New Garmin portable GPS Aera 660 announced

Cool, I still think there is a place. I have had my iPad overheat in the cockpit, though I do love ForeFlight
 
paying for updates doesn't thrill me when I get GP updates regularly included in the yearly fee.
 
Not for that price, you're competing with iPads running foreflight, that price point is right at a iPad level, paying for updates too?

So buy that aviation only garmin and pay for their updates, or get a iPad with foreflight where I can also use it for office stuff, Internet, watching movies during bad wx, etc.

Think they are about $600 over where their price point needs to be and should rethink charging for updates.

Perhaps some folks in countries where foreflight doesn't work might buy it?
 
It is only price competitive if you compare it with their old Aera 796 and 696 (still for sale). Those things are about $1000 more, and have more expensive updates if you include real charts. So the question is how much is a aviation grade, purpose built, high brightness GPS that probably won't overheat, worth. I would be surprised if it has any more functionality than Garmin Pilot.
 
There must be a market out there,Garmin doesn't come out with new products unless they know they can sell it. Paying for updates ,just shows us that Garmin wants all your money.
 
So, here's a question. This thing interfaces with the new GTX 345 transponder, which gives it a WAAS position source. The GTX is obviously panel mounted, with an external GPS antenna and the whole shebang. With the GTX 345 and this new Aera 660, would it legally be possible to file /G? I know the answer right now is no, but why not? The position source is both WAAS and panel mounted. How would this be a whole lot different than using, say, a KLN-94 mated to a KMD-550 MFD display? The obvious difference is that the display is also panel mounted, but should that matter?

For that matter, does the new GTX 345 output an ARINC? Could you use it to drive position to, say, a GMX 200?

We are certainly seeing some great new products coming out because of ADS-B. I think it will be interesting to watch as some of these questions get answered officially.
 
Steve Job said:
It is only price competitive if you compare it with their old Aera 796 and 696 (still for sale). Those things are about $1000 more, and have more expensive updates if you include real charts. So the question is how much is a aviation grade, purpose built, high brightness GPS that probably won't overheat, worth. I would be surprised if it has any more functionality than Garmin Pilot.
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antidotal I know, my iPad mini rentina GSM has never overheated or had a issue with lack of brightness.
 
Nope. Ipad and Stratus does the same thing(and MUCH more) for not a lot more money. I'm already getting screwed annually by Garmin's navdata update on my 430W, one of their devices is enough for me.
 
I don't think you are getting screwed by Garmin on a regular basis, Jepp provides the nav data and Garmin the terrain which most people don't update very often. Keep your amours straight. But I agree we are being screwed nonetheless.
 
Me thinks they are taking aim at Ifly's 740...basically the same form and function and a close price point. Iflys updates are much cheaper though.
I just got my 740 today (but have had the 30 day free app on my phone for a while) and when they say sunlight readable they ain't kiddin'.
Chris
 
ettsn said:
So, here's a question. This thing interfaces with the new GTX 345 transponder, which gives it a WAAS position source. The GTX is obviously panel mounted, with an external GPS antenna and the whole shebang. With the GTX 345 and this new Aera 660, would it legally be possible to file /G? I know the answer right now is no, but why not? The position source is both WAAS and panel mounted. How would this be a whole lot different than using, say, a KLN-94 mated to a KMD-550 MFD display? The obvious difference is that the display is also panel mounted, but should that matter?
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The GPS has to have RAIM, which I don't think the GTX 345 has. I could be wrong...won't be the first time.

Gene
 
Hand held hiking GPS have had WAAS since 2000 or before. The real question is what is the underlying operating system. I would guess android. So they are taking a generic android tablet $100 and loading their program on it for those too lazy to do it themselves. The Samsung tablets are reported to have WAAS GPS chip sets. If you look closely the Area line looks like the Panasonic tough pad line.
 
drgwentzel said:
The GPS has to have RAIM, which I don't think the GTX 345 has. I could be wrong...won't be the first time.

Gene
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I can't answer the question, but I have an idea where I'd look first if I had a lot of time. The way I watched things unfold in the day job; standards, specs and data format for GPS systems used to navigate an aircraft were not the same standards, specs and data format sent to the transponder to allow ATC position tracking. Entirely different task, entirely different requirements.

Pilots flying very old aircraft after Jan 1, 2020, might not know their position as accurately as ATC does if the operator elects to forgo expensive GPS/FMC upgrades and just go with minimal ADS-B out equipment.

When I was looking closely at ADS-B out standards, there are provisions in the Mode S squitter format that tell ATC the accuracy of the position data coming from the transponder. We used to talk about NIC, NAC and SIL as the applicable figures of merit. I never looked as close at the UAT specs formats, so I really have little idea what’s in them.

As an aside, the FARs point to FAA TSOs to define what the equipment should basically do. The TSOs point to RTCA specs that are the horrendously complicated documents (probably at least 4,000 pages worth of techno babble goodness) that describe the technical details of the data link format. NIC, NAC and SIL were at one time spelled out in the FARs and they are additional performance requirements related to for probability the aircraft will actually be in a space of such a size and system availability (as detected and reported by the aircraft).

When it comes to the standards for a GPS/FMC-XPDR integrations device for navigation and to guide a crew through an approach, those were entirely different set of standards and requirements that I probably have never looked at. Bottom line, different task, different requirements, and different specs.

No doubt the GPS/FMC/XPDR interface in aircraft systems will eventually support both.
 
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> " . . .or had a issue with lack of brightness."

Well I sure have. I can't see anything on an iPad or any other "pad" unless I'm in the shade. I've got a canopy and a small cockpit. This new Garmin is just the perfect size at six inches diagonally and finally . . . something I can see when the sun is out. Looks like annual updates for everything (VFR/IFR) within CONUS is $149. I could be off a little on that . . . . Using the Garmin terminal procedures and nav charts (as opposed to their optional Jeppesen materials), the nav data and charts don't disappear after expiration date. One time yearly updates available as well.

Comes with a worldwide database. So far it only connects to some panel mounted Garmin boxes and the GD-39 series for ADS-B and AHARS. Give the Stratux guys some time and that might change. I really like the looks of it so far and find the price, for Garmin, amazing.
 
FWIW an anti-glare screen protector on the ipad does wonders.

I do agree, however, that the brightness leaves a little bit to be desired.
 
The aera 660 would be a lot more interesting if it had an integrated ads-b receiver.
 
I live in Arizona and I've flown in the dead heat of summer...never had my iPad mini 4 overheat or had issues with brightness...
 
Steve Job said:
For anyone interested, there's a long thread (with lots of feedback from Garmin) over here. Who knew it was IFR certified? (Just kidding)

http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=135203
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Someone over there posed a really good question. Will the Garmin 660 subscription also cover Garmin Pilot since it's the same data. Makes sense. You can use the iPad as a back up or as a second screen.

Answer. No.

Something like this might move me off the fence since the subscription isn't that much more than the new Foreflight.
 
I have been using FlyQ and Flight Plan go on my Ipad and Iphone with a Stratux ADSB-in receiver. I also have a Lowrance 2000c with outdated data base. The Lowrance has great sunlight readability and I wish I could get updates for the Lowrance but I cant so I use the Fly Q or Flight Plan go apps for updated data. I recently flew up to Oshkosh Airventure 2016 using the Lowrance for navigation cross checking it with the Ipad. It was a very sunny day and the Ipad was hard to read in direct sunlight with the anti glare screen guard installed, The Lowrance was bright and easy to see in the same sunlight. While at a gas stop I left the Ipad on the seat of my Cardinal, when I returned it had overheated shut down and was not usable. I continued on using my Iphone and Lowrance until the Ipad came back to life about 30 minutes later. At Airventure I broke down and purchased the Garmin 660 and used it to to fly home with. I was able to toss the Lowarance and the Ipad in the back seat of the Cardinal, I can report that the Garmim is very bright and detailed. The main difference between the Garmin and the Ipad FlyQ and Flightplan Go apps is that the Garmin has both maps and charts. Charts being the traditional sectional when selected with North up all printing on the map is readable, but when track up is selected and your heading south the sectional is upside down and hard to read. In map mode, the Garmin maps printing is always readable and not upside down regardless of direction of travel. Flight Plan Go is a great Ipad app and is free with free data base updates. FlyQ I purchased on black monday and got the two years for one year updates for $139.00. I will continue to use the Iphone and stratux for ADSB weather it works good. My flight back to central Texas was 10 hours, the little Garmin automatically logged the flight hours including the night flight hours. At night flying over Austin the Garmin had auto dimmed itself and was very easy to read. My lowrance was always a little to bright at night. My gripe with Garmin is that they do not want to play with others, I would love to be able to hook my Stratux up to the 660IMG_4428.PNG
 
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I "almost" purchased one during Oshkosh as well. I already have a GDL39-3D, which works well with Garmin Pilot, Foreflight (finally), and my old Aera 510. But the 510 isn't very bright, doesn't have charts, and my subscription recently expired. Rather than spend another $150 to update it, the idea of an aviation grade BRIGHT backup device is very appealing. But I really wish Garmin would allow us to combine the Pilot and 660 subscriptions for less than $300!
 
c177tx said:
I have been using FlyQ and Flight Plan go on my Ipad and Iphone with a Stratux ADSB-in receiver. I also have a Lowrance 2000c with outdated data base. The Lowrance has great sunlight readability and I wish I could get updates for the Lowrance but I cant so I use the Fly Q or Flight Plan go apps for updated data. I recently flew up to Oshkosh Airventure 2016 using the Lowrance for navigation cross checking it with the Ipad. It was a very sunny day and the Ipad was hard to read in direct sunlight with the anti glare screen guard installed, The Lowrance was bright and easy to see in the same sunlight. While at a gas stop I left the Ipad on the seat of my Cardinal, when I returned it had overheated shut down and was not usable. I continued on using my Iphone and Lowrance until the Ipad came back to life about 30 minutes later. At Airventure I broke down and purchased the Garmin 660 and used it to to fly home with. I was able to toss the Lowarance and the Ipad in the back seat of the Cardinal, I can report that the Garmim is very bright and detailed. The main difference between the Garmin and the Ipad FlyQ and Flightplan Go apps is that the Garmin has both maps and charts. Charts being the traditional sectional when selected with North up all printing on the map is readable, but when track up is selected and your heading south the sectional is upside down and hard to read. In map mode, the Garmin maps printing is always readable and not upside down regardless of direction of travel. Flight Plan Go is a great Ipad app and is free with free data base updates. FlyQ I purchased on black monday and got the two years for one year updates for $139.00. I will continue to use the Iphone and stratux for ADSB weather it works good. My flight back to central Texas was 10 hours, the little Garmin automatically logged the flight hours including the night flight hours. At night flying over Austin the Garmin had auto dimmed itself and was very easy to read. My lowrance was always a little to bright at night. My gripe with Garmin is that they do not want to play with others, I would love to be able to hook my Stratux up to the 660View attachment 46829
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You're literally over the top of where my family used to farm for generations in that picture.. No seriously, literally....
 
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