required simulated instrument for PPL question

[Ryan7943]

Hi all. I just have a quick question regarding the simulated instrument time for a PPL. I've logged 1.3 hrs of my required instrument in a simulator, and the other 1.7 in an actual airplane under the hood. My instructor says its fine for a PPL, but I've yet to come accross anything, specifically in the FAR, to verify this. Can someone please confirm that it is indeed ok to log the required simulated instrument time for a PPL in a simulator. Thanks in advance!

 

[murphey]

61.109(k) Permitted credit for use of flight simulator...

Max of 2.5 hrs .... if received from authorized instructor...for Part 61...
Max of 5 hours ....if .... Part 142

 

[Doggtyred]

What, exactly, are you using to define as a "simulator"? If its a PC with a yoke and pedals, its most likely a PCATD. The rules are different for them (or used to be.. I'm not exactly current)...

But in the past, what was truly a simulator was a contraption that cost thousands if not tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars, many times had motion capability, and could actually substitute for actual aircraft time. This is not very well defined in the FAR's, but rather in AC's

 

[Ryan7943]

61.109(k) Permitted credit for use of flight simulator...

Max of 2.5 hrs .... if received from authorized instructor...for Part 61...
Max of 5 hours ....if .... Part 142

DOH! I can't believe I missed that... there it is, clear as day. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction!

What, exactly, are you using to define as a "simulator"? If its a PC with a yoke and pedals, its most likely a PCATD. The rules are different for them (or used to be.. I'm not exactly current)...

But in the past, what was truly a simulator was a contraption that cost thousands if not tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars, many times had motion capability, and could actually substitute for actual aircraft time. This is not very well defined in the FAR's, but rather in AC's

I do not know the exact make and model off the top of my head, but it is basically a PC with a yoke, pedals, radio stack, etc.

 

[murphey]

What, exactly, are you using to define as a "simulator"? If its a PC with a yoke and pedals, its most likely a PCATD. The rules are different for them (or used to be.. I'm not exactly current)...

But in the past, what was truly a simulator was a contraption that cost thousands if not tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars, many times had motion capability, and could actually substitute for actual aircraft time. This is not very well defined in the FAR's, but rather in AC's

Full motion isn't required to be a simulator under current FAA rules for Part 61 Private. I took ground and sim courses at a local college (Part 142) and nothing has any motion…But all of them cost $X thousands, true. But all of them are running under Windows (NT I think...) on PCs.

10 single engine Frasca 141
2 multi-engine Frasca 142
3 multi-engine AST Seminoles
2 multi-engine turboprop Frasca 242TP

They've added 4 PCATD units, 4 Elite desk top models with visuals but
those came in after I took the courses.

 

[Trapper John]

Does the combination of your sim time and hood time in the aircraft make you confident that you can safely extract yourself from an accidental blunder into IMC? That's really what you should concern yourself with, IMO.

 

[Ryan7943]

Does the combination of your sim time and hood time in the aircraft make you confident that you can safely extract yourself from an accidental blunder into IMC? That's really what you should concern yourself with, IMO.

I can truthfully say, yes. I feel that if I was showing a lack of skill under the hood in the actual airplane my instructor would not have suggested we use the sim at all. I'm also sure I will be logging some more in the actual airplane during my checkride prep over the next couple weeks.

 

[poadeleted20]

What, exactly, are you using to define as a "simulator"?

For this purpose, it must be an FAA-approved flight simulation device. These include Aviation Training Devices (ATD's, either Advanced or Basic [AATD or BATD]), Flight Training Devices (FTD's), or Full Flight Simulators (the big jobs with motion and everything). See Appendix F to Part 60 of the FAR's for more details. In addition, the Letter of Authorization for the unit must specify that it is authorized for the training being conducted (in this case, to meet 61.109(a)(3)), although I don't think there's any approved flight simulation device which isn't approved for this particular use.

 

[Ryan7943]

For this purpose, it must be an FAA-approved flight simulation device. These include Aviation Training Devices (ATD's, either Advanced or Basic [AATD or BATD]), Flight Training Devices (FTD's), or Full Flight Simulators (the big jobs with motion and everything). See Appendix F to Part 60 of the FAR's for more details. In addition, the Letter of Authorization for the unit must specify that it is authorized for the training being conducted (in this case, to meet 61.109(a)(3)), although I don't think there's any approved flight simulation device which isn't approved for this particular use.

I'll check with my schools owner just to be 100% sure of this. They just got the sim about a month ago brand new so I'm sure it's approved, but like I said I want to be totally certain.