Smoking Regulations

JohnAJohnson

JohnAJohnson

Cleared for Takeoff
Joined
Aug 14, 2006
Messages
1,307
Location
Gulf Shores, AL
Display Name
Display name:
JohnAJohnson
Can someone point me to the regulation that covers smoking (cigarettes, cigars, pipes) in GA aircraft? Thanks
 
There is none, at least none that I've found.
 
Only one I'm aware of is that when a placard prohibiting smoking is in the airplane, such as in the late-model 172s. (For example, page 2-15 of the C172R Information Manual. Placard = "Smoking Prohibited.")

If you've got a low-wing, invite them to step outside. (lame joke) ;)
 
JohnAJohnson said:
Can someone point me to the regulation that covers smoking (cigarettes, cigars, pipes) in GA aircraft? Thanks
Click to expand...

The aircraft certification regs (FAR 23 or CAR 3, depending on the age of the aircraft) have some relavant rules. Here's a recent thread: http://www.pilotsofamerica.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11576 You'll want to look up CAR 3.388 or FAR 23.853.

Basically, if the manufacturer opted not to provide extra fire-proofing and self contained ashtrays, then they have to placard it for no smoking. That placard should be shown in the flight manual and/or type certificate data sheet. I'm not sure which FAR says you have to follow the placards, but I'd imagine something in part 91 would indicate that.

Chris
 
Chris, good info.

cwyckham said:
I'm not sure which FAR says you have to follow the placards...
Click to expand...

91.9(a) is where it says you have to adhere to placards such as the C172R example I gave.

The reason I thought about this in the first place was that the avionics shop I worked at had to cut a hole through the "No Smoking" placard of a 172R for a new instrument. I remember engraving the replacement placard myself. I also remember asking why we needed to worry about it, and learned it was because it was required by the manufacturer. Now I realize the part 23 regs must be the original culprit.
 
smigaldi said:
The only regulation I know of is the one that says you have to listen to the PIC and when I am a PIC there is no smoking inside of my aircraft.
Click to expand...
Which FAR would that be?...for GA, part 91, not 121.
 
I thought it might be plane specific since I've seen some of the newer planes with No Smoking signs, and of course all the older planes have ashtrays. Seat materials, built in ashtrays, etc., would dictate compliance with FAR 23.853.

Thank you.
 
IMNSHO this is another situation where the official regulations are inadequate.
Besides, I have a big problem with intentionally setting a fire in a compartment where the fuel lines run.

Two options are available:
 

Attachments

  • Option1.jpg
    Option1.jpg
    36.7 KB · Views: 33
  • Option2.JPG
    Option2.JPG
    63.2 KB · Views: 26
"Any smoke in this cockpit will be dealt with via emergency procedures.
1. Identify source of smoke
2. Eject smoke source through nearest exit"
 
nosehair said:
oooo!...look at you.
Click to expand...

troller.jpg
 
nosehair said:
Which FAR would that be?...for GA, part 91, not 121.
Click to expand...

perhaps 91.3? the PIC is the final authority to the operation of that aircraft? translates to "what I say goes, period" in my book as well as Scott's.
 
Hey neat, its a new "Bash the smoker" thread.

I didn't allow smoking in my plane either, but there's no need to be so abrupt about it. I don't know anyone that would say "You don't want smoking in here? Too bad, I'm gonna smoke anyways."

FWIW - if someone insists on smoking in your plane, you can always say that the FAA has disallowed smoking in all airplanes. They'll never know anything other than that which is law for 121.
 
There is no FAR governing smoking in Part 91 aircraft. Further, there is no FAR requiring compliance with placards outside of those required by the aircraft POH/TCDS. However, 14 CFR sections 91.3(a) gives the PIC the authority to regulate smoking in the aircraft s/he commands under Part 91.
 
Last edited:
Ok, I get it. It's politically correct, even encouraged to bash smokers or even questions about smoking. After all, it's one of the few things/acts we can bash without getting into trouble with the thought police. We see an opportunity, so lets go for it!

I don't smoke. But over the years I've had the pleasure to know many great pilots. Some actually smoked. And believe it, many were better men than us. I just wanted to know what regulation covered it!

I very much appreciate the sincere responses, but lets end this thread before it gets long and meaningless.
 
Yeah, Sorry, Nick.

It's all fun and games until someone gets hurt. :)
 
SkyHog said:
FWIW - if someone insists on smoking in your plane, you can always say that the FAA has disallowed smoking in all airplanes.
Click to expand...

Sure. Just be like American Airlines, who has now taken to saying that it's a Federal Regulation that passengers may only use the lav located in the cabin in which they're seated.

*bzzztt* It may be a boneheaded new policy of theirs, but it's not a Federal Regulation for domestic flights.
 
Ron Levy said:
There is no FAR governing smoking in Part 91 aircraft. Further, there is no FAR requiring compliance with placards outside of those required by the aircraft POH/TCDS. However, 14 CFR sections 91.3(a) gives the PIC the authority to regulate smoking in the aircraft s/he commands under Part 91.
Click to expand...
Don't forget about AD's...there's one on my Maule that requires a "no smoking" placard. Apparently somebody dropped a cigarette in one years ago, and barely got on the ground before the airplane burned. YEEE-HA!

Came in handy on my checkout, though...insurance required a 2-hour checkout with a CFI who had, among other things, 35 hours in Maules. Kinda tough to find, really. Fortunately, my Dad flew one so long ago that he couldn't remember what they looked like, but the insurance company was OK with that.

Now, my Dad is a smoker, but doesn't smoke in airplanes unless he's really bored. Imagine the boredom of sitting for two hours with a know-it-all kid (this was 14 years ago...now I'm approaching know-it-all mid-life) in an airplane that you know absolutely nothing about. Well, after starting the airplane and completing the appropriate checks, I pointed to the placard, told him it was an AD, so it's a federal offense to smoke in here, and started taxiing before he could get out!

The great thing about giving my Dad grief is that he doesn't take it very well. ;)

Fly safe!

David
 
But while on the subject of smoking, I have two very shiny ash trays which came from the pilot and co-pilot seat backs of my Skyhawk. When I replaced the backs several years ago we didn't cut the allocated space to re-insert the ash trays. No Smoking in N7872G.

Anyone who might need(want) them can have them.

HR
 
SkyHog said:
I didn't allow smoking in my plane either, but there's no need to be so abrupt about it. I don't know anyone that would say "You don't want smoking in here? Too bad, I'm gonna smoke anyways."
Click to expand...

Nick,

Don't take it so personally... I didn't notice anyone being "Abrupt" or bashing anyone, just saying they don't allow it in planes they fly which makes it a 91.3 thing.

Personally, what I do is a play on the airlines' pre-flight briefing. I say something like "This is a non-smoking flight. Tampering with, disabling, or destroying the lavatory smoke detectors is ille... Oh wait. No lavatory, no smoke detectors. So, even though seatbelts are only required for taxi, takeoff, and landing, you might as well keep 'em on the whole time, 'cuz you're not going anywhere." It gets the point across and makes them laugh, which makes them less nervous. Good deal all around.
 
Lawreston said:
But while on the subject of smoking, I have two very shiny ash trays which came from the pilot and co-pilot seat backs of my Skyhawk. When I replaced the backs several years ago we didn't cut the allocated space to re-insert the ash trays. No Smoking in N7872G.

Anyone who might need(want) them can have them.
Click to expand...

I think you should send them to Nick to install in the KR-2 he's gonna build! :yes:
 
Smoking is allowed in my plane. I just have to open the window before you light up so the smoke will not obscure my vision. Personally while I do feel that non-smokers have the right not to inhale second hand smoke. I also feel that smokers have a right to smoke. The problem is how to let both have their way. For years the non-smokers rights were s##t on but now the tide has turned. Non-smokers now go out of their way to hunt down areas where smokers smoke and claim that their rights are being trampled so put out those cigarettes. Flame on
 
JRitt said:
SPersonally while I do feel that non-smokers have the right not to inhale second hand smoke. I also feel that smokers have a right to smoke.
Click to expand...
Someone once said that your right to extend your arm ends where my nose begins. I feel the same about smoking -- I do not believe one's right to smoke extends to places where others may be required to go, and I'm pretty well decided that nobody's right to go to publicly accessible places requires that they risk their health to do so. IOW, if you want to smoke, fine, just do it in private where nobody else has to breathe it as a condition of exercising their right of free movement (and their right of free movement doesn't include someone else's private property).

In any event, to focus this on our primary interest (airplanes), I don't think there's anything about anyone's right to smoke that trumps my 91.3(b) authority over what happens in my plane. Just as in my home, anyone who wants to smoke in my plane is going to have to step outside to do so.
 
JRitt said:
Smoking is allowed in my plane. I just have to open the window before you light up so the smoke will not obscure my vision.
Click to expand...

Well, my 1968 was clearly designed to assume everybody would be smoking, as they did in the 1960s. It has(had) ashtrays on both doors. You'd have to rely on the flow-though ventilation to clear the air - if anybody wanted to.

Now that I think about it, there are no ashtrays in the back even though it was supposedly designed as a businessmen's plane.
 
Ron Levy said:
Someone once said that your right to extend your arm ends where my nose begins. I feel the same about smoking -- I do not believe one's right to smoke extends to places where others may be required to go, and I'm pretty well decided that nobody's right to go to publicly accessible places requires that they risk their health to do so. IOW, if you want to smoke, fine, just do it in private where nobody else has to breathe it as a condition of exercising their right of free movement (and their right of free movement doesn't include someone else's private property).

In any event, to focus this on our primary interest (airplanes), I don't think there's anything about anyone's right to smoke that trumps my 91.3(b) authority over what happens in my plane. Just as in my home, anyone who wants to smoke in my plane is going to have to step outside to do so.
Click to expand...

Ron, where did you get that I even implied that I thought anybodys right to smoke trumps your right as PIC of your AC (or any aircraft that you are PIC). I just felt this thread which started out asking for the reg that covers smoking in GA aircraft became a bash smokers thread. I said smokers have a right to smoke and non-smokers have a right not to inhale second hand smoke. That means (to me anyway) smokers should be smoking in an area where non-smokers do not have to inhale the second hand smoke. Also that if a smokers does go to such a place then a non-smoker shows up that the non-smoker cannot say "put out that cigarette because I have the right not to inhale the smoke".
 
I agree with JRitt. No smoker would insist that they have the right to smoke anywhere (except outdoors, and I was nice about that until antismokers ruined smoking sections in bars. After that, I started ignoring requests to put out cigarettes in places I'm allowed to smoke).

This was a nice, easy question asked, and it turned like every other thread that involves smoking. Some high and mighty insults thrown around by non-smokers, disguised as jokes.

Its time we start fighting back.
 
Besides the discomfort of the non smokers... I just wouldnt allow it in my airplane. Does anyone really smoke in their own aircraft still?

Seems too easy to start fires in a small area. Not to mention there are a lot of folks with O2 bottles on board.
 
AirBaker said:
Besides the discomfort of the non smokers... I just wouldnt allow it in my airplane. Does anyone really smoke in their own aircraft still?

Seems too easy to start fires in a small area. Not to mention there are a lot of folks with O2 bottles on board.
Click to expand...

Not to mention, increased mx costs. It gums up the gyros, and plays hell on the interior.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top