Selecting an instructor

S

StraightnLevel

Line Up and Wait
Joined
Dec 8, 2023
Messages
535
Display Name
Display name:
StraightnLevel
I'm looking for some thoughts from others on deciding which instructor to select as primary, out of 2 whom I have now flown with.

First instructor: Very laid-back and unassuming. Lets me go through the process and make my own mistakes with ground items, then asks what I think I may have missed. Similarly in flight, lets me fly it right up to where I run out of ability/training, and gives me plenty of room to adjust, play with slight differences in control input, etc. All good from this perspective. However, he seems to blow past a few things himself; feels to me as if he's a bit new to the game, and maybe not 100% comprehensive and detail-oriented. He's teaching me to fly the plane.

Second instructor: Outgoing, forceful, crisp and businesslike. Every detail must be perfect, and every mistake is immediately noted and corrected. In flight, tends to jump in and take controls more quickly and shift to demonstration as opposed to letting me work my way through it when I'm not quite there yet. He doesn't miss details, and he's clearly on top of every letter of the regs and requirements for a checkride. I end up drilling through the material more comprehensively the night before a flight with him. Follows up via text after every lesson, and sends additional material to review. He's teaching me to learn the rules and tightly script for the test and checkride.

I feel that I'm getting good instruction from both of them, just in very different ways.

Any thoughts on how to select which one to make the primary? Any thoughts on reasons to go with one "type" over the other?
 
If it were me making the choice, I'd most likely go with the first instructor. The second one sounds as if he is training you to pass the checkride. That's important, of course, but more important is learning to be a safe and skilled pilot, and you will learn better from someone who allows you to make mistakes.
 
It depends on your personality.
My personality doesn't believe in perfect so I would go with instructor one.
I find the further I let a learner fly into the mistake the more he learns from it.
In my opinion the learners job is to make mistakes and my job as a flight instructor is to make the mistakes into teachable moments.
 
I struggle to learn from personality #2, even if he is the best pilot ever. I want someone that has the knowledge and perception of #2, but the attitude of #1.

That said. I learned how to learn from #2 by talking through what I'm doing out loud, constantly. Often he was correcting me just because I wasn't doing what he expected me to do, not because I was doing something wrong. When I told him what I was doing and why (before and during my actions), he stopped dinging me for every little thing and it was much less unpleasant. I'd still prefer to be given some latitude.
 
How many hours do you have so far? How many times have you flown with each instructor?
 
dmspilot said:
How many hours do you have so far? How many times have you flown with each instructor?
Click to expand...
I'm early in the process - a couple of flights with each. Just got my medical earlier this week, and I didn't want to jump the gun by spending a bunch of money on training before I knew I could complete the process. Now, though, I'm starting to book a bunch of time, so it's going to force my hand in selecting which one becomes primary. I'm thinking that I'll work with both to some degree over the course of the program, either way.
 
Last edited:
You don’t know what you don’t know, so don’t discount #1’s methods.

Can you ask about their hours, years of experience, students, pass rates, ratings, etc? Might help your gut feeling about who to pick.

Go with the guy that will get you to the finish line based on personality match and learning style. Use the other guy every so often to polish, build confidence, get a different perspective, etc.
 
It's hard to judge an instructor based on how much they take the controls on your first couple of flights. I tend to do a lot of demos on the first three lessons, for example. I think it's too early to tell honestly. My general advice would be to make sure they are actually teaching. They need to tell you the how and the why behind everything you're doing.
 
Are those the only two CFIs available to you? If you don't feel a good click with either of them, why not keep shopping?
 
To be contrarian:

If #2 gets you through checkride quicker with less time, I see that as a benefit.

Private pilot is known as a license to learn. You'll learn far more on your own anyway.
 
Jim_R said:
Are those the only two CFIs available to you? If you don't feel a good click with either of them, why not keep shopping?
Click to expand...
Actually, it's more the opposite. I don't dislike either of them, which is why it's not a slam-dunk decision. If I had been handed either one without a choice, I wouldn't be unhappy.
Salty said:
I want someone that has the knowledge and perception of #2, but the attitude of #1.
Click to expand...
Well, sure...

I have the sense that I would do better with #1 initially, then once I have some time in and confidence built up I'd learn more from #2.
455 Bravo Uniform said:
Go with the guy that will get you to the finish line based on personality match and learning style. Use the other guy every so often to polish, build confidence, get a different perspective, etc.
Click to expand...
Good thought - thanks.
Salty said:
I learned how to learn from #2 by talking through what I'm doing out loud, constantly. Often he was correcting me just because I wasn't doing what he expected me to do, not because I was doing something wrong. When I told him what I was doing and why (before and during my actions), he stopped dinging me for every little thing and it was much less unpleasant. I'd still prefer to be given some latitude.
Click to expand...
Another good thought - this could make a big difference.
Walboy said:
To be contrarian:

If #2 gets you through checkride quicker with less time, I see that as a benefit.
Click to expand...
That thought had crossed my mind... My default learning style tends to be more holistic, rather than highly structured rote memorization. Getting someone who will beat me over the head a bit to learn those last few details might be what I need to get through the initial process.
dmspilot said:
It's hard to judge an instructor based on how much they take the controls on your first couple of flights. I tend to do a lot of demos on the first three lessons, for example. I think it's too early to tell honestly. My general advice would be to make sure they are actually teaching. They need to tell you the how and the why behind everything you're doing.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I may be trying to push the decision too early, but I do need to make the call. I've got another 4 flights booked over the next week, so I'll get a bit more experience with both to see how it plays out.


Thanks to all of you - this is helpful input.
 
Gilbert Buettner said:
If it were me making the choice, I'd most likely go with the first instructor. The second one sounds as if he is training you to pass the checkride. That's important, of course, but more important is learning to be a safe and skilled pilot, and you will learn better from someone who allows you to make mistakes.
Click to expand...
Good points. I think that I do better with #1 in the plane, and better with #2 on the ground-school stuff. Totally different types of material and learning style required.

Question for you: You base in Wausau? How much flying can you do this time of year? We have a small farm just outside of West Bend (KETB), and I'm wondering how much of the year it's really flyable in a small plane. Heck, just getting the engine to start can be an ordeal when it's below freezing.
 
StraightnLevel said:
Question for you: You base in Wausau? How much flying can you do this time of year? We have a small farm just outside of West Bend (KETB), and I'm wondering how much of the year it's really flyable in a small plane. Heck, just getting the engine to start can be an ordeal when it's below freezing.
Click to expand...
There are a lot of days like today when we can't fly in winter, but there are also many days when we can. Our airplanes are all in heated hangars, so starting them is not an issue. Between lessons we cover the engine and plug in an oil pan heater.

We are much more active in warm weather, of course, when school is out.
 
I've flown with quite a few instructors through the years.... A few while working on certificate and ratings, and a bunch of others for BFR's and rental check outs

One of my biggest gripes about most instructors is the feeling that I get from so many of them that I have to do it "their way" ....so I feel like instead of doing something a perfectly good way (either as learned previously form a different instructor, or something that I have worked out through experience as what works for me...), then instead I'm putting more energy into trying to remember this new way that this new CFI told me a few minutes back when I was task saturated, of what he wants to see...not very productive and often makes it feel like I'm screwing up even though I know that I'm not.

For that, I'd pick your instructor #1.

That said, I've also been concerned with CFI's that are just too relaxed...letting too much slide, skipping major things in preflight or whatever.
and being new to flying, how's a student going to really know if instructor #1 is slacking too much?....
 
I would do most training with #1 and periodically fly with #2 for stage checks and second opinion for check ride prep.
 
I would use both, but for primary, I would do more with Instructor 1. You want to LEARN things, not just pass the checkride.

I would use Instructor 2 more for an Instrument Rating where things are more right or wrong.
 
StraightnLevel said:
...
Any thoughts on how to select which one to make the primary? Any thoughts on reasons to go with one "type" over the other?
Click to expand...
Without knowing more about you and your CFIs other than what you've posted here, I wouldn't venture a recommendation. However, I do suggest that you take some time to sit down with each to discuss your personal learning needs, and perhaps suggest some ways that the instructor could better help you to progress. Every CFI brings a unique combination of philosophy, approach, style, methods, idiosyncracies, and personality. A good instructor also has a measure of empathy for students and will be receptive to, and appreciative of, such a discussion. Even if neither of them actually makes an effort to adapt based on that conversation, the discussion itself may give you better insight as to which CFI would work better for you in the long run.
 
Brad W said:
One of my biggest gripes about most instructors is the feeling that I get from so many of them that I have to do it "their way" ....so I feel like instead of doing something a perfectly good way (either as learned previously form a different instructor, or something that I have worked out through experience as what works for me...), then instead I'm putting more energy into trying to remember this new way that this new CFI told me a few minutes back when I was task saturated, of what he wants to see...not very productive and often makes it feel like I'm screwing up even though I know that I'm not.
Click to expand...
It is important for both the instructor and the student to recognize the difference between procedures and techniques. Procedures are the way certain things must be done. Techniques are various ways things may be done. When I demonstrate a technique, I try to make it clear that "this is the way I do it, but you may find other ways work as well or better for you." When it is appropriate, I include WHY I prefer this technique.
 
And I may teach more than one technique and let them figure out which worked best for them
 
Gilbert Buettner said:
It is important for both the instructor and the student to recognize the difference between procedures and techniques. Procedures are the way certain things must be done. Techniques are various ways things may be done. When I demonstrate a technique, I try to make it clear that "this is the way I do it, but you may find other ways work as well or better for you." When it is appropriate, I include WHY I prefer this technique.
Click to expand...
I kinda feel like having that sort of focus on it is the solution to this 'issue'. Most folks don't think it through to those sort of parallels...or at least don't make that known. It'm more like interrupting what I'm doing to say, no do this instead.
I'd rather they let it play out (assuming I'm not on the verge of something damaging dangerous...then if they still feel the need, do what you said.... say " you know, what I have found works better for me in that situation is...."
 
I've had experience with two instructors for any amount of time and they were similar in many ways to the OP's issue.

The bulk of my PPL was taught by a pretty laid back instructor who would never take over the controls unless it was a safety issue or I asked him to. He was very good about instructing when it was appropriate and letting me learn and hone my skills in the airplane. He was tough on me, but not when I'm turning final. I do feel like he really knew his stuff and I benefitted from his training style.

The second did my transition training and some instrument training for me. She was constantly teaching and I found it very distracting. As an example, she would verbalize the in pattern descent all the way to the ground, flaps, speeds, trim, etc. even if I was already properly setup. These habits of hers made me think I was always being corrected and I had to take my finite computing power away from the task at hand to process what the heck she was telling me to do differently (which was not the case most of the time). After the first few hours, I had to tell her to stop talking while I'm actually executing a procedure unless there was a safety issue. We could learn on the ground or while flying straight and level. She did adjust to my ask, but if she didn't, I don't think it would have worked well.

Everyone learns a little different, but I would definitely prefer the instructor that is quiet and lets you feel and see how to fly an airplane without micromanaging you. In the end, your ability to fly the plane by feel and sight might save you. Being admonished during your primary training for rolling out of a 360 at 350 probably won't.
 
Well, my last few flights have been with #1, and I feel like I've made a good bit of progress, but maybe stagnating a bit. This evening I'm going up with #2, and I have a few more flights scheduled with him. It will be interesting to see how he approaches things given where I am now in the process.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top