Helicopters & airplanes sometimes don't mix

[Dean]

I attended a fly-in Saturday at Aurora MO and Cox Air Care helicopter was landing approximately 100-150' from the edge of the runway on the active end. A Champ was waiting to take off and watched him fly over the runway and start hovering in ground effect. The Champ started his take off roll while the helicopter was still hovering. When the champ got behind the helicopter the wash lifted the left wing and the right wing hit the ground. Everyone thought the Champ was going over. He exited the runway toward the other planes and crowd, but managed to get it turned back toward the runway. He went across the runway and was heading towards a row of trees. He got it airborne, banked hard left and missed the trees by less than 50'. He never came back to check for damage or to clean his pants out.

 

[ntbjounin]

i took off in a c152 next to 2 CH47s spinning up in the grass between the rwy and taxiway. they were cool w/ it... It was bumpy, but not dangerously so. But they werent hovering, just spinning pre-takeoff

 

[Areeda]

I'm not sure what you're suggesting.

Do you think the helo should not be using a runway or the Champ should have waited until the runway was clear to take off?

Joe

 

[Teller1900]

I'm not sure what you're suggesting.

Do you think the helo should not be using a runway or the Champ should have waited until the runway was clear to take off?

Joe

Or at the very least, have aborted the t/o or brought it back around and landed instead of pressing on after a runway excursion and wing strike!

 

[SCCutler]

I'm not sure what you're suggesting.

Do you think the helo should not be using a runway or the Champ should have waited until the runway was clear to take off?

Joe

I'd suggest that the Champ pilot is not likely to take a helo near the runway for granted again.

Come to think of it, although I instinctively know that a helicopter under lift will, of necessity, move a lot of air, I am not sure anyone ever taught me about it when I was learning to fly...

 

[Dean]

I'm not sure what you're suggesting.

Do you think the helo should not be using a runway or the Champ should have waited until the runway was clear to take off?

Joe

I am saying the Champ should have waited, we are taught about wake turbulance from large aircraft being dangerous, you would think a giant fan turning at 400 MPH next to the runway would be a little worse.

?

 

[Areeda]

One of my helo-airplane stories is one time I flew a JetRanger into Santa Ynez and parked at the end of the ramp near the county sherrif's helicopter well away from any airplanes on the ramp.

After lunch I get back and there is a 172 parked in the next spot, not even tied down.

I do my preflight and wait trying to figure out how to proceed. The problem is if I lift up into a hover (almost full power) that close I'll pick that thing up probably flip it over.

Fortunately the guy gets back before I go to the office and ask them to tow him someplace else. He was very nice, apologized and seemed surprised at the ramifications.

I've seen an R44 pick up Cherokees to the limit of tie down chains.

Joe

 

[RogerT]

One of my helo-airplane stories is one time I flew a JetRanger into Santa Ynez and parked at the end of the ramp near the county sherrif's helicopter well away from any airplanes on the ramp.

After lunch I get back and there is a 172 parked in the next spot, not even tied down.

I do my preflight and wait trying to figure out how to proceed. The problem is if I lift up into a hover (almost full power) that close I'll pick that thing up probably flip it over.

Fortunately the guy gets back before I go to the office and ask them to tow him someplace else. He was very nice, apologized and seemed surprised at the ramifications.

I've seen an R44 pick up Cherokees to the limit of tie down chains.

Joe

Back in the 70s when I was working on all my commercial ratings,
the flight school had a couple Bell 47s. That's what I got my helicopter
commercial and CFI in. So we had fixed wing and fling wing operating
together and you had to give it some thought.

 

[Graueradler]

Amen.

We parked a Malibu well away from a Blackhawk that was on the ramp. Didn't do any good. The Blackhawk taxied to the taxiway immediately behind the Malibu and then took off from the taxiway. The Malibu's control surfaces were slamming from one end of travel to the other and we saw daylight under the mains. When the Malibu owner came back, we cautioned him to do a good pre-flight and provided him the hull number of the Blackhawk

 

[cessna182b]

I attended a fly-in Saturday at Aurora MO and Cox Air Care helicopter was landing approximately 100-150' from the edge of the runway on the active end. A Champ was waiting to take off and watched him fly over the runway and start hovering in ground effect. The Champ started his take off roll while the helicopter was still hovering. When the champ got behind the helicopter the wash lifted the left wing and the right wing hit the ground. Everyone thought the Champ was going over. He exited the runway toward the other planes and crowd, but managed to get it turned back toward the runway. He went across the runway and was heading towards a row of trees. He got it airborne, banked hard left and missed the trees by less than 50'. He never came back to check for damage or to clean his pants out.

I don't think helicopters and airplanes mix well at all. Airplanes need runways and helicopters do not (and many have no wheels at all). They should be separated as much as possible - and fly non-conflicting patterns. The most ridiculous thing I have ever seen is a military chopper hovering down a taxiway (no doubt under the Tower's direction) at low altitude. It happened that I was working on my plane close by with the cowling removed - and they blew it end over end. Gave 'em an extended one-finger salute.

Dave

 

[rotorhead]

I always steer clear of airplanes even when tower, ground, and/or ground guides try to take me too close. Blackhawks have tremendous rotorwash even when ground taxiing.