Flying to KACY, need advice.

redtail

redtail

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Redtail
My baby sister just gave birth to a healthy 8 pound boy!
She lives in Mays Landing, NJ. Soooo....

Now I have a good reason to make that flight to Atlantic City, that I've been talking about.

I'll be departing from Republic airport (KFRG). Hoping to get a Bravo clearance but if denied, I'll stay below (500') and when I reach Breezy Point, head over to Sandy Hook, NJ and proceed from there.

Just south of Barnegat Light, there's restricted airspace R-5002G. Looks like it's between FL200 & FL230 (did I read that correctly)? So it shouldn't be a factor at 6500.

I'll probably make the flight on Friday or Saturday.
My plan is to follow the coast all the way down using flight following, if available.
VFR at 6500.

Rent a car and drive to my sister's.
Any tips from you guys that are familiar with the area?

Thanks
 
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Sounds like you've got it figured out. The airport and the controllers are pretty easy to deal with. The FBO there (MidAtlantic) is decent too. You shouldn't have a problem getting a rental.
 
MidAtlantic was great. However, it has been a couple years since I've landed there
 
I'm thinking, I'd probably have a better chance getting Bravo clearance if I request to overfly the airport (JFK), while climbing to my cruise altitude. That way, I won't be in the approach/departure path.

Also, any idea why the restricted airspace (R-5002G), starts at 20000 ft?
 
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redtail said:
Just south of Barnegat Light, there's restricted airspace R-5002G. Looks like it's between FL200 & FL230 (did I read that correctly)? So it shouldn't be a factor at 6500.
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I don't see an R-5002G. There's an A through F. Is your sectional current?
 
Ocean City's not a bad place to stop, either... might be cheaper, if not closer to your destination.
I also don't know about R-5002G... hard to say why it starts at FL200, but as you say, it doesn't matter.
 
rottydaddy said:
Ocean City's not a bad place to stop, either... might be cheaper, if not closer to your destination.
I also don't know about R-5002G... hard to say why it starts at FL200, but as you say, it doesn't matter.
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Yeah I was looking at Ocean City but my sister is only 7 miles west of ACY, so I'd rather go there.
 
dmspilot said:
It's not there.
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You're correct. I touched a waypoint on my wingX screen, near Barnegat Light and it gave me info for R-5002G.

It appears that this was a proposed amendment from 2011, for McGuire AFB. Apparently, it went into affect.

On any account, it doesn't affect my flight plan.
Thanks

"Proposal

"The FAA is proposing an amendment to 14 CFR part 73 to establish two new restricted areas (designated R-5002F and R-5002G) at the Warren Grove Range, NJ. This action would raise the restricted area ceiling from 14,000 feet MSL to FL 230 and would expand lateral limits of restricted airspace at the range. R-5002F would overlie the existing R-5002A, and R-5002E, and part of R-5002B, and would extend from 14,000 feet MSL up to, but not including, FL 200. A second proposed restricted area, R-5002G, would extend from FL 200 up to FL 230. R-5002G would overlie the proposed R-5002F; and, to provide the required expanded lateral space between FL 200 and FL 230, the boundaries of R-5002G would extend approximately 15 NM to the northeast, and 8 NM to the east, of the current range boundaries.

It should be noted that, since the floor of R-5002G is at FL 200, it would lie above the VOR Federal airway structure and therefore would have no impact on the airways in the vicinity. Also, there are no jet routes that would be affected by this proposal."
 
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Silly question--are you IR-rated? If so, I'd file. You know I just made a trip from Baltimore to FRG recently (as I've done a few times before), and it was easy going IFR.
 
spiderweb said:
Silly question--are you IR-rated? If so, I'd file. You know I just made a trip from Baltimore to FRG recently (as I've done a few times before), and it was easy going IFR.
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No VFR only.
Looks like I'll be going Saturday, so I'll be prepared to be denied a Bravo clearance south of JFK. If I get it, cool. If not, no big deal.

I've done the 500' thing along the beaches, going out to the Hudson, several times:)

and I have my brand new Sospenders:yes:
 
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Have fun, and assuming you are heading home Sunday, you should stop at 47N on the way back. If the weather's good, the glider club will be flying (me, at least, if I can get a tow).
 
AC app is very easy to deal with. at 6500 you'll be way over the banner tow planes. AC has HUGE runways . Don't know much about the FBO. Maguire will also be happy to give flight following if you wish.
 
rottydaddy said:
Have fun, and assuming you are heading home Sunday, you should stop at 47N on the way back. If the weather's good, the glider club will be flying (me, at least, if I can get a tow).
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Thanks. Unfortunately, I won't be spending the night this time. Maybe on a future visit.
 
AdamZ said:
AC app is very easy to deal with. at 6500 you'll be way over the banner tow planes. AC has HUGE runways . Don't know much about the FBO. Maguire will also be happy to give flight following if you wish.
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Thanks.

I'll probably cruise at 4500 if I'm forced to stay below the Bravo until abeam Colts Neck. No use going up to 6500 at that point.
 
redtail said:
No VFR only.
Looks like I'll be going Saturday, so I'll be prepared to be denied a Bravo clearance south of JFK. If I get it, cool. If not, no big deal.

I've done the 500' thing along the beaches, going out to the Hudson, several times:)

and I have my brand new Sospenders:yes:
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I think if you can get above 3,000 by JFK, you'll be more likely to get the B clearance.

I guess I like altitude!
 
spiderweb said:
I think if you can get above 3,000 by JFK, you'll be more likely to get the B clearance.

I guess I like altitude!
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Me too, but I don't want to climb to 3000 from FRG, just to be told "remain clear of the Class Bravo".

Remember, I'm heading southwest bound.
 
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redtail said:
Me too, but I don't want to climb to 3000 from FRG, just to be told "remain clear of the Class Bravo".

Remember, I'm heading southwest bound.
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When VFR in similar situations and on flight following I normally ask the approach whether I can expect to be cleared through the airspace a while out. Yet to get "What kindda stupid question is that?" or "Yes.... Nope, change of plans". Either got an affirmative, expect or an outright clearance 30-40 nm away from the outer ring.
 
moonshine said:
When VFR in similar situations and on flight following I normally ask the approach whether I can expect to be cleared through the airspace a while out. Yet to get "What kindda stupid question is that?" or "Yes.... Nope, change of plans". Either got an affirmative, expect or an outright clearance 30-40 nm away from the outer ring.
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Don't have that option. FRG is 16nm east of JFK and sits underneath the outer ring with a floor of 4000'. As you fly a few miles south or west towards JFK, the inner rings are 1500 and +500 along the shoreline. Ceiling is 7000.

So if I depart FRG heading southwest and climb to 3000, I won't be up that high for long if denied the Bravo Clearance.
 
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This is a very easy flight and an enjoyable one call app after departure request transit class bravo and to follow the shore to kacy you will get it usually direct JFK then as requested. I fly out of kfrg also. And i have made this trip more times than i can count. I'm on the echo ramp. If you would like pm me and I will let you know when I will be at kfrg (most days) and I will show you a few options. I will flying to Kagc on Saturday but I will have time before that to go over some fun options
 
Sid459 said:
This is a very easy flight and an enjoyable one call app after departure request transit class bravo and to follow the shore to kacy you will get it usually direct JFK then as requested. I fly out of kfrg also. And i have made this trip more times than i can count. I'm on the echo ramp. If you would like pm me and I will let you know when I will be at kfrg (most days) and I will show you a few options. I will flying to Kagc on Saturday but I will have time before that to go over some fun options
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Thanks, that's what I'd plan to do. Good to hear from someone that's actually flown it and good to know I'd more than likely get the bravo clearance.

I'll pm you.
 
Sounds like Sid will get you squared away. I fly that exact corridor all the time, and have originated one flight from frg. The controller at acy are the most laid back I have ever experienced. I think more times than not they end up talking to me about something totally unrelated to the matters at hand.

When I left Frg I just took off, contacted the departure frq to request flight following and they took it from there. Got a Bravo clearance using their vectors and altitudes to the other side of the bravo and I was on my way. You don't need to worry about how they vector you. You don't ask to be vectored over jfk. They handle all that. Just call them, follow orders, and go along for the ride. You will need your low altitude plan b in place in case they tell you to beat it.
 
yachtjim said:
Sounds like Sid will get you squared away. I fly that exact corridor all the time, and have originated one flight from frg. The controller at acy are the most laid back I have ever experienced. I think more times than not they end up talking to me about something totally unrelated to the matters at hand.

When I left Frg I just took off, contacted the departure frq to request flight following and they took it from there. Got a Bravo clearance using their vectors and altitudes to the other side of the bravo and I was on my way. You don't need to worry about how they vector you. You don't ask to be vectored over jfk. They handle all that. Just call them, follow orders, and go along for the ride. You will need your low altitude plan b in place in case they tell you to beat it.
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Thanks, I was wondering about that. I guess there's no need to make matters more complicated :rofl:

Plan B, yes I always have a plan B:yesnod:
 
I've found NY approach very accommodating when going VFR from Long Island to southern NJ. They know what the big blue part on the chart is, and why we want to avoid it.

My experience has been coming from farther out (HWV) with more time to climb before getting into the class B, but if you can get to 4500, NY Approach will usually clear you over JFK, then turn south towards Colt's Neck. You should do well to head for Jones Beach, climb at Vy, and ask the tower to cut you loose as soon as possible to call up approach. Maybe even climb towards Captree until you can negotiate a clearance, so you don't wind up in a corner, airspace-wise.
 
DJTorrente said:
I've found NY approach very accommodating when going VFR from Long Island to southern NJ. They know what the big blue part on the chart is, and why we want to avoid it.

My experience has been coming from farther out (HWV) with more time to climb before getting into the class B, but if you can get to 4500, NY Approach will usually clear you over JFK, then turn south towards Colt's Neck. You should do well to head for Jones Beach, climb at Vy, and ask the tower to cut you loose as soon as possible to call up approach. Maybe even climb towards Captree until you can negotiate a clearance, so you don't wind up in a corner, airspace-wise.
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Yeah Ben suggested climbing also. I usually don't climb that high over Captree unless heading eastbound. But if it'll improve my chances of getting cleared into the bravo, then I'll give it a shot.

If not, I'll descend back down and go to plan B.
Thanks
 
Wife and I were talking this morning about a quick jaunt up to KACY. Unfortunately, we can't make it. Enjoy my new nephew.
 
Jaybird180 said:
Wife and I were talking this morning about a quick jaunt up to KACY. Unfortunately, we can't make it. Enjoy my new nephew.
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Thanks, I most certainly will. Looking forward to a 45-50min flight. The last time I visited her, I drove three hours!

My son and daughter (college kids) said they might fly down with me:)
Being busy with school, they rarely have time to go on joyrides with dad.
 
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What altitude do you fly under the 500 foot ceiling airspace to avoid busting the ceiling and how do you avoid traffic? Do you slow down so you have a better chance to see and avoid? That would seem to be very crowded airspace.
 
Done this flight many times, 9 out of 10 times have gotten cleaed for B. definitely five yourself some time to gain the altitude. 2 or 3 thousand should be good before you call them. Worst case scenario they say and you have to lose the altitude and go to 500. Going down the coast is easy. I haven't flown to ACY, used to go down to bader filed and go to the casinos.
 
Frank said:
What altitude do you fly under the 500 foot ceiling airspace to avoid busting the ceiling and how do you avoid traffic? Do you slow down so you have a better chance to see and avoid? That would seem to be very crowded airspace.
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The Class B airspace there starts from above 500 ft ("05+" on the chart). So 500' without a Bravo clearance is legal. Not that I like to flirt with a violation, but your Mode C transponder only has 100' resolution, so you can theoretically get as high as 549' before it would tattle on you to ATC. I usually keep the shoreline at a 45 deg. angle off my 'dry' wing.

The corridor is busier during the summer, when you get banner tows along the beach. Outside the summer season I've only seen helicopters as opposite direction traffic. NY Approach and JFK tower are generous with traffic advisories there. I think they'd rather be taking to you than not.

As for speed, the club plane I was flying made 100 knots on a good day, so there wasn't much slowing down to be done. I suppose an SR22 would do well to back off the coals. The Hudson River SFRA rules (140 kts. max; lights on) would seem to be a good idea for that airspace as well.
 
TommyG said:
Done this flight many times, 9 out of 10 times have gotten cleaed for B. definitely five yourself some time to gain the altitude. 2 or 3 thousand should be good before you call them. Worst case scenario they say and you have to lose the altitude and go to 500. Going down the coast is easy. I haven't flown to ACY, used to go down to bader filed and go to the casinos.
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Yes, the flight was great. I climbed to 3k after departing and called NY approach over the Captree bridge. They cleared me into the Bravo at 4500 direct JFK with vectors to the Colts Neck VOR, a few miles before reaching the field, so I didn't actually overfly JFK.

I advised that I'd be flying along the Jersey coast from Sandy Hook, rather than proceeding to the VOR. Once clear of the NY Bravo, I was handed off to McGuire approach for continued advisories.

The controllers were great and the return trip was the same at 5500.

I enjoyed flying into KACY. We took a cab to my sister's since it was only a five minute ride.
 
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