From 172 / PA28 to Cirrus CR20 / 22

[VWGhiaBob]

Anyone else here done a transition to CR20 or 22 from a traditional 172 / PA28? Any hints, or tricks of the trade?

So far...I've noticed very little float on final, and have to be really careful about too much airspeed in the pattern, and especially on final. Even the 200HP CR20's like to go FAST. Even a slight nose down on a late final and an overshoot is a possibility.

Anyone else done this? My instructor says it's more like flying a twin, which I haven't done yet.

 

[wabower]

My DPE friend had a Citation I-SP and a CR-22 at the same time, both based on a private airport of moderate length. The jet (with no reversers) always used less runway than the 22.

Anyone else here done a transition to CR20 or 22 from a traditional 172 / PA28? Any hints, or tricks of the trade?

So far...I've noticed very little float on final, and have to be really careful about too much airspeed in the pattern, and especially on final. Even the 200HP CR20's like to go FAST. Even a slight nose down on a late final and an overshoot is a possibility.

Anyone else done this? My instructor says it's more like flying a twin, which I haven't done yet.

 

[Flying Lizard]

I got into an SR22 with about 200 hours total flight time, in 172s mostly. The transition training was only 5 hours. I now have 600 hours in Cirrus SR22/SR20, and I've flown an SR22 to the Bahamas, the Arctic Ocean, Los Angeles, New York, twice through the Grand Canyon, and many points in-between. They do have a way of shrinking the continent!

They're easy to fly, easy for IFR, and so nice and comfortable; I logged 9 hours one day, and felt fine. Some of the piloting technique is different, but you won't have any problem if you're proficient. They're great airplanes ...ENJOY THAT MINNESOTA MAGIC!!!

 

[Flying Lizard]

My DPE friend had a Citation I-SP and a CR-22 at the same time, both based on a private airport of moderate length. The jet (with no reversers) always used less runway than the 22.

The published data for the Citation I-SP ground roll is 2017' and an SR22 is 1200'. I can usually stop an SR22 in about 1000'. It sounds like your friend is landing it like a jet, which isn't proper technique for an SR22.

 

[peppy]

My lessons from transitioning from a 172 to Sr22:

1) Left turning tendencies are much stronger. Several Cirrus crashes are related to go arounds where the nose is pitched up before power comes in and poor rudder control makes the left wing dip. You are going from160hp to 310.

2) weather planning matters. Even just cruising around you will cover big distances. Always check area weather.

3) plan your approach like the big guys. Know your descent profile. Until you are comfortable pull back to 20" when 20nm out.

4) tail strikes are a zero flap issue so be careful when practicing flap failures.

5) the nose wheel is under damped. If you land nose wheel first you will porpoise. Go around! PIO can lead to a prop strike especially on pre-G3 planes due to lower prop clearance.

6) To descend if too close in get flaps in even if you have to pull the nose up to kill speed. Descending with zero flaps if close in will mean being way too fast and above flap extension speed. This is why the higher flap extension speed on the G5 is such a big deal.

7) have the instructor pop open a door on takeoff so you know it is no big deal. Always concentrate on flying the plane.

The Cirrus is a trip plane and will cry out for long trips. Don't skip the planning just because the plane makes it seem so easy.

 

[peppy]

Here is some more advice:

Join COPA.

Integrate CAPS into your emergency thinking including establishing a hard deck. CAPS isn't some magical savior but it is a valuable tool. Too many people have died because they didn't pull or pulled too late. Don't use CAPS as a crutch. Train to handle emergencies but find a CSIP instructor who integrates CAPS into the training. Try to get some time on one of the SimTrain full motion simulators including CAPS scenario training.

 

[wabower]

Dunno, he's the DPE and is pretty good at that stuff. What's the total landing distance for both? What weights are you using in the comparison?

I'm typed in the jet but not in the Cirrus, so can't provide any definitive numbers. My basis for thinking he's right is based on sitting in his hangar watching the goings-on at his airport. His big door is almost exactly even with the typical touch-down point when landing south. Any time the noise level and tire chirps are louder than usual you can bet it's a Cirrus and then see where they stop and turn around. Maybe Bob will measure his landing distances and report.

The published data for the Citation I-SP ground roll is 2017' and an SR22 is 1200'. I can usually stop an SR22 in about 1000'. It sounds like your friend is landing it like a jet, which isn't proper technique for an SR22.

 

[Mike I]

Anyone else here done a transition to CR20 or 22 from a traditional 172 / PA28? Any hints, or tricks of the trade?

So far...I've noticed very little float on final, and have to be really careful about too much airspeed in the pattern, and especially on final. Even the 200HP CR20's like to go FAST. Even a slight nose down on a late final and an overshoot is a possibility.

Anyone else done this? My instructor says it's more like flying a twin, which I haven't done yet.

I did the transition about 18 months ago, but haven't had the chance to fly an SR20 in about a year as the place I did the transition and was renting from went out of business.

In any case, my transition was following the CSIP program, and it was ~7h for me. Big differences for me were:
- Getting used to the sight picture and low-wing vs high wing
- Landing picture and landing speeds
- Taxiing a castering nosewheel
- Higher speeds
- 50% flaps recommended for takeoff vs normally no flaps in 172

I loved flying the plane and am sad the place I rented from closed...I had a good deal on it ($179/hr wet in NYC).

It's important to fly it by the numbers for predictable performance. I was trained to use more flows than checklists, and to use the checklist for verification rather than line-by-line as I go, as I was originally in a 172. Instructor called for a callout at 500' on departure, "500ft, CAPS, Flaps, Maps" ...Above 500' use CAPS if needed in emergency, retract flaps at 500' and when clear of terrain, and switch from engine view to maps view on MFD. As I said it's been awhile since flying it, but that's what I remember..

 

[DavidWhite]

Dunno, he's the DPE and is pretty good at that stuff. What's the total landing distance for both? What weights are you using in the comparison?

I'm typed in the jet but not in the Cirrus, so can't provide any definitive numbers. My basis for thinking he's right is based on sitting in his hangar watching the goings-on at his airport. His big door is almost exactly even with the typical touch-down point when landing south. Any time the noise level and tire chirps are louder than usual you can bet it's a Cirrus and then see where they stop and turn around. Maybe Bob will measure his landing distances and report.

I never knew Bob had a Cirrus.

 

[poadeleted20]

Anyone else here done a transition to CR20 or 22 from a traditional 172 / PA28? Any hints, or tricks of the trade?

So far...I've noticed very little float on final, and have to be really careful about too much airspeed in the pattern, and especially on final. Even the 200HP CR20's like to go FAST. Even a slight nose down on a late final and an overshoot is a possibility

Attitude control is how you maintain speed control, and speed control is how you make good approaches and landings in slick planes like Grummans, Diamonds, and Cirri.

My instructor says it's more like flying a twin

Eh, maybe, a bit like some twins, but not all. What it's like is flying a slick airplane which doesn't like to slow down. In that regard, a twin like an Apache is more like a Cherokee, but a twin like a Baron might be more like a Cirrus, and even a Mooney might be more like a Cirrus than that Apache.

 

[peppy]

I forgot the sight picture. Initially I tended to climb because the nose always seemed low. It was weird but nice to be able to see straight ahead in the flair.

 

[wabower]

The Bob who started the thread is flying one and likes it.

I never knew Bob had a Cirrus.