keyboard) shut...

    For those of you who do not know my background, I have been (still am) a professional skier since I was 17. I was a competitor, coach, rep, and still teach skiing at a major Colorado resort. I have conservatively over 6500 days on skis in my life. So maybe my opinion is worth something, maybe its not. You must make your own decisions.

    First of all, I AM NOT ANTI-HELMET! I own 5 of them, each for a different purpose. I do not wear a helmet all the time. I chose when to wear one, and when not.

    I have suffered a range of injuries during my career, from very minor to quite severe, but only one relative to not wearing a helmet. The one concussion I received was long before helmets were used for anything other than Downhill racing. The fact I had just flown over 150 ft in the air and then crashed might have had something to do with it. But I will admit that there have been some crashes while wearing a helmet that I was quite happy that I did have it on! I would guess that this has happened perhaps 3 times.

    But lets deal with the real world of recreational skiers, who suffer the greatest number of fatalities. First, the facts-

    1) the average intermediate recreational skier travels at between 25-40 mph. advanced/expert skiers often move at speeds exceeding 60 mph
    2) contemporary ski equipment is designed to react much more strongly than equipment of even as recently as 10-15 years ago, resulting in great effect, intended or not
    3) the conditions during this phase of the season are known as the WROD, or White Ribbon Of Death.
    This means the snow is usually man made (much firmer than natural snow), has a much higher concentration of skiers in a limited space (scraping the surface smoother than mid season conditions on the few trails open), and that the snow making is not designed to put snow into the trees (only up to the edge of the trail).
    4) the higher concentration of skiers on the few trails open also reduces the amount of space for a skier/boarder to manuever to control themselves in the event of getting out of control
    5) there are two primary causes of impact fatalities- skier/boarder vs inanimate object and skier/boarder vs skier/boarder collision

    With these factors in play, it is easy to envisage a situation where a skier/boarder gets moving at a speed beyond their ability, and attempts to make some sort of controlling action. If that action is a directional change, then the ski edges begin to cut into the snow, with perhaps more resulting effect than anticipated by the skier/boarder. The edge 'catches' and propels the skier/boarder into the inanimate object at a speed which could be hazardous. This is not speculation, as I have seen exactly this scenario with my own eyes on numerous occasions! Thankfully in most of those cases, the skier/boarder simply fell down and no harm was done, but there have been a few cases where the individual was not so lucky.

    Another scenario begins just like the previous one, except they begin a sequence of unsuccessful recovery actions due to limited space because of the other skiers/boarders on the trail. Again, the result is either a collision or an impact with the ground or another object.

    Though heightened awareness exists since the Natasha Richardson case of last winter, and the growth of helmet use has increased every year over the past decade, fatalities still happen. There is no argument that some of the deaths/severe injuries could have been prevented or lessened with helmet use. But the majority of skier/boarder fatalities are not head injuries, but as in this case, trauma to the chest area.

    Some will use anecdotal evidence to support their belief that all skiers should wear helmets, but the statistics do not bear this out. But I will also point out that the number of potential incidents which were avoided because of helmet use can never be known, as they are not reported.

    Another piece of contrary evidence is the percentage of recreational skiers involved vs professionals. For example, the last head injury reported by either a instructor or ski patroller within Vail Resorts was over 8 years ago. That number of instructors and patrollers is in excess of 3000 people, each spending over 100 days per season on their skis or board. You would think that due to the high percentage of time spent in the environment, we would be more susceptible to all types of injuries than the general public. Yes, we have our share of crashes, blown knees, torn shoulders, bad backs, etc. But professionals do not seem to fall into the ranks of the head/torso injury group. Whether that is due to our greater situational awareness and not letting ourselves get into these dangerous situations, or our ability to extricate ourselves from the situation if we do get inot one is open to debate. But obviously ability and experience does have some effect on this.

    I am terribly sorry for this young girls passing, and feel for her parents and family. It is always a shame to see a young llife get cut short, before it is realized. I have seen far too many go this way.

    But skiing IS a risky sport. It has both identifiable and unidentifiable hazards. So it is up to each person to decide BEFORE taking part- "Do I accept the risk of what I am about to do, or not?" If yes, then get out, have a good time, and be safe. If not, stay in the lodge or go bowling, or what ever. Thats ok...

    But this is the decision that I and every other professional has to make every single day we put our boots on. And if the day comes that I can not accept that risk, then I will quit.

    If anyone would care to continue this discussion via PM, I would be happy to oblige. Likewise, if anyone has any questions about the ski industry which I may be able to assist with, please feel free to contact me.
     
  35. SkyHog

    SkyHog Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,463
    Location:
    Castle Rock, CO
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Everything Offends Me
    I understand the "argument." I just don't see how our parents, our parents' parents, and ourselves lived without using those helmets! Why, we each must have known dozens of people that died from bicycle accidents....

    I can think of one, and he was hit by a car so hard, whether he had on a helmet or not, he'd have died.
     
  36. Anthony

    Anthony Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,612
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Anthony
    I've been an avid skier and road bicycler. I wear a helmet when I bike, but not when I have skied. At some point you just have to say its worth the risk. I have seen road bike riders go down hard on pavement and be saved by their helmet. I have never seen the same on skis. Anecdotal, I know, but I tend to agree with colomntflyer, after living and skiing in Colorado and skiing worldwide in places like Davos, Lech, Zurs, Whistler/Blackomb, Vail, etc.
     
  37. ScottM

    ScottM Taxi to Parking

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2005
    Messages:
    42,518
    Location:
    Variable, but somewhere on earth
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    iBazinga!
    I agree about the $300 being cheap insurance. I survived a bad motorcycle accident because of my helmet. I spend a couple of hundred on my helmet when I got my bike, my roommate made fun of me for spending all of that money. He said if I had gone to K-Mart I could have gotten a helmet for $40. I told if he had a $40 buck head then that was all that was needed. After my accident my roommate went out and spent a couple of hundred bucks on a new helmet.
     
  38. Mtns2Skies

    Mtns2Skies Super Moderator Management Council Member PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2008
    Messages:
    3,410
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mtns2Skies
    Thanks for the input Ric, I know you are probably the most qualified person here to speak of something like this for you have, by far, the most experience in this area. I know you have had many friends killed. The reason this struck me harder than the deaths you have spoken of is because I always assumed that they were killed doing something insane (by my definition) in uncharted territory, this was at a ski resort on a groomed trail.
     
  39. bbchien

    bbchien Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2005
    Messages:
    10,451
    Location:
    Bolingbrook, IL
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Bruce C
    Hey. I think since helmets don't prevent fatalities, they should be repealed. Just like the third class medical.

    Heck, People die in cars with seatbelts on. We need to repeal them.

    Seriously, there is only one time a helmet might be injurious- that time when it reduces peripheral vision and auditory awareness of the snowboarder about to clip you across the calves. Things to think about.

    I was hospitalized many moons ago when a snowboarder facing uphill, whacked me across the rear (I was on the fall line). He didn't stop, but shouted, "hey you were in my blind spot". As I was Snomass Ski Patrol off duty at the time, I chased him down, called it in, pulled his ticket. Then it was off to the hospital to get sutured up. Whadda mess.

    For many years I favored AJAX, which had a board prohibition, as a typical snowboarder is <30 and has a devil may care attitude. The trip to the hosp. was paid for by my insurance. But I understand they did successfully eventually subrograte from the kid's father.

    Unvbelievable.

    I wear a helmet in the Hanging Valley Glades and on the walls, but on the main trails, it hangs from my fanny pack.
     
  40. fgcason

    fgcason En-Route

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    3,620
    Location:
    Nomad
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Frank Cason
    There are several motorcycles that sit higher than a bicycle yet the riders do 70mph faceplants, get up and ride home mostly uninjured rather often.

    How would those bad head injury crashes on bicycles have been different if the rider had wearing a full face motorcycle helmet instead of the typical on top of the head bicycle helmet? I'm guessing the design and overall fit of the motorcycle helmet in general would protect better in a crash. And that's without getting into the body abrasion protection discussion.


    I'm convinced the law of averages has something to do with it. I know for certain that quite a few of the rather violent crashes I've been involved with as a kid made the law of averages sit bolt up right and say rather hysterically "There's no way that can balance out. Someone is going to have to die for that one." Then some innocent kid walking down the street somewhere far away, in totally perfectly good health and at absolutely no risk at all, simply fell over dead. I can distinctly recall at least one rather nasty rummage sale grade crash that probably got two or three kids in one go. It was brutal.

    Of course as kids that grew up without safety designed playground equipment, cabinet locks or car seats, our environment taught us how to be actively safer and more thoughtful of our decisions and actions. We grew up playing in a barn on a working farm, taking the rowboat out then sinking it deliberately without life jackets, doing stuff that would land our parents in jail for child neglect nowadays and experimenting at the edge of our capabilities and physics. That taught us that the ground and objects are hard and more importantly, it taught us how to crash safely. Our thought process was design something or come up with an idea then what if our way through when this goes wrong. Crashing was part of the basic concept. The best safety training tool on the elementary school playground was the thin layer of loose gravel on rough rock filled concrete - there were physical consequences to running around acting like an idiot. Kids nowadays don't learn those skills until it kills them dead in an totally survivable no injury possible type incident.