Penalty for flying without certificate?

midlifeflyer said:
I used to practice criminal law. Street crime, drugs, white collar. Not one of my clients ever thought he's get caught (not even the repeat offenders who had plenty of evidence to the contrary).
Click to expand...

Most people who do that sort of thing have very little to use. Most people who can afford to fly, don't.

The risk/benefit seems out of balance in my opinion.
 
bflynn said:
Failure to report it is a moral defect on your part. It is your problem one way or another.

If the guy is caught one day and it comes out that you knew, as you've admitted here, there could be consequences to you, depending on how much they want to push it.
Click to expand...

Lets say I know every license plate of every car that passed me speeding yesterday. Guess I'd better send an anonymous tip to the Police?

BS!

Not. My. Problem.

The people who NEED to care are his friends and family, and Doc's advice is the advice they should heed. Random pilots who "heard" he's doing something wrong, need not bother to attend.

So... the moral issue is... Are you his friend, or not? If you consider him a friend, you're duty-bound to go save his butt, or at least try. If he or she won't be saved, you're done.

Send an anonymous note to the Agency that was paid $16.4 BILLION this year to regulate Aviation, and wash your hands of it.
 
Hey kids, you can win a free bicycle, all you have to do is report on your friends and family. It's simple, just go to your schools political officer and tell her what's going on in your home and neighborhood.

I'm wondering if such a statement will fail to raise eyebrows in the not so distant future.

Making it a crime to not report your fellow pilots just does not sound like the America I grew up in, even if it does make perfect sense now.

-John
 
Old Geek said:
This sort of namecalling and pontificating is why POA is nearly useless to me. The lady asked what the penalties were. Simple as that. We don't know what her situation is or her relationship with the pilot is.

Personally, I assume she's got a good head and is trying to fix the situation the best way possible. And leave it at that.
Click to expand...

Agree.
 
Is it just me, but are the penalties for driving a car without a license worse than those for flying without a license?

Doug
 
Hey!! What's the big deal about not having a pilot's certificate? After all Wilbur Wright never got his.:rolleyes:

José
 
Piloto said:
Hey!! What's the big deal about not having a pilot's certificate? After all Wilbur Wright never got his.:rolleyes:

José
Click to expand...

If a person builds and test pilots a homebuilt, experimental aircraft in uncontrolled airspace, does anybody care?
 
Piloto said:
Hey!! What's the big deal about not having a pilot's certificate? After all Wilbur Wright never got his.:rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Wilbur Wright also crashed and totalled the first two seat airplane due to lack of familiarity with the controls... So he's maybe not the best example. :wink2:
 
Years ago I had a friend that lost his drivers license for too many speeding tickets. He continued to drive, unlicensed, for at least five years with out without incendent. Knowing there was no room for error, he stayed below the radar (literally). He was probably a safer driver without a license, for what it's worth :)
 
coach said:
Years ago I had a friend that lost his drivers license for too many speeding tickets. He continued to drive, unlicensed, for at least five years with out without incendent. Knowing there was no room for error, he stayed below the radar (literally). He was probably a safer driver without a license, for what it's worth :)
Click to expand...

Sadly, your friend is not in the majority, when it comes to the safety of those who drive without a license.
 
Send anonymous letter to FSDO
There, you have done your duty
Don't expect much to happen - in fact don't expect anything to happen
 
\__[Ô]__/;995864 said:
Wilbur Wright also crashed and totalled the first two seat airplane due to lack of familiarity with the controls... So he's maybe not the best example. :wink2:
Click to expand...

That's because he could not find a CFI to teach him how to fly his contraption.:dunno:

José
 
Meat cleaver applied and thread reopened.

All y'all wanna talk politics and the reach of Government - take that stuff over to Spin Zone and start a new thread. Y'all wanna bash each other? Go do it on another board, not here. Personal attacks and name-calling are not acceptable here. Talk about the topic, not the poster.
 
coach said:
Years ago I had a friend that lost his drivers license for too many speeding tickets. He continued to drive, unlicensed, for at least five years with out without incendent. Knowing there was no room for error, he stayed below the radar (literally). He was probably a safer driver without a license, for what it's worth :)
Click to expand...

Did he drive to the DMV to get his license back when the court allowed him?

I had a friend who could legally drive in the US with his licence from France, but he wanted to get an NC driver's license anyway. He drove to the DMV, failed the test, and legally drove himself home :goofy:
 
dell30rb said:
Did he drive to the DMV to get his license back when the court allowed him?

I had a friend who could legally drive in the US with his licence from France, but he wanted to get an NC driver's license anyway. He drove to the DMV, failed the test, and legally drove himself home :goofy:
Click to expand...

I've toyed with the idea of getting a foreign driver's license. It can't really be "taken away." The worst that could happen is a State level court order barring you from driving a vehicle on public streets. Big deal, move to another State.

I view driving differently than I view flying though. I don't consider driving a privilege. I consider it a right. However, just like any other right, it isn't absolute and it can be taken away for due cause.
 
\__[Ô]__/;995864 said:
Wilbur Wright also crashed and totalled the first two seat airplane due to lack of familiarity with the controls... So he's maybe not the best example. :wink2:
Click to expand...


His photo is on the back of our certificate.
 
denverpilot said:
ROFLMAO... so true, so true.

[Edit... added...]

I suggest we replace the Wrights with Bob Hoover.
Click to expand...

There you go. Was Bob Hoover an unsafe pilot while his certificate was suspended? If you saw him practicing touch and goes with a passenger while his ticket was pulled should he be reported?
 
Do you know the correct spelling of his middle name ?

Not showing up in the public database can have a number of reasons, one of them are first/middle name inversions or putting a 'state' in the search matrix if the pilot happens to have no state associated with his certificate.
 
Sac Arrow said:
I view driving differently than I view flying though. I don't consider driving a privilege. I consider it a right. However, just like any other right, it isn't absolute and it can be taken away for due cause.
Click to expand...

That's how I feel about flying. I say that if you meet the regulatory and statutory requirements, pass the relevant tests, and haven't done something so egregious as to warrant revocation, then you should have a right to a pilot certificate.
 
Sac Arrow said:
That said, if someone wants to fly themselves over remote parts of Alaska or Montana, I could give a rat's ass whether they are certificated or not. Whether or not I feel obliged to get in the middle of a situation similar to the OP's is dependent on the circumstances. I think I would lean toward the Dr. Bruce approach, if so.
Click to expand...

Uhhh, Okay. If any of you ever visit Jeanie you might be inclined to say that where she flies is about as remote as any place in Montana. I have flown with her in West Texas and am not comfortable at all knowing that an un-certificated pilot was lurking around up there. Arrow- I am not trying to call you out but do you have any inclination to fly the back country of Alaska one day? If you ever make it up there I wonder if you will be thinking about the yahoos flying without a certificate. I am not going to pass judgement on someone who does or does not report a situation like this but I am not going to condone the attitude of those of you who have no problem with this kind of flying.
 
Aside from the FAA, another authority would the the airport where the plane is kept. The airport could banish the plane.

However, I'm guessing the plane is not kept at the Alpine airport -- it only took me a couple of minutes with two websites, city-data.com and registry.faa.gov, to find all the 150s and 152s that are registered with an Alpine address, and then verify that their owners do indeed have certificates and valid medicals.
 
What if....

The airstrip were on a very large ranch in Texas, that the pilot flew around and over the ranch but never left it's lateral boundaries?

:stirpot:
 
wsuffa said:
What if....

The airstrip were on a very large ranch in Texas, that the pilot flew around and over the ranch but never left it's lateral boundaries?

:stirpot:
Click to expand...

In the flight levels while playing the sound track to top gun over the local approach frequency? :goofy:
 
Last edited:
Tex_Mike said:
Uhhh, Okay. If any of you ever visit Jeanie you might be inclined to say that where she flies is about as remote as any place in Montana. I have flown with her in West Texas and am not comfortable at all knowing that an un-certificated pilot was lurking around up there. Arrow- I am not trying to call you out but do you have any inclination to fly the back country of Alaska one day? If you ever make it up there I wonder if you will be thinking about the yahoos flying without a certificate. I am not going to pass judgement on someone who does or does not report a situation like this but I am not going to condone the attitude of those of you who have no problem with this kind of flying.
Click to expand...

I'm not comfortable with a LOT of dangers that might be lurking around in any give flying scenario, such as ice, thunderstorms, mechanical failure, etc.... and being taken out in the air by an uncertificated pilot rates WAY DOWN on the list of probable hazards.

Yes I do have a problem with pilots flying without their required certification! How much of a problem? Not enough to get in their grill over it if they are otherwise safe pilots. Your personal tolerance level is obviously lower. Fair enough. Again, for me it comes down to a judgment call.
 
ClimbnSink said:
There you go. Was Bob Hoover an unsafe pilot while his certificate was suspended? If you saw him practicing touch and goes with a passenger while his ticket was pulled should he be reported?
Click to expand...

Why are my replies to this post getting deleted, yet not this post?

They are identical in content, and only differ in point of view.
 
NoHeat said:
However, I'm guessing the plane is not kept at the Alpine airport -- it only took me a couple of minutes with two websites, city-data.com and registry.faa.gov, to find all the 150s and 152s that are registered with an Alpine address, and then verify that their owners do indeed have certificates and valid medicals.
Click to expand...


And you missed every plane that was registered under an LLC with a different address. I'll give you a hint ... they're not all based in Delaware.
 
Palmpilot said:
That's how I feel about flying. I say that if you meet the regulatory and statutory requirements, pass the relevant tests, and haven't done something so egregious as to warrant revocation, then you should have a right to a pilot certificate.
Click to expand...
That is more or less how the relevant regulation (14 CFR 61.13(a)(3)) reads -- meet all the requirements, pass all the tests, and the Administrator must issue...



...except when s/he doesn't want to. See 61.13(a)(2)(ii). However, the only time I've heard of invocation of that clause being threatened was in the case of the Smoketown Bandit, Hayden J. (Jim) Sheaffer, when his attorney asked the FAA about applying for a new certificate a year after his revocation.
 
Last edited:
wsuffa said:
What if....

The airstrip were on a very large ranch in Texas, that the pilot flew around and over the ranch but never left it's lateral boundaries?

:stirpot:
Click to expand...
That would not change the situation as far as the FAA and its regulations are concerned. There is no "private airspace" where the FAR's do not apply.
 
Ron Levy said:
That would not change the situation as far as the FAA and its regulations are concerned. There is no "private airspace" where the FAR's do not apply.
Click to expand...
The airstrip was were on in a very large ranch warehouse in Texas, that the pilot flew around and over inside the ranch warehouse but never left it's lateral boundaries?
 
FlyerQ said:
The airstrip was were on in a very large ranch warehouse in Texas, that the pilot flew around and over inside the ranch warehouse but never left it's lateral boundaries?
Click to expand...

I think the air inside a building is yours. You can do whatever you want in it.
 
FlyerQ said:
The airstrip was were on in a very large ranch warehouse in Texas, that the pilot flew around and over inside the ranch warehouse but never left it's lateral boundaries?
Click to expand...
I think that the FAA would find plenty of ways to hang the pilot involved, and the NTSB and courts would support the FAA.
 
That's interesting. Talk about anti-authority. Something my instructor said long ago when I was still training with him just popped up in my head, "anybody can fly the airplane. That's not what makes a good pilot."
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top