Options for a cracked case...?

fiveoboy01

fiveoboy01

Pattern Altitude
Joined
Apr 21, 2013
Messages
2,321
Location
Madison, WI
Display Name
Display name:
Dirty B
I found my case cracked today. 1-1.5" crack in the front left side, oil is leaking from it.

What are my options? Or are there any?

0360 A4M, 850ish SMOH and a little over 6000TT I think, need to check the logs.

Pretty frustrating. Just bought this thing and I'm ready for the IR checkride right now. Also wondering if it's something I might have done to cause it:(
 
There is nothing you could have done to cause the crack. It happens. You can have the case exchanged for an overhauled one from Divco. If you case has been reworked 2 or more times or is cracked near an oil gallery it will not repair so you would have to pay the outright cost. You may be able to determine how many times it has been reworked by looking for the repair order numbers on the backbone of the engine. One set is probably OK two sets makes it marginal to repair. If it were here the entry price assuming nothing else wrong and a repairable case including the minimum parts is around $7,500 plus removal and installation and freight. Please feel free to PM me at zephyrengn@aol.com for further information. Charlie Melot Zephyr Engines 813-788-3305
 
This is what I first saw on Sunday. Wiped it off and flew for 3 hours. There was about 1/3 of that when I landed, not knowing where it was coming from I wiped it off again. Changed oil this morning and after running it, it became apparent that I had a crack. You can see where the crack is and the oil has ran down and spread from there...
 

Attachments

  • image.jpeg
    image.jpeg
    896.5 KB · Views: 230
Divco may be able to repair the crack. I did one about a year ago that was cracked in the same area I believe you're describing.

Another place to check with might be Crankcase Services Inc.
 
You dont have to be married to that engine. If funds are tight, shop for a used engine
 
I can buy a reman if I need to. I'm just not sure which route to go. The current engine starts and runs like a clock...makes good power, burns little oil. And now it gets to sit. Both of the flight school's Archers are down with - cracked engine cases. So the IFR checkride might not happen for a while and that's probably the most frustrating thing at the moment:)

I guess I'll start making phone calls tomorrow.
 
Last edited:
Looks to bbe repairable. Call and send pic to Divco. Check for overhaul repair numbers on top per my previous post. Divco numbers start with WDC. CSI starts with CSI. Charlie Melot Zephyr Engines
 
Repairable, maybe, but only after the engine is torn down. New lower end bearings will be necessary and likely the case should be milled and align bored. With that you'll look at the crank and wonder if that may as well get machined and re-plated. Cam and lifters? Cylinders? Do you do a tear-down and repair to re-assemble using your last overhaul's time or do you step up and do a full overhaul now? Decisions, decisions.

Divco has been excellent for me. Crankcase Services? Not even close. But that's just me talking.
 
Stewartb said:
Repairable, maybe, but only after the engine is torn down. New lower end bearings will be necessary and likely the case should be milled and align bored. With that you'll look at the crank and wonder if that may as well get machined and re-plated. Cam and lifters? Cylinders? Do you do a tear-down and repair to re-assemble using your last overhaul's time or do you step up and do a full overhaul now? Decisions, decisions.

Divco has been excellent for me. Crankcase Services? Not even close. But that's just me talking.
Click to expand...
Exactly, which leads me back to waiting for this years snowfall-collapsed hangar roofs and the resulting good used engines for sale
 
Looking at the logbooks, the engine was majored in 2006, case went to divco at that time. 86 hours later there was an oil leak, "defective case spine", case again went to Divco for rework.

No odea about anything else, it appears that this engine at some point was pulled from another airplane and put into mine somewhere along the line.

I thought maybe I'd put a factory new engine in until I looked at the price.
 
the case is a casting....and they do get manufactured with internal defects (inclusions - porosity) over time stress will cause the porosity to form into a crack and this is what happens. Without an ultrasound or X-ray inspection there is no way to inspect for these defects.

You could get the crack repaired...if the engine is low time.....or just go for an OH.

In any option it does require the engine to be torn down and the crank case sent out to Divco or alike for work.
 
Last edited:
fiveoboy01 said:
I found my case cracked today. 1-1.5" crack in the front left side, oil is leaking from it.

What are my options? Or are there any?

0360 A4M, 850ish SMOH and a little over 6000TT I think, need to check the logs.

Pretty frustrating. Just bought this thing and I'm ready for the IR checkride right now. Also wondering if it's something I might have done to cause it:(
Click to expand...


How long ago ???

How long since the last annual?


That crack didn't just open up in the last few flying hours...:no::no::no:
 
I picked it up June 2.

I've flown it 96 hours since then, prior annual was February.

If the crack was there, it didn't leak oil until 3-4 hours ago.
 
I think what 801BH is implying that someone sold you an airplane with a known cracked crankcase. I have no idea how you could prove it. If I'm wrong he'll correct me.


Every time someone asks me about buying an airplane I tell them flat out its a gamble. Even some of the nicest and best maintained can have a pitfall that has yet to be found. It kinda sucks but its not much different that trying to buy old cars, old houses, old tractors etc.
 
bnt83 said:
I think what 801BH is implying that someone sold you an airplane with a known cracked crankcase. I have no idea how you could prove it. If I'm wrong he'll correct me.


Every time someone asks me about buying an airplane I tell them flat out its a gamble. Even some of the nicest and best maintained can have a pitfall that has yet to be found. It kinda sucks but its not much different that trying to buy old cars, old houses, old tractors etc.
Click to expand...
I doubt that.....else it woulda been leaking oil. :yes:
 
bnt83 said:
I think what 801BH is implying that someone sold you an airplane with a known cracked crankcase. I have no idea how you could prove it. If I'm wrong he'll correct me.


Every time someone asks me about buying an airplane I tell them flat out its a gamble. Even some of the nicest and best maintained can have a pitfall that has yet to be found. It kinda sucks but its not much different that trying to buy old cars, old houses, old tractors etc.
Click to expand...

A cracked case thread turns in to a detective investigation.

How ironic is that.
 
I'm not sure how anyone could know the crankcase was cracked, it's been flown 100 hours with no leaks and this just appeared. Even if I did suspect that, which I don't, it couldn't be proven. My opinion is that **** happens and it just happened to me this time.
 
fiveoboy01 said:
I'm not sure how anyone could know the crankcase was cracked, it's been flown 100 hours with no leaks and this just appeared. Even if I did suspect that, which I don't, it couldn't be proven. My opinion is that **** happens and it just happened to me this time.
Click to expand...

That's the best way to look at it. With the history known on that case I'd be hesitant to spend any money to save it. :redface: (Or you can get it repaired and sell it)
 
N801BH said:
That crack didn't just open up in the last few flying hours...:no::no::no:
Click to expand...

Yes it did..

It may have been working outward for some time, but it broke the surface recently.

With the history of this engine, I'd dump it for a remanufactured or new.
 
fiveoboy01 said:
Looking at the logbooks, the engine was majored in 2006, case went to divco at that time. 86 hours later there was an oil leak, "defective case spine", case again went to Divco for rework.

No odea about anything else, it appears that this engine at some point was pulled from another airplane and put into mine somewhere along the line.

I thought maybe I'd put a factory new engine in until I looked at the price.
Click to expand...

Call Divco with the WDC number from the case repair and they ought to be able to pull the paperwork and get a better handle on repairability.

Charlie Melot
 
It's low enough time and runs good. Get an exchange case and reassemble. It's not a big deal and happens all the time. Anything more is just wasting money.
 
I think that's what I'm going to do. I called Divco, they can't give me history on the case as it was reworked 10 years ago. He said an outright case is $3K, but that an inch crack in that location is really nothing and a simple repair. The engine makes good compression, no need for cylinders at this time. If it needs a few small things whilst apart fine, but it should be significantly less expensive than a full overhaul or reman.
 
fiveoboy01 said:
I think that's what I'm going to do. I called Divco, they can't give me history on the case as it was reworked 10 years ago. He said an outright case is $3K, but that an inch crack in that location is really nothing and a simple repair. The engine makes good compression, no need for cylinders at this time. If it needs a few small things whilst apart fine, but it should be significantly less expensive than a full overhaul or reman.
Click to expand...
great, but before you write off the idea of an overhaul, get the list of mandatory replacement items and talk it over with your A&P. It might not cost that much more to be able to list 0 SMOH in your logbook for resale considerations
 
charlie said:
There is nothing you could have done to cause the crack. It happens. You can have the case exchanged for an overhauled one from Divco. If you case has been reworked 2 or more times or is cracked near an oil gallery it will not repair so you would have to pay the outright cost. You may be able to determine how many times it has been reworked by looking for the repair order numbers on the backbone of the engine. One set is probably OK two sets makes it marginal to repair. If it were here the entry price assuming nothing else wrong and a repairable case including the minimum parts is around $7,500 plus removal and installation and freight. Please feel free to PM me at zephyrengn@aol.com for further information. Charlie Melot Zephyr Engines 813-788-3305
Click to expand...

Yes, it's time to call charlie and do as he suggests.
 
fiveoboy01 said:
I'm not sure how anyone could know the crankcase was cracked, it's been flown 100 hours with no leaks and this just appeared. Even if I did suspect that, which I don't, it couldn't be proven. My opinion is that **** happens and it just happened to me this time.
Click to expand...

Stay FAR away from Las Vegas.....:yes:.....:rolleyes:
 
If it does not effect how the engine operates why not clean and sand that spot and put some JB weld on the crack?
 
pigpenracing said:
If it does not effect how the engine operates why not clean and sand that spot and put some JB weld on the crack?
Click to expand...

Interestingly, an AD for case cracking does allow stop-drilling, measuring & monitoring on the small subset of a/c engines to which it applies, and only for soecific locations ("non-critical areas"). So not all case cracks are a death sentence for every engine.
 
tyndall said:
It's low enough time and runs good. Get an exchange case and reassemble. It's not a big deal and happens all the time. Anything more is just wasting money.
Click to expand...

It is not low time. OP said 850 SMOH, 6000'ish TT. If the engine has 6000TT, it may be time for a new case, new bearings, OH or replace the rest of the internals, keep and OH the 850 hr cylinders, and reassemble.

Charlie can weigh in on whether that would constitute a major OH.
 
Rcmutz said:
It is not low time. OP said 850 SMOH, 6000'ish TT. If the engine has 6000TT, it may be time for a new case, new bearings, OH or replace the rest of the internals, keep and OH the 850 hr cylinders, and reassemble.
Click to expand...

It's not low time. It's low enough time not to warrant a full OH. 850 hours ago it was inspected and whatever was bad was replaced. What is there to OH? No reason to pull the rods off the crank and incur the cost of mandatory conrod bearing and bolt replacement. No need to rip apart the accessory case. Replace crankcase, replace main bearings, check cam while you're in there and reassemble.

It's only a case crack, no need to make a big deal about it or freak because of the total time. I've built engines with over 15k hours that I'll OH again at 17k. By then there are not to many original parts, but the TT boogeyman still scares the noobs.
 
tyndall said:
It's not low time. It's low enough time not to warrant a full OH. 850 hours ago it was inspected and whatever was bad was replaced. What is there to OH? No reason to pull the rods off the crank and incur the cost of mandatory conrod bearing and bolt replacement. No need to rip apart the accessory case. Replace crankcase, replace main bearings, check cam while you're in there and reassemble.

It's only a case crack, no need to make a big deal about it or freak because of the total time. I've built engines with over 15k hours that I'll OH again at 17k. By then there are not to many original parts, but the TT boogeyman still scares the noobs.
Click to expand...
I disagree. If you're going to split the case then the incremental to write it up as a major OH isn't that much.
 
6000 TT says to me unless the crank was replaced before, its probably junk too.

Buying a case and crank outright is not exactly economical.
 
If you replace, look at the Superior cases. They claim to have analyzed hundreds of cracked Lycoming cases and engineered theirs to fix the weaknesses in the Lyc designs. That might be marketing hype, but it was enough for me to gamble on it when I rebuilt my old Mooney's engine and found new cracks in the original case that had been repaired multiple times. Last I heard it's still running strong for the new owners.
 
Rcmutz said:
Charlie can weigh in on whether that would constitute a major OH.
Click to expand...

Let's pretend that you do send it to Charley.

We all know you'll get back an engine that meets "RE-built" standards. at his up front prices.

But I'll bet there won't be many of the parts that you send him that make the return trip.

Simply remember, FAR 43.2, and the engine is what the log book entry says it is.

This engine was disassembled and the following parts replaced is a repair. ETT continues

The engine installed at this time was overhauled to ____ standards ... is an overhaul. ETT continues.

The engine installed at this time was a factory re-built = new log book and 0 time.

Removed engine Serial number ____ and installed new engine serial number ____ = a new engine. TT 0
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top