South Dakota has a couple of airplanes and a helicopter actually. But that's beside the point. I'm only visiting until August, plus I'm working on my CFI. I didn't have the time to commit to something that one person thought would be a very short checkout and another (who would be doing the checkout) clearly didn't trust me. It is what it is. I am probably 50 years younger than this guy, and although it doesn't bother me, I could tell it bothered him that a 20 something was going to fly "his" airplane. I imagine in Sioux Falls it's a different ballgame, because of the people. It's the people here I'm not terribly fond of.
Pros/Cons of Joining the Civil Air Patrol?
- Thread starter HighFlyingA380
- Start date
South Dakota has a couple of airplanes and a helicopter actually. But that's beside the point. I'm only visiting until August, plus I'm working on my CFI. I didn't have the time to commit to something that one person thought would be a very short checkout and another (who would be doing the checkout) clearly didn't trust me. It is what it is. I am probably 50 years younger than this guy, and although it doesn't bother me, I could tell it bothered him that a 20 something was going to fly "his" airplane. I imagine in Sioux Falls it's a different ballgame, because of the people. It's the people here I'm not terribly fond of.
I think it was mentioned before, you have to get along with the folks in the local group, otherwise it is tedious. No different form joining the local audubon society capter or a volunteer fire department.
oldShar
Cleared for Takeoff
murphey
Touchdown! Greaser!
For Transport or Orientation rides (cadets) only need the checkout, not the scanner then observer then pilot requirements.
docmirror
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Cowboy - yeehah!
Disclaimer: I have never been in the CAP, however I did serve 4 years active in USArmy and 1.5 years in Marines.
Every contact I've had with the CAPs has been negative. Sorry, but there it is. I've had several flight line volunteers, or cadets, or whatever get in my face at airshows/fly-ins. It seems to be my attitude at issue cause I don't like people in my face and I will tell them about it. When I walk to my plane, or marshal the fuel truck in, they seem to be hell-bent on 'helping'. The best help I got a few years back was at a fly-in down in San Antonio. The CAP guy directed me to parking, and I got backed in, then he proceeded to run his hands all along the leading edge of my polished wings as I was tying down the tail. I got out the Mothers and a couple microfiber rags and told him to get started on the polishing and I would be back to inspect later. He gave me some lip, and walked off.
If you are this kind of person, you will fit in very well with the CAP. If you are interested in flying planes, I think you will be sorely disappointed.
Every contact I've had with the CAPs has been negative. Sorry, but there it is. I've had several flight line volunteers, or cadets, or whatever get in my face at airshows/fly-ins. It seems to be my attitude at issue cause I don't like people in my face and I will tell them about it. When I walk to my plane, or marshal the fuel truck in, they seem to be hell-bent on 'helping'. The best help I got a few years back was at a fly-in down in San Antonio. The CAP guy directed me to parking, and I got backed in, then he proceeded to run his hands all along the leading edge of my polished wings as I was tying down the tail. I got out the Mothers and a couple microfiber rags and told him to get started on the polishing and I would be back to inspect later. He gave me some lip, and walked off.
If you are this kind of person, you will fit in very well with the CAP. If you are interested in flying planes, I think you will be sorely disappointed.
denverpilot
Tied Down
Which technically is against regs.
The minimum Corporate uniform is the white aviator shirt, grey slacks combo. The polo is an additional *optional* uniform.
But tons and tons of folks are told by Commanders and long timers alike... "Just buy the polo."
It's kinda fun to watch people fidget when they go to a Wing or Region event and the organizer knows this (SLS is a common "target" for this, to raise the ante a bit on folks wanting to be promoted to actually read the regs...) and doesn't authorize the polo as the UoD for the event.
Then all of a sudden, a bunch of folks run around learning how to build a ribbon rack, and order name plates and aviator shirts. Heh.
The polo also plays really badly in front of cameras and at military honor events, overall. The quality and sizing of them is also completely inconsistent from Vanguard.
Most of my Squadron looks like something the cats dragged in the night before, and the uniform violations are massive... So I post this here a bit tongue in cheek. Half my Squadron thinks black leather shoes means the $9 pair of black sneakers from Payless is appropriate.
As far as one other comment goes, the Corporate uniforms are authorized for all. You don't have to be overweight. Many choose them over putting on ancient no-longer standard USAF blue shirts and slacks.
Stop by any CAP online forum for a never ending debate about the myriad of uniforms and their wear, as well as the regular changes made by National. It's an enormous waste of time.
Show up, do your job, look like you took a shower sometime this year...
denverpilot
Tied Down
P.S. I've spoken my two cents about the organization at large and my experience has been okay...
But I don't fly for them yet, and may never. I'm squarely pegged as a radio-guy and just keep one of only three Wings that have a linked repeater system, functional.
Sometimes good, sometimes bad... I see the same in almost every large organization of volunteers out there, so ... there you have it.
Dedicated folks who are good at what they do in CAP tend to be very busy, and rarely the people doing flight line volunteering at airshows... Yeah, I said it. That'll win me some non-brownie points with a handful of people...
But it's true. I haven't got time for that. You'll find me on top of a mountain troubleshooting a balky repeater if I find myself with a weekend free for CAP work.
But I don't fly for them yet, and may never. I'm squarely pegged as a radio-guy and just keep one of only three Wings that have a linked repeater system, functional.
Sometimes good, sometimes bad... I see the same in almost every large organization of volunteers out there, so ... there you have it.
Dedicated folks who are good at what they do in CAP tend to be very busy, and rarely the people doing flight line volunteering at airshows... Yeah, I said it. That'll win me some non-brownie points with a handful of people...
But it's true. I haven't got time for that. You'll find me on top of a mountain troubleshooting a balky repeater if I find myself with a weekend free for CAP work.
ChrisK
En-Route
Severly OT. My people keep asking why I don't push for a linked repeater system. I keep trying to explain that Ohio is ... flat ... mostly ... and we are pretty far down the priority list in terms of linking =)
airdale
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airdale
Yup. Actually, now that I think about it I also have a flight suit. I bought it for colder weather wear but it is a PITA because the pockets are in inconvenient places so I never wear it. Probably the patches and do-dahs on it are wrong anyway.
If you want to attend those events, that is. Lots of people do.
http://captalk.net/index.php?PHPSESSID=a2e05ebec5cc6581741671cbf5dab596&board=3.0 I do it once in a while when I want a good laugh. But that's really not very fair. People are interested in different things. Mainly I fly and run Air Branch on missions. Others like the uniforms, ribbons, and ceremonial aspects. Others, the Cadet program. More power to them.
In fact, that's really the point of many posts here. Any organization attracts various kinds of people, each of whom has different interests, strengths, and weaknesses. CAP is no different. Hopefully the OP is getting that.
Wow. If that was my situation I wouldn't admit it.
The technical term for this type of behaviour is 'petty crap' and any command level person who is using this to satisfy his own entertainment needs should be required to spend a couple of hours of self-study on whether his actions are promoting the values and mission of CAP. It is the kind of stuff that drives qualified people away.
soyAnarchisto
Pre-Flight
just a little club were guys like to get together wear a uniform and pretend that they are sheriffs deputies
Sorry - but that sounds exactly like the CAP. Most qualified people want no part of uniformed tea time with a Mexican General, nor do they want to be involved in law enforcement activities.
I'm talking about search and rescue only. Which is where help is needed in my view. After hearing about how the search for that 9 year old girl was handled I am now convinced that the CAP should be disbanded and properly trained and qualified volunteers should replace them.
I've volunteered for Mountain Rescue Association (MRA) SAR - ground technical rescues, recoveries, and air scent dog search work. Nothing to do with "petty crap" or law enforcement. There should be an equivalent training regiment and organization and 503c that allow people to write off as a donation their training and callout time like they do for angel flight. People would give. I would, and I know others who would too.
JeffDG
Touchdown! Greaser!
Still no good...Your basic uniform is the blues or the White/Grey, all others are optional additional uniforms.
Also, no rule outside the People's Republic of California to wear a flight suit while flying.
JeffDG
Touchdown! Greaser!
Yeah...good for 99% of the time, but by a strict reading of the regs, you need one of the two basic uniforms...
Me, the only thing I put on my uniform is the mandatory nametag...don't even know what "ribbons" I'm entitled to.
Sorry - but that sounds exactly like the CAP. Most qualified people want no part of uniformed tea time with a Mexican General, nor do they want to be involved in law enforcement activities.
I'm talking about search and rescue only. Which is where help is needed in my view. After hearing about how the search for that 9 year old girl was handled I am now convinced that the CAP should be disbanded and properly trained and qualified volunteers should replace them.
I've volunteered for Mountain Rescue Association (MRA) SAR - ground technical rescues, recoveries, and air scent dog search work. Nothing to do with "petty crap" or law enforcement. There should be an equivalent training regiment and organization and 503c that allow people to write off as a donation their training and callout time like they do for angel flight. People would give. I would, and I know others who would too.
I live in unincorporated land at a place defined by a road intersection. In 1957, a couple of homeowners said 'there ought to be a fire department to help protect our homes. They chartered a fire company, raised money for a used pumper, got a pile of donated bricks and built a firehouse.
Nobody, not CAP nor the sheriff stops you from starting a volunteer airborne SAR organization that doesn't require uniforms. You will however notice that after about a year, your volunteers will take a vote on which color their uniform is going to be. It is a staple of american volunteerism that people like to wear a uniform. Even the ladies who give tours of the old mansion in the nearby statepark have their embroidered blouses.
Btw. with 'petty crap' I wasn't referring to wearing a uniform or adhering to organizational policies. I was referring to little napoleon 'leaders' turning those policies into a tool for their own entertainment or power-trip. It is a trait that you will find in anything from large companies, the military or hierarchical volunteer orgs like the boyscouts or CAP.
murphey
Touchdown! Greaser!
I do too. But mine is royal blue (think NASA astronauts). Originally got it for the Mercury exhibit at the museum (I was a volunteer), now it's a Halloween costume. I also have just the black cargo pants, again for the Museum. Great for loading the pockets with everything I'll need during a shift (duct tape, radio, velcro, etc)
denverpilot
Tied Down
Trust me, qualified people know how to put on a simple uniform. It's rarely qualified people who haven't paid any attention to the simple regs, since they work under much more difficult ones.
Appropriate dress is covered in Level I... And none of it is difficult. Call it an intelligence test, if you like.
murphey
Touchdown! Greaser!
1) Each CAP squadron has its own personality. Go to meetings, see if you're interested. Make your own decision.
2) If you're looking to fly for free as soon as you join - not gonna happen. You want to rent an airplane someplace, you'll go thru a checkout. Same with CAP, but the process is aggravated by USAF policies. On the other hand, the checkout counts as a BFR.
3) Yes there are uniforms. Acceptable uniform/dress is dependent on the squadron. Refer back to #1.
Pros & Cons of Uniforms:
If you participated in almost any school sport, you probably wore a uniform. Unless you're self-employed, you wear a uniform - business casual, power suit, company-issued clothing, etc.
A number of companies I've worked for give the new employees polo shirts with company logo on it. (And you can always buy more). Many service groups (Angel Flight for example) have logo polo shirts. Why? Because it presents a consistent image of the organization.
4) Think of Senior CAP as Scouting for Grownups. (Sorry, couldn't resist). Rank & medals in place of badges.
5) Involvement is highly dependent on location. I know CFIIs back east who are in CAP. Their squadrons have never participated in any type of mission because no jurisdiction has ever requested it. Yet in Colorado, many counties and other governmental entities have standing arrangements (contracts) with CAP to fly observation missions between June & September. Fire season and all that. Couple weeks ago it was non-stop.
ELTs in the mountains - easier & cheaper to send a CAP airplane to pinpoint it and then direct sheriff's dept to the location if it's a real ELT emergency or one in a hangar that went off.
6) Not for everyone. Refer back to #1.
KeyWestPhotog
Pre-takeoff checklist
Do you need help on getting you setup with what you have earned?
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wabower
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Wayne
Has anybody studied the "officious plssant" behavior pattern exhibited by some of these lightweights to determine whether it is genetic vs. learned?
soyAnarchisto
Pre-Flight
Trust me, qualified people can put on a uniform, but refuse to. And that means you are left with people who want that - and many many people feel it is not germain to the sar mission.
And after the world sees 2400 sq mile TFRs for search area, the CAP value is extremely suspect.
There are entire communities of pilots who now instruct their family members to do anything but initiate a search from the CAP. It speaks volumes.
denverpilot
Tied Down
Never seen a TFR over a search area ever, here.
Family can do whatever they want. Hire DigitalGlobe and take some satellite photos. Whatever. If they hire pilots, CAP backs off and stays away from that area for safety for the volunteers.
The reality is CAP is fulfilling USAF's inland SAR role because... [fill in whatever you believe keeps USAF from accomplishing their charter here...].
Ooh, that'll get me some enemies from all sides... But hey, USCG gets their maritime charter done and hires pros to do it.
When all you have is volunteers, you're never going to have the quality of a professional crew. That's just reality. Even the best trained volunteers sometimes can't show up.
Y'all up for training and keeping squadrons of USAF folks spun up for the occasional missing aircraft? It won't be cheap. Cough up a lot of money.
Doesn't matter. Drones will be doing it all in ten years anyway.
Another reason those hoardes of qualified people you claim are out there, who simply don't show up because of a polo shirt, aren't going to be needed anyway ... very soon.
Family can do whatever they want. Hire DigitalGlobe and take some satellite photos. Whatever. If they hire pilots, CAP backs off and stays away from that area for safety for the volunteers.
The reality is CAP is fulfilling USAF's inland SAR role because... [fill in whatever you believe keeps USAF from accomplishing their charter here...].
Ooh, that'll get me some enemies from all sides... But hey, USCG gets their maritime charter done and hires pros to do it.
When all you have is volunteers, you're never going to have the quality of a professional crew. That's just reality. Even the best trained volunteers sometimes can't show up.
Y'all up for training and keeping squadrons of USAF folks spun up for the occasional missing aircraft? It won't be cheap. Cough up a lot of money.
Doesn't matter. Drones will be doing it all in ten years anyway.
Another reason those hoardes of qualified people you claim are out there, who simply don't show up because of a polo shirt, aren't going to be needed anyway ... very soon.
Palmpilot
Touchdown! Greaser!
Can you cite the specific regulation that requires a member to have one of those?
When I was a mission pilot, that requirement only applied to search flying (either actual or training), and was mandated by Pacific Region, not California Wing.
Palmpilot
Touchdown! Greaser!
Nobody said anything about needing an aviator shirt or blues when I took Level I. But I guess our squadron was pretty laid back about that kind of thing.
ChrisK
En-Route
CAP doesn't do that. Must be one of those local volunteer search organizations...
denverpilot
Tied Down
The answer is in Chapter 1 of CAPM 39-1. The Basic Uniforms are listed. Basic uniforms are the minimum required.
It's popular to pick on CAP on most aviation forums these days. Never seen anyone actually step up to put money where their mouth is, and build anything better.
If the public wants a professional workforce to do the three missions of CAP, they can tell Congress. Otherwise, volunteers it is...
airdale
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airdale
The internet is amazing. So many facts available at your fingertips, many of them complete fantasies. Please cite your sources.
BTW, families don't initiate searches. There is a formal "missing airplane" procedure where ATC initially involves Flight Service, then the situation may progress to the AFRCC and, usually, the state duty officer. ELT reports and other situations are handled according to similar procedures. It is at the AFRCC/Duty Officer level that search assets are chosen and deployed.
Even if a family member somehow contacted CAP directly, that would not be cause to initiate a search. They would be referred to AFRCC and asked to provide whatever information they had. AFRCC would decide.
(All this for CONUS inland SAR. Maritime/USCG and Alaska have different but similar procedures. Not sure about Hawaii.)
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DavidWhite
Final Approach
I haven't seen any uboats in awhile so they must be doing a good job.
ChrisK
En-Route
/sigh
CAP is trying to remarket themselves, absolutely. They are trying to remain relevant, and sometimes it is annoying to pay for an organization and then be marketed at. I will say that, provided our government funding CAP's communications and transportation / aerial infrastructure, they are a bargain to state and federal agencies looking to provide a presence and augment specialty units. At equipment reimbursement rates with free nominally trained personnel, my state is pretty excited about our capability, particularly regarding aerial photos and communications. CAP does not do what they did even 10 years ago, but that's ok. It turns out there are cost effective uses for CAP that are different than what they did traditionally.
It is also understood that folks do not appreciate CAP's use of the military uniform, and they get that from both sides. Military folks don't always seem to like civilians in a military style uniform (particularly when they butcher the wear, but heck, some military folks do that too). CAP members don't always want to bother with the military uniform either. Personally, I think they should wear it and wear it proudly. From what I've been told by ex guard members in CAP, the nonprofit auxiliary trains as much as many guard folk. Might as well take some pride in what they do and wear the military style uniform proudly when able.
I understand that CAP gets hate from pilots who wanted to fly and got told to jump through hoops. I also understand that CAP is a turnoff for the occasional volunteer who doesn't want to bother with cadets and uniforms. Finally, I understand that CAP is a turnoff for the taxpayer who would rather fund the military or local police or just not fund ANYONE to do CAP's delegated USAF mission (this one is the most confusing to me, but I've seen it). You all can go do your own thing, or not. No use in throwing stones at CAP. They represent a cross-section of humanity just like any organization. They have bullies, know-it-alls, bureaucrats, and sometimes they have philanthropists who just want to give something back and make the world a better place.
I don't know why any of you are flying or why you got started. For me, CAP's program worked. I was in for almost 20 years before I started flying. It is why I'm here on this board. People talk about how GA is dying and how it is hard to get people involved in such an expensive "hobby". You might not like CAP, but minimally as a GA advocacy group, it actually isn't bad.
CAP is trying to remarket themselves, absolutely. They are trying to remain relevant, and sometimes it is annoying to pay for an organization and then be marketed at. I will say that, provided our government funding CAP's communications and transportation / aerial infrastructure, they are a bargain to state and federal agencies looking to provide a presence and augment specialty units. At equipment reimbursement rates with free nominally trained personnel, my state is pretty excited about our capability, particularly regarding aerial photos and communications. CAP does not do what they did even 10 years ago, but that's ok. It turns out there are cost effective uses for CAP that are different than what they did traditionally.
It is also understood that folks do not appreciate CAP's use of the military uniform, and they get that from both sides. Military folks don't always seem to like civilians in a military style uniform (particularly when they butcher the wear, but heck, some military folks do that too). CAP members don't always want to bother with the military uniform either. Personally, I think they should wear it and wear it proudly. From what I've been told by ex guard members in CAP, the nonprofit auxiliary trains as much as many guard folk. Might as well take some pride in what they do and wear the military style uniform proudly when able.
I understand that CAP gets hate from pilots who wanted to fly and got told to jump through hoops. I also understand that CAP is a turnoff for the occasional volunteer who doesn't want to bother with cadets and uniforms. Finally, I understand that CAP is a turnoff for the taxpayer who would rather fund the military or local police or just not fund ANYONE to do CAP's delegated USAF mission (this one is the most confusing to me, but I've seen it). You all can go do your own thing, or not. No use in throwing stones at CAP. They represent a cross-section of humanity just like any organization. They have bullies, know-it-alls, bureaucrats, and sometimes they have philanthropists who just want to give something back and make the world a better place.
I don't know why any of you are flying or why you got started. For me, CAP's program worked. I was in for almost 20 years before I started flying. It is why I'm here on this board. People talk about how GA is dying and how it is hard to get people involved in such an expensive "hobby". You might not like CAP, but minimally as a GA advocacy group, it actually isn't bad.
You are very mistaken......
http://www.ntsb.gov/AviationQuery/brief.aspx?ev_id=20121125X95949&key=1..
Before I rejoined the CAP this year a plane crashed and a good friend , who is the CAP head honcho here in Jackson called me.. He is aware I know about every sq foot of this country and wanted my opinion.. he even had a very detailed radar track of the accident plane given to him by SLC center.... We reviewed the facts we had and I suggested to him where I thought the plane had gone down at.... In less then 24 hours the Civil Air Patrol got a 36 miles TFR for that area after I told them I would fly that sector and look for the plane.... Keep in mind this TFR encompassed the airspace over my private airport and prevented me for using my own airport.... The more I thought about this chicken***** move, the madder I got... So I called FSS and got a briefing for a flight to my airport and he said... Ya can't go there,, there is a TFR... He gave me the contact phone# for the CAP ****ole who had requested the TFR.. I proceeded to call him and let him have a piece of my mind..
.....I them told him I am going to my ranch and land there and if you want to stop me you better launch some F-18's... I knew about where the crashed plane was and that location was 17 miles from 2WY3.... No way would I be interfering with their dog and pony show..... Long story short... they found the plane 5 days later in almost the exact spot I told them about 3 hours after the crash................. And it took them 2 more days to cancel the #ucking TFR..
.. Look the details up, you will see the crash site.... the TFR and to ice the cake... The CAP didn't find it even after flying the area for days.... A ground crew rode right to it on snowmobiles after someone told them of the location I suggested....
...A week later was the Utah crash and several of us wanted to go down there to search for survivers... We were told to keep the hell away because they had it all under control...... The rest is history
Moral of the story is..... Don't say CAP cannot issue a TFR .. because they can and did..
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airdale
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airdale
Yup. I agree.
As an Air Branch Director I have multiple air crews in that area, carefully deconflicted as to search area overlaps, transit altitudes, etc. and communicating with each other on CAP FM frequencies. The real world is that even the pilots of those airplanes are looking for the crash site, paying less attention to see-and-avoid than they should be.
To have some bozo show up in the search area at any altitude he feels like, flying wherever he chooses, effectively NORDO, and also looking down, is not high on my list of desired situations. If this kind of chicken***** arrogance persisted for very long, I would consult with the IC about requesting a TFR through AFRCC. I am not interested in having one incident result in another.
You could be God's gift to aviation, but unless you can arrange to have God deconflicting the activity in the area, you are a hazard not an asset.
Obviously I have no knowledge of your specific situation and how it might have been handled better (or not), but the reason I do not want you in my search area has nothing to do with your skills or knowledge relative to the 5-15 air crews working the incident. It is because you are a hazard.
Incidentally, I have never requested a TFR. If I ever have a situation where a few know-it-alls like you show up, though, that will prompt the call to AFRCC.
Pick up the phone, call Center or whatever ATC facility governs, and they will be happy to work with us to get you in or out. If you put the " #ucking TFR" attitude in your pocket, things will go very smoothly.
Palmpilot
Touchdown! Greaser!
The answer is in Chapter 1 of CAPM 39-1. The Basic Uniforms are listed. Basic uniforms are the minimum required.
OK, I see it in 1-5.
Fortunately, I've never particpated in anything where it was an issue.
ChrisK
En-Route
20 years and I've never seen anyone do that. I've seen aircrews snicker over disrupting Bravo airspace for an ELT, but set up a TFR? That is unnecessary. At worst I think a NOTAM regarding SAR activity would suffice.
I'm ashamed that someone would do that unless there was a darn good reason.
I'm ashamed that someone would do that unless there was a darn good reason.
Funny........... You didn't mention a THING about the Utah fiasco /deaths....
And... my life goes smoothly now... I dismiss the CAP as the REAL problem..... not the cure...
DavidWhite
Final Approach
Speaking of showing up at any altitude you feel like.....
I've had one almost midair with a real genius flying at the wrong altitude for his heading - it wasn't hard to make out the CAP logo on the bottom of his wing.....or his gold framed sunglasses. I've had another guy pull out on the runway when I was on short final and tell me he was doing his run up. It was after this point that I realized that most CAP pilots ONLY fly CAP planes and are almost as incompetent as the government that funds them. I've learned to give them a wide berth as you can't predict what they will do next. One of the few days I towed gliders I had a CAP plane fly not anymore than 10' over the two plane and glider staged on the threshold. That being said, I know there are a few good squadrons around and it sounds like it depends heavily on the squadron.
That also being said, my airborne dealings have led me to believe that ineptness abounds.
denverpilot
Tied Down
Blah blah blah. There's bad pilots in all sorts of airplanes not painted red white and blue also.
I ain't saying CAP has their you-know-what together, but I've been close to being mowed down by both a Mooney and a Katana and neither had any logos on the wings.
Private pilots are private pilots. That guy flying the CAP plane may be a bog-standard Private pilot acting stupid and not even Mission rated. It means he or she has taken one checkride that's basically a dumbed down Private PTS.
He or she is as "safe" a pilot as anyone else in their Mooney or Katana who hasn't done anything but a BFR every two years.
They're paying for the flight, just like the doofus in the Katana that almost mowed me down one day. It's VFR so if he did, the accident report would include my inability to see and avoid if I didn't survive it, just like any other VFR midair.
Problem is, he or she has a CAP logo tattooed to the aircraft.
So that might make the less informed think they represent CAP in their red white and blue airplane.
We've all seen bad pilots. CAP has its share.
I ain't saying CAP has their you-know-what together, but I've been close to being mowed down by both a Mooney and a Katana and neither had any logos on the wings.
Private pilots are private pilots. That guy flying the CAP plane may be a bog-standard Private pilot acting stupid and not even Mission rated. It means he or she has taken one checkride that's basically a dumbed down Private PTS.
He or she is as "safe" a pilot as anyone else in their Mooney or Katana who hasn't done anything but a BFR every two years.
They're paying for the flight, just like the doofus in the Katana that almost mowed me down one day. It's VFR so if he did, the accident report would include my inability to see and avoid if I didn't survive it, just like any other VFR midair.
Problem is, he or she has a CAP logo tattooed to the aircraft.
So that might make the less informed think they represent CAP in their red white and blue airplane.
We've all seen bad pilots. CAP has its share.
Threefingeredjack
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Threefingeredjack
I have to admit that while my experience with CAP was underwhelming, the theory that any organization drawn from the public has the same quality gradations as the general public is a valid one. I have no doubt there are very competent operators in CAP, but like everywhere else they attract no attention and therefore no animas. It's the bozos who pull the dumb crap that leave a sour taste in the mouths of those who witness them.