Pirep on the JPI 830 vs 900 vs 930

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Riceyoung

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Cliff
I am getting an engine monitor in my Turbo Toga. I was originally thinking about getting the edm 830. Now I am strongly thinking of getting either the 900 or the 930 and ditching all of the old analog gauges. I would love some feedback from people who have experience with these engine monitors.
 
I have the 830 and can't imagine now flying a plane without full engine monitoring. The fuel usage tied into my GPS is great and even better is the fact that it automatically calculates the percent of horsepower being used. I was doing a huge amount of work on my plane at the time, so I opted for the easier install of the 830, but any of them are great options IMO.

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I have the 930 installed in my Tiger replacing all the OEM engine and fuel instruments and gauges, and after 8 years and 1300 hours of operation with it I love it. JPI's tech support to the installing shop was outstanding.
 
A perfect example of spending money to save money. I'm with these other gentlemen. I wouldn't want to fly without my JPI. Knowing what your engine is doing in detail and how fuel glow is impacted with various power and mixture settings is priceless.
 
I had an 800 which I loved and I upgraded it to an 830 which was almost a simple swap out (the 830 requires a larger hole in the panel). My engine gauges (RPM, MP, Fuel Flow, Oil T, CHT, EGT) are tiny Beech gauges on the far side of the panel. The 830 is installed right to the right of the VSI (under the #2 nav head). I tend to use the 830 for everything. Obviously if you're going to lean effectively it's necessary (as well as balanced injectors).
 
There isn't a wrong answer, except to NOT install a monitor! The budget of an 830 vs. the others is quite different since you can remove the old stuff if you wish, and you might want/need a completely new panel to make it all work nicely. The 900/930 doesn't do anything "better" than an 830 except allow you to remove old stuff that may or may not work, recover some useful load, tidy-up the panel, etc.

I'm going from a -700 to a -900 but keeping my original panel for now. Redesign will come whenever I make the leap to a PFD. I think it is vitally important to have the monitor a close to the pilot as possible, and that is why I went with the -900 since a -930 wouldn't fit where I want.
 
I went from a 700 to a 830. If I were doing a panel rework, I'd go with a 930 and get rid of the old gauges. A contributing factor for me was picking up a brand new 830 unit used at a fraction of the cost of new.
 
The JPI 900 has a lower price point now (probably due to the competition with the EI CGR-30P) than it did a year ago. I have an 830 and would have jumped on the 900 considering the current pricing.
 
What is the difference between the 900 and the 930?
I think I will get one or the other for my 1976 182.
 
I have a 700 in my 185 and am planning on upgrading to a EI and ditching the crappy cessna engine and fuel gauges, seems like a better form factor, might be worth checking out.


http://www.aircraftspruce.com/pages/av/ems_ei/eicgr30p10-05345.php
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CGR30b.jpg
 
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It looks like the JPI would give you a larger display over the Ei unit. Is space an issue for you? Pro e is about the same.
 
Unit74 said:
It looks like the JPI would give you a larger display over the Ei unit. Is space an issue for you? Pro e is about the same.
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You can set up the EI to alarm at certain values, You could get all the must know all the time values on one page I think.

I'm all for simplifying my panel and reducing my scan, you won't see a bunch of iPads, handheld GPS, etc all over.
 
I just installed a JPI 830. I didn't install a 900/930 because as a primary, the alarms are not adjustable. In other words, for example, on my Lycoming, redline for CHT is 500 degrees and the JPI (as a primary) 900/930 will not alarm till you get to 500 degrees. My 830 is not a primary so I set the CHT to alarm at 400 degrees. I am using the 830 (like Ron above, I have all the probes) to alert me when I have any engine problems well below redline values. I cannot do this with a 900/930 unless I'm willing to be alerted when it is too late. For me, I buy the cheapest primary gauges I can find (or I kept the crappy stock gauges), ignore them completely, and use the 830 to alert me to problems at their onset.
 
182driver said:
What is the difference between the 900 and the 930?
I think I will get one or the other for my 1976 182.
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Size. Both are primary instruments and can replace required instrumentation.
 
James331 said:
You can set up the EI to alarm at certain values, You could get all the must know all the time values on one page I think.
Click to expand...

If used as a primary, EI sets the alarms at the factory and they can't be changed by the pilot or avionics shop.

James331 said:
I'm all for simplifying my panel and reducing my scan, you won't see a bunch of iPads, handheld GPS, etc all over.
Click to expand...

I use an EI AV-17 Voice Annunciator and if there is something astray (engine monitor, stuck starter relay, vacuum, electrical problem, oil temp or pressure, fuel flow or quantity, traffic), I get bitchin betty in the headset. I fly VFR and rarely scan my panel, prefering to look outside as much as possible.
 
Another caution if you intend to remove the old primary gauges. Failure of a non-primary function in the new analyzer requiring removal for service will ground the plane. So if the EGT or fuel flow circuitry fails, or the communications link with the gps, and needs to be replaced by JPI/EI, your plane will be down for a week or two (or more) while it is removed, ships, is repaired, returns, and is reinstalled.

So you may want to leave in the old gauges for that reason, as well.
 
JohnAJohnson said:
If used as a primary, EI sets the alarms at the factory and they can't be changed by the pilot or avionics shop.



I use an EI AV-17 Voice Annunciator and if there is something astray (engine monitor, stuck starter relay, vacuum, electrical problem, oil temp or pressure, fuel flow or quantity, traffic), I get bitchin betty in the headset. I fly VFR and rarely scan my panel, prefering to look outside as much as possible.
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Same for IFR, I just rather have a less "stuff" going on in my scan, if I'm interested in something specific or I hear a funny sound I can always page over to that system.

Just seems like there is such thing as overload, I see people with so many screen, with all this informstion on each screen, all right infront of them on some of these videos, you'd think it was a scene from the matrix.
 
JohnAJohnson said:
I didn't install a 900/930 because as a primary, the alarms are not adjustable.
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I think that is a certification requirement, but the 900/930 now have an adjustable "pre-alarm" that you can set to go off before the mandatory alarm, so I think that JPI has fixed that particular issue.

Google finds me lots of pictures of 182s with the 930, but not with the 900. It makes me wonder if I am missing some reason why the 900 is not acceptable. Maybe it is mounting issues?
 
182driver said:
I think that is a certification requirement, but the 900/930 now have an adjustable "pre-alarm" that you can set to go off before the mandatory alarm, so I think that JPI has fixed that particular issue.
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That's great news and was something sorely lacking. Fantastic!

182driver said:
Google finds me lots of pictures of 182s with the 930, but not with the 900. It makes me wonder if I am missing some reason why the 900 is not acceptable. Maybe it is mounting issues?
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Dunno. The 900 fits in any 3 1/8 hole, and the 930 consumes a position in the stack (I think it's 6.25" wide) and really looks great if you have the room. Looking at the pictures, it'll display 13 probes, plus the EGTs and CHTs. The 900 is the same size as my 830 and the display really is big enough to read most everything, and looks to be able to display 17 probes simultaneously, plus the EGTs and CHTs.

One thing I would recommend if you get either... Get rid of the Cessna resistive fuel sensors and install the Electronics International P300-M Magnetic Fuel Sensors (they are PMA, so logbook entry only and you are legal). They're about $315 each, and you can't hardly get the Cessna resistive probes overhauled for that price. The magnetic probes, once installed and calibrated, will be accurate forever.
 
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I have the EI MVP-50 and love it. Don't just limit your search to JPI IMO.

mvp50.png


My MVP-50 in my panel-

gallery_7392_14036_328037.jpg
 
I would have gone with an MVP-50 if I hadn't had an EDM-700 and an upgrade path. The EI unit really has more capability than the 930 for about the same money. Plus, I find the EI guys very easy to work with over the phone.

That's a great looking panel Dave. Really like the 430/SL30 set, each with its own 106. Clean, functional, quality.
 
182driver said:
JohnAJohnson said: I think that is a certification requirement, but the 900/930 now have an adjustable "pre-alarm" that you can set to go off before the mandatory alarm, so I think that JPI has fixed that particular issue.
Click to expand...

Thank goodness. It's one thing to set a redline. Its another to set a "pay attention" visual or audible alert.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
 
Is anybody ABSOLUTELY SURE of the size of the EDM-900? The JPI web site disagrees with itself in various places. The product fact sheet at https://www.jpinstruments.com/shop/edm-900-2/ says the whole 900 unit is only 4.53” by 3.32” and that it fits in a 3” hole. Other places say it fits in a 3.125" hole, other places say it is the same size as the 830 which is 4.234" X 3.180" and the FAQ says it is 5.32″ X 5.51″. The panel cutout guide says "coming soon." The 830 install guide has the picture I would want on page 24, but the 900 install guide does not. I have an email into JPI tech support, but if someone has a 900 and ruler I could use the help.

I am going to be really close on mounting space, so I am worried about the unit size, not just the screen size. The round part that sticks out the back is not centered and I'd like to know exactly where it is, but I doubt anybody but JPI can conveniently tell me that. I can use the flush mount to get around an issue if unit needs to be offset from the hole in the panel. Thanks as always for any help.
 
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Well, I have to retract some of what I have said. The JPI technical support responds quickly, but you really have to be firm to ever get a real answer. I guess Tim is measured on how quickly he responds, not on if he actually answers the question that was asked. Too bad, since his support is a requirement for getting the EDM-900 working.

A large part of the manual is wrong, especially anything having to do with programming the unit. I think the 900 is a modified 830, but they didn't sweat the details in the manual when they changed things. Any time they tell you what 2 buttons to push, just be prepared to try every combination of 2 buttons until you happen to get the right pair because the manual is wrong 80% of the time. The unit also doesn't store everything like the advertisements say it does. You download all this data, but it does not have hobbs time, for example, even though that is in the unit. Kind of makes it hard to keep up a log book on the plane.

The amps reading shows an occasional glitch on my unit. I think they have a timing problem with the latch on their A to D converter. JPI actually thought I was using 110 amps every once in while! I'm an electrical engineer, but I think anyone should realize that a 110 amp spike just doesn't happen in a 12 volt system without some burned wires and a blown breaker to go with it. Support (Tim) and his tech rep were going to send my data to engineering, but I heard nothing. At least the EDM-900 made it easy to send them the data since you can get it into a file (without hobbs time, but with most other things.)

My guess is he 830 didn't have things like hobbs time and the 900 is a real quick and dirty adaption of the 830. The Ez Trendz software is a joke. The basic engine monitoring of CHT and EGT works, but the rest of the unit is an afterthought. I don't know what the competition really has, so I can't offer a comparison, but I also cannot recommend the JPI EDM-900. It is OK, but there is so much room for improvement that, if I had to do it over again, I'd take my chance with a different company.
 
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