POH, AFM, pre-1979

[Sundancer]

Howdy - I have an "Owners Handbook" for a pre-1979 Cherokee 140. It's fairly lame, and references the FAA approved "Flight Manual" as the authoritative source for operating the airplane. That's the document I do NOT have. What I know:

1. The FAA and industry settled on a format for POH manuals in 1979, so after that a POH incorporates what will satisfy the "O" and "W" in AROW.

2. But it's murky pre-1979. The airplane in question obviously had an AFM published - it's mentioned in the Owner's Handbook - Piper web site says contact a Piper Dealer. Working on that.

3. Would the Owner's Handbook, placards, and the W&B from the maintenance log meet the spirit and intent for the FAA?

 

[Stewartb]

Did your mechanic sign off the annual?

 

[dmspilot]

What year and model is it exactly?

 

[mondtster]

3. Would the Owner's Handbook, placards, and the W&B from the maintenance log meet the spirit and intent for the FAA?

Likely not. Consult the TCDS and see what report needs to be in the aircraft. In the case of a Piper, I can pretty much guarantee that the owner’s handbook won’t satisfy the requirement.

Even my 1953 Super Cub has a flight manual that needs to be in the aircraft. It’s a 3 or 4 page leaflet, not the owner’s manual. Similar flight manuals were used throughout the production run, so a 1994 PA18 will still not have a POH like most would expect. The older Cherokees are no different.

 

[mondtster]

Did your mechanic sign off the annual?

Even though they should be looking for the correct paperwork, most don’t seem to do it. I just ran across the issue the OP is having with a PA22 that just had an inspection and was signed off as being airworthy. The manual was nowhere to be found.

 

[Sundancer]

Yep, the more I read what I wrote, the more I see it makes sense to have the AFM in the aircraft. It's not my airplane, but I fly it - and the ramp check is on me as PIC if the docs aren't correct. This will be a conversation with the club next meeting. The FAA is a bloated and festering cess-pit, a stop, stumble, and fall bureaucracy - BUT that doesn't mean they can't be correct about a lot of stuff, too.

 

[Sundancer]

Likely not. Consult the TCDS and see what report needs to be in the aircraft. In the case of a Piper, I can pretty much guarantee that the owner’s handbook won’t satisfy the requirement.

Even my 1953 Super Cub has a flight manual that needs to be in the aircraft. It’s a 3 or 4 page leaflet, not the owner’s manual. Similar flight manuals were used throughout the production run, so a 1994 PA18 will still not have a POH like most would expect. The older Cherokees are no different.

Thank you - your pointer to the TCDS did the trick; it identified the Airplane Flight Manual as "VB-160" and a google search fond it available at a couple of places - got a download for $13.00.

 

[mondtster]

Thank you - your pointer to the TCDS did the trick; it identified the Airplane Flight Manual as "VB-160" and a google search fond it available at a couple of places - got a download for $13.00.

Glad to hear you could find the manual easily and inexpensively! I’ve had to order a few directly from Piper and they’re a bit more expensive.

 

[Dan Thomas]

Free:

http://www.westlockflyingclub.com/pa28poh.pdf

POHs are often put on the web by schools for their students. Some, though, might not have the latest revisions.

I can usually find POHs or AFMs and service manuals and parts catalogs for most popular aircraft as .pdfs on the 'net.

 

[mondtster]

Free:

http://www.westlockflyingclub.com/pa28poh.pdf

POHs are often put on the web by schools for their students. Some, though, might not have the latest revisions.

I can usually find POHs or AFMs and service manuals and parts catalogs for most popular aircraft as .pdfs on the 'net.

While nice to have, that’s not the report he needs. This will likely lead to confusion.