Robertson STOL parts ... $$$ :(

denverpilot

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Was going to toss this privately to a couple of the PoA mechanics to see what they thought, but realized there's nothing that needs to be private about it... so... might as well document for other's in case they're thinking of getting anything with a Robby kit on it...

Just had a call from the shop. The proposed aileron hinge replacement on the starboard aileron has hit a snag... normally those are bog-standard Cessna parts and not all the outrageously priced... and on a 38 year old airplane, when it's time... it's time...

But...

Half of the aileron hinge on a Robertson STOL equipped 182 is made by Robertson. (I suspect they had to beef up one side for the "drooping aileron" that the STOL kit provides as part of the kit.)

Anywhoo... here's the non-fun part...

Sierra has the rights to the Robertson STOL now, of course.

When the shop called them to order the three aileron hinge halves, they said they don't get many calls for the 182 parts (mostly 206 and others), and they'd have to fabricate a set. 10 days.

And then the kicker. At a cost of almost $900 for three hinge halves.

Wheee! Wow. (We were replacing all three while the aileron is off... the middle one was the biggest loser, and was voted off of the island, but his buddies were going along with him to the recycle bin in the sky since taking ailerons off isn't much of an every-day occurrence.)

If that's the only option to meet the Robertson STC... we'd chalk it up to just being a bummer of a side effect of having a Robby, now that Robby is gone and someone else can pretty much dictate a price for any particular Robby component. And say... "Moving right along..."

Curious if any of the PoA mechanics have run into this one before with the modern incantation of Robby, and/or come up with other creative solutions. I can't see anyone fabricating a new one and doing a 337 for it, really, with the parts available from Sierra after they fabricate them.

I suspect it's going in the "learned a lesson about Robby kits via Mr. Wallet", and we wait on parts to arrive...

Guess that'll give the shop some time to button up and finish everything else. Sounds like they were down to pulling the Mags for 500 hour inspection, and I suspect they'll find things that need replacing in there, too... (GRIN)

So we'll be sans-airplane for another couple of weeks, no matter how we slice it.
 
Could a call to an aircraft salvage yard to find these parts work for you?

Surely there is something at a place like Dallas Air Salvage or the like.
 
Perhaps. I guess I don't know if hinges are typically re-used/salvaged parts... seems like they'd be of unknown condition a bit, since you're trying to measure that tiny inner diameter of a piano hinge...

But that was a thought in the back of my head and we discussed the possibility on the phone as the "bad news" rolled around the co-ownership gang.

No experience with it, and definitely not much out there in Google land about it...

Was considering a call to John Frank at CPA also, just as a double-check.
 
I owned a Robertson 206 and the very first Robertson 180.

If I had one now, I would gladly pay $900 to remove the system.
 
I owned a Robertson 206 and the very first Robertson 180.

If I had one now, I would gladly pay $900 to remove the system.

Heh... interesting. Haven't ever heard that from anyone yet. There's always a first.

(It'd probably take more than $900 in labor to remove it.)
 
I owned a Robertson 206 and the very first Robertson 180.

If I had one now, I would gladly pay $900 to remove the system.

Whyzat? I keep drooling over R-STOL Twin Comanches. Maybe I should instead be drooling over the de-iced ones. (Pretty certain those two options are mutually exclusive. :()
 
Bringing back a zombie thread.... Robertson R/STOL parts are back in manufacturing again! Lancair bought the STC from Sierra when they went belly-up. Aileron hinges are $350 apiece. Absolute love my Robertson kit. Fantastic performance in my 182P.

Performance chart: https://www.redskyventures.org/doc/cessna-misc/RobertsonSTOL_Performance_Comparison.pdf

Could someone explain what the STOL kit all does?? I was reviewing that data sheet and now it makes sense why backcountry182 is so slow on approach with stall horn blaring on long finals!! But what blows my mind is that the kit increases cruise speed?!? How’s that?
 
The Robertson STOL (R/STOL) for 182 added a wing cuff, that showed an increase in cruise speed by about 5 kts. This part of the kit was so successful, Cessna added this cuff starting in 1972 with the 182P model up and through today with the 182T.

Overall a STOL kit lowers the stall speed for even slower slow flight, with the benefit of reduced take-off run and landing roll. R/STOL 182 max gross stall is 36 KIAS.

Zero wind Take-off Performance Data examples (Max gross- ISA Day):
R/STOL Ground roll: 430' Distance to clear 50': 815'
Stock Ground roll: 705' Distance to clear 50': 1350'​

A 40% reduction in take-off distance to clear a 50' obstacle.

Add a head wind and the outcome is much more dramatic. 10 kt headwind the distance to clear 50' is 620'.

note: Edited values as per POH
 
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The Robertson STOL (R/STOL) for 182 added a wing cuff, that showed an increase in cruise speed by about 5 kts. This part of the kit was so successful, Cessna added this cuff starting in 1972 with the 182P model up and through today with the 182T.

Overall a STOL kit lowers the stall speed for even slower slow flight, with the benefit of reduced take-off run and landing roll. R/STOL 182 max gross stall is 36 KIAS.

Zero wind Take-off Performance Data examples (Max gross- ISA Day):
R/STOL Ground roll: 405'. Distance to clear 50': 920'. Total: 1325'
Stock Ground roll: 705' Distance to clear 50': 1350'. Total: 2055'​

A 36% reduction in take-off distance to clear a 50' obstacle.

Add a head wind and the outcome is much more dramatic. 10 kt headwind the distance is 1105'.
Are you sure that the ground roll and distance to clear fifty feet are to be added? Usually, they are just two different performance numbers.
 
I have a PA-34-200T, Piper Seneca II with R/STOL and I think it is a great modification. Admittedly, I have not had to replace any Robertson specific parts yet but the safety factor the STOL kit adds to the Seneca is fantastic. My airplane jumps off the runway so quickly I barely have time to check all gauges are in the green before it's time to rotate, even when near maximum t/o weight. More than one passenger (all non-pilots) has commented that the takeoff roll was surprisingly short. The R/STOL kit also reduces redline by 8 knots and during Multi-Engine Check Ride with DPA who had lots of time in a Seneca II, he was amazed that we could not lose ruder authority with one engine at zero thrust idle. The R/STOL kit is rigged to provide additional rudder deflection in addition to spoilers instead of ailerons and full length flaps on the wing. My DPA went on to get a bit tense on my first landing and said, "I've never been so slow in a Seneca" as we were over the numbers but I was flying the R/STOL published speeds and absolutely greased the landing. I think he had acquired an appreciation for the R/STOL kit after signing me off as a Multi-Engine Instrument pilot.
Unfortunately, I gave up FIKI to go with the R/STOL mod when looking for a Seneca II to purchase but I believe the R/STOL offers much more safety benefits than boots (I do have hot props). Nice to know Lancair purchased the Robertson STCs when Sierra when Tango Uniform. I had not heard that.
 
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