Found this on another forum

Tim,
that looked pretty good... I noticed that he kept getting a little low on the glide sloped and had to fix it - I wonder if it would have helped him if he had trimmed just slight to hold that - Also, I didn't hear him mention timing the approach other than zero-ing the timer in his pre approach brief. I got dinged by the DPE on my ride for not timing the ILS approach - his comment was "what if the glide slope goes out and it's just a localizer then?" - good question
Anyway, thanks for posting this...
 
Jeanie said:
I got dinged by the DPE on my ride for not timing the ILS approach - his comment was "what if the glide slope goes out and it's just a localizer then?" - good question
Anyway, thanks for posting this...
Click to expand...

The appropriate answer to that is "Well, I would go missed approach and set up a localizer approach and fly it next time around. I can't keep up with TWO approach procedures at the same time." If he has a problem with that, he is being an *******.:D
 
Greg Bockelman said:
The appropriate answer to that is "Well, I would go missed approach and set up a localizer approach and fly it next time around. I can't keep up with TWO approach procedures at the same time." If he has a problem with that, he is being an *******.:D
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~~~~~~~~ well, it wasn't so much a ding as one of those teaching moments that some DPEs offer in the form of a question
but your answer makes good sense...
 
Jeanie said:
Tim,
that looked pretty good... I noticed that he kept getting a little low on the glide sloped and had to fix it - I wonder if it would have helped him if he had trimmed just slight to hold that - Also, I didn't hear him mention timing the approach other than zero-ing the timer in his pre approach brief. I got dinged by the DPE on my ride for not timing the ILS approach - his comment was "what if the glide slope goes out and it's just a localizer then?" - good question
Anyway, thanks for posting this...
Click to expand...

That's funny because my DPE said the opposite, he said if your GS goes out, go missed. Especially since FAFs can be at different locations. DHs/and MDAs are always different, and even intermediate altitudes can be different. They may be on the same plate, but they are not the same approach.
 
EdFred said:
That's funny because my DPE said the opposite, he said if your GS goes out, go missed. Especially since FAFs can be at different locations. DHs/and MDAs are always different, and even intermediate altitudes can be different. They may be on the same plate, but they are not the same approach.
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~~~~~~ I'll look at that. Thanks.
Don't do any IFR flying anyway... currently.
 
PS:

EdFred said:
That's funny because my DPE said the opposite, he said if your GS goes out, go missed. Especially since FAFs can be at different locations. DHs/and MDAs are always different, and even intermediate altitudes can be different. They may be on the same plate, but they are not the same approach.
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~~~ When would you know to go missed?
 
Re: PS:

Jeanie said:
~~~ When would you know to go missed?
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Generally, as soon as the glide slope goes TU. But as always make sure to check the plate to see if doing so could make things dicey.
 
Re: PS:

EdFred said:
Generally, as soon as the glide slope goes TU. But as always make sure to check the plate to see if doing so could make things dicey.
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I'm not sure I follow that. If you declare a missed before you reach the MAP, you stop descending (and probably initiate the climb), but you should definitely continue flying the course to the MAP, at which point you follow the standard procedure.

Maybe that's what you meant and I just wasn't reading it that way.
 
Re: PS:

gprellwitz said:
I'm not sure I follow that. If you declare a missed before you reach the MAP, you stop descending (and probably initiate the climb), but you should definitely continue flying the course to the MAP, at which point you follow the standard procedure.

Maybe that's what you meant and I just wasn't reading it that way.
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More or less. It's going to depend on the approach. The ILS 35 at GRR the missed is pretty much straight ahead. Wouldn't matter when you climbed, or turned. The FAC is 355º which takes you pretty much over the VOR. The missed approach instructions is climb and intercept the 353º radial off the VOR. It says climbing left turn, but you're really pretty much straight ahead.

http://204.108.4.16/d-tpp/1002/05184IL35.PDF
 
It looked like a very clean single pilot approach. The briefing of the approach was really good. We have F/O's at our place that can't brief the approach half as well. I just had two things that I missed seeing. It may just be that it was late after a long day when I was watching it. The first was I don't recall hearing about what minimums and MAP would be if it became a LOC only G/S out approach. Second was I missed the missed approach portion of the briefing. As in as published or ATC defined. I heard ATC give it to you, however it was never repeated prior to reaching the MAP.

That was a nice panel. The airplane was handled very nice and calm.
 
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Re: PS:

gprellwitz said:
I'm not sure I follow that. If you declare a missed before you reach the MAP, you stop descending (and probably initiate the climb), but you should definitely continue flying the course to the MAP, at which point you follow the standard procedure.

Maybe that's what you meant and I just wasn't reading it that way.
Click to expand...

But the point is, how do you know you're at the MAP if you haven't timed it? And if you don't know where you are in terms of the MAP, that could make your MAprocedure dicey. If you're in radar coverage, no big deal, but if you're out of radar coverage....I suppose you just climb for all you're worth and confess your sins to ATC.



(Confession - I never hit the timer. If the GS goes out, my GPS will tell me if I'm at the MAP, so I'd just trundle along at current altitude until them. No timing. Naughty boy, I know.)
 
Yea, he should have timed it, maybe he did, but it was edited out?

I think the MAP on this approach was the middle marker if I remember correctly.

Tim
 
Not bad. He seemed to have an issue with the glideslope, most likely a little trimming would have taken care of it.
 
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