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Mtns2Skies

Final Approach
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Mtns2Skies
Hey guys, I was wondering where I could find something to listen into the plane's intercom for filming purposes. Considering i'll mostly be flying C-152's it can't take up the plug for the headset. If it has to, I'd also need an adapter to make an extra space for a headset. Thanks!
Austin
 
HawkEye007 said:
Hey guys, I was wondering where I could find something to listen into the plane's intercom for filming purposes. Considering i'll mostly be flying C-152's it can't take up the plug for the headset. If it has to, I'd also need an adapter to make an extra space for a headset. Thanks!
Austin
Click to expand...

You probably already have all you need.

Just put an ipod-style earbud under your headset cup. Plug the other end into the Mic-In on your camera. Done deal! the "speaker" portion of the headphone acts like the tranducer on a microphone, and you get amazing audio quality. Try it out at home, first.

I learned the trick from Kent (FlyingCheesehead) on this board. Here's one we filmed that way (the 'wavery' tone is from the audio encoder used to make the Vimeo video--the original copy is crystal clear and good tone):

http://www.vimeo.com/1484051
 
I purchased a ten foot long 1/4" mono to 1/8" stereo from B&H this past winter to record the audio from a headset jack direct to my video cameras. Cost was about $8.00.
 
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TangoWhiskey said:
Just put an ipod-style earbud under your headset cup. Plug the other end into the Mic-In on your camera. Done deal! the "speaker" portion of the headphone acts like the tranducer on a microphone, and you get amazing audio quality. Try it out at home, first.
Click to expand...

Austin,

Do this before you do anything else. You probably already have everything you need to do it with, so it's free to try and if you don't like it you can go buy gadgets and gizmos, but I've found it works GREAT. You get exactly what you hear when you're flying the plane - Intercom audio plus just a little engine noise in the background. Makes it sound "real". All the fancy setups get intercom audio ONLY and a whole crapload of completely dead space. Yuck!

Low tech sometimes does work best. :yes:
 
Thanks so much for all of your suggestions! This is the camera I have currently (It was an 8th grade graduation present) http://www.vio-pov.com/products/pov_15.php
There is a small microphone about a foot down the wire, I'm going to put that in the earcup for today's flight, But it is rather uncomfortable so I'll look into those suggestions. Thank you!
 
I bought a digital voice recorder (not too expensive, around $60), a Y-splitter and a 1/4 to 1/8 cable so I could record the audio of lessons I give. This way I could play back any areas where there were questions or confusing radio calls.
I was surprised by the crappy quality of the recording. The external mic works fine (not in an airplane, obviously). The intercom is fine. We can hear on our heasets with no problems.

I tried the Hi and Lo mic settings & the various quality levels (ranging anywhere from 30 hours of record time to 229 hours. The 229 setting was completely unusable.

Anyone else get this type of setup to work?
 
Impedance mismatch?
Line v microphone input?
Audio in is too high, distorting the playback?
Sounds like you might need a mixer to control the recorder input.
 
I hadn't thought about a line-level issue. The cord I got (from Radio Shack) was just a 1/4 to 1/8 stereo cord. What makes the other cord "attenuating"?

For the iPod earbud idea, would I need to put both buds under the headset? If I didn't & left one loose, would it pick up cockpit noise? The less cords runing all over me, the better... :)

Thanks!
 
crash7 said:
For the iPod earbud idea, would I need to put both buds under the headset? If I didn't & left one loose, would it pick up cockpit noise? The less cords runing all over me, the better... :)
Click to expand...

Depends. On some mono setups you could get away with only the left earbud, but I just put one in each ear cup - I'd rather do that than have one loose and flopping around!
 
crash7 said:
For the iPod earbud idea, would I need to put both buds under the headset? If I didn't & left one loose, would it pick up cockpit noise? The less cords runing all over me, the better...
Click to expand...

I think you would want to stick a microphone under your headseat...
 
smigaldi said:
Kent is referring to using the earbud as a microphone. Dynamic speakers and microphones work the same way. The only difference is where you plug them in on the device. What he has said will work adequately.
Click to expand...

I guess you learn something every day.
 
crash7 said:
What makes the other cord "attenuating"?
Click to expand...

Basically the addition of electronic components to match (relatively) the impedance between the intercom and the audio recording device.

I haven't actually split one open to find out the specifics, though. :)
 
crash7 said:
I hadn't thought about a line-level issue. The cord I got (from Radio Shack) was just a 1/4 to 1/8 stereo cord. What makes the other cord "attenuating"?

For the iPod earbud idea, would I need to put both buds under the headset? If I didn't & left one loose, would it pick up cockpit noise? The less cords runing all over me, the better... :)

Thanks!
Click to expand...


Unless the recorder has a stereo (two channel) mic input, only one of the earbuds (probably the left one) is going to
pick up anything.
 
TknoFlyer said:
Basically the addition of electronic components to match (relatively) the impedance between the intercom and the audio recording device.

I haven't actually split one open to find out the specifics, though. :)
Click to expand...

The "attenuator" doesn't match impedances, it reduces the voltage from the input to the output, typically using a pair of resistors (per channel) wired as a voltage divider. Impedance is rarely an issue because the mic input on the recorder usually has a relatively high impedance (much higher than the mic). At audio frequencies impedance matching is only useful if the you need maximum efficiency. If the mic has built in amplification (most do) it doesn't matter at all. Matched impedance between source and sink results in maximum power transfer with half the source power delivered to the load. At higher frequencies matching impedances eliminates reflections and standing waves but at audio frequencies the wiring would have to be dozens of miles long for that to be an issue.
 
gismo said:
The "attenuator" doesn't match impedances, it reduces the voltage from the input to the output, typically using a pair of resistors (per channel) wired as a voltage divider.
Click to expand...

Well, there ya go. That's what I get for not staying at a Holiday Inn Express. :)
 
My wife just got a new iTouch (whole 'nother discussion there...). I stole the ear buds that came with it & tried using those as mics last night. It worked!
The first lesson was rather faint. Must have been the way the buds were laying in the headset's earcup. No extra noise, though & I could clearly hear everyone. Seconds lesson was louder. Buds must have fallen into place better.

Something I didn't try was the ANR on my headset (batteries were dead yesterday). I'm wondering if activating the ANR will mess with the recording in any way.
 
crash7 said:
My wife just got a new iTouch (whole 'nother discussion there...). I stole the ear buds that came with it & tried using those as mics last night. It worked!
The first lesson was rather faint. Must have been the way the buds were laying in the headset's earcup. No extra noise, though & I could clearly hear everyone. Seconds lesson was louder. Buds must have fallen into place better.

Something I didn't try was the ANR on my headset (batteries were dead yesterday). I'm wondering if activating the ANR will mess with the recording in any way.
Click to expand...

I suspect that recording in the ear cups with ANR on would depend greatly on where the ear buds end up. All ANR headsets have a microphone inside the earcup that picks up the noise to be cancelled. If your recording pickup is near that, you'll probably get a lot more noise and less of the desired signal but since ANR only works up to 250-300 Hz it might not matter all that much. From what I've seen, the ANR mics are usually near the top half of the ear cup so putting your earbuds down low might help and that's where they probably want to migrate to anyway.
 
gismo said:
I suspect that recording in the ear cups with ANR on would depend greatly on where the ear buds end up. All ANR headsets have a microphone inside the earcup that picks up the noise to be cancelled. If your recording pickup is near that, you'll probably get a lot more noise and less of the desired signal but since ANR only works up to 250-300 Hz it might not matter all that much. From what I've seen, the ANR mics are usually near the top half of the ear cup so putting your earbuds down low might help and that's where they probably want to migrate to anyway.
Click to expand...
Suddenly I have an image of an earbud inside its own headset. Take a bunch of heavy-duty rubber bands, insert the earbud between two cups of your spare headset, and rubberband the cups together. Plug the whole thing into the backseat jack and think of it as a tiny passenger.:rofl:
 
gismo said:
I suspect that recording in the ear cups with ANR on would depend greatly on where the ear buds end up. All ANR headsets have a microphone inside the earcup that picks up the noise to be cancelled. If your recording pickup is near that, you'll probably get a lot more noise and less of the desired signal but since ANR only works up to 250-300 Hz it might not matter all that much. From what I've seen, the ANR mics are usually near the top half of the ear cup so putting your earbuds down low might help and that's where they probably want to migrate to anyway.
Click to expand...

I use them in my Lightspeed 20-3G - Works great. :yes:

AuntPeggy said:
Suddenly I have an image of an earbud inside its own headset. Take a bunch of heavy-duty rubber bands, insert the earbud between two cups of your spare headset, and rubberband the cups together. Plug the whole thing into the backseat jack and think of it as a tiny passenger.:rofl:
Click to expand...

That works too - I even have a "fold-up" headset that doesn't need the rubber band. :yes:
 
HawkEye007 said:
Hey guys, I was wondering where I could find something to listen into the plane's intercom for filming purposes. Austin
Click to expand...

(Caution, blatant commercial hucksterism follows. {;-) )

Trivial. Simply take the "tape recorder output" line from your RST-442 or RST-443 intercom and feed it to the mic input port on your video camera.

Jim
 
So I ended up using the 1/8 to 1/4 foot cord idea (Somehow I found it lying around the house), despite the millions of miles of wires running everywhere it worked great. The only problem with it was that there was no engine noise, so Ill use the earbuds next flight, thank you all so much. standby for a link to the video...
 
AuntPeggy said:
Suddenly I have an image of an earbud inside its own headset. Take a bunch of heavy-duty rubber bands, insert the earbud between two cups of your spare headset, and rubberband the cups together. Plug the whole thing into the backseat jack and think of it as a tiny passenger.:rofl:
Click to expand...

Brilliant!
 
AuntPeggy said:
Suddenly I have an image of an earbud inside its own headset. Take a bunch of heavy-duty rubber bands, insert the earbud between two cups of your spare headset, and rubberband the cups together. Plug the whole thing into the backseat jack and think of it as a tiny passenger.:rofl:
Click to expand...
Make sure you have your three take off / landings logged so you are current to take it up. :crazy:
 
TangoWhiskey said:
Nice. I liked the parts without music better... the song is great but makes it hard to hear the ATC and you! ;-)
Click to expand...

The video is targeted more at non-pilots so Im not sure they care about ATC but thanks! Ill keep that in mind for my next video
 
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