Flying in Europe with FAA Cert.

thezoolityre

thezoolityre

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thezoolityre
Howdy POA Folks!

I am CFI-I here in the states. And I expect to be for at least a year before I move on to do 135 or 121 stuff as I am only 21 with 400 hours. But I have a question for anyone who can answer...

Is it possible for me to rack up hours and somehow be able to fly in a place like Germany with my current Certificates?

Background: I have always loved Germany, I lived there for 4 months with a girlfriend 3 years ago and fell in love with the place, the people, and the lifestyle. I am fluent in the language (minus all I have forgotten in the times I have lived here and just haven't used it) and I have been visiting there at least every year since for a few weeks and I still love it!

But, the other issue is I love flying, and the cheaper place to LEARN was the U.S. and I have seen how easy it is to be an out of U.S. pilot and get your Certificates transferred to FAA Cert.'s... I just hope it is the same the other way around... Any clue??

Thanks!
 
thezoolityre said:
Howdy POA Folks!

I am CFI-I here in the states. And I expect to be for at least a year before I move on to do 135 or 121 stuff as I am only 21 with 400 hours. But I have a question for anyone who can answer...

Is it possible for me to rack up hours and somehow be able to fly in a place like Germany with my current Certificates?

Background: I have always loved Germany, I lived there for 4 months with a girlfriend 3 years ago and fell in love with the place, the people, and the lifestyle. I am fluent in the language (minus all I have forgotten in the times I have lived here and just haven't used it) and I have been visiting there at least every year since for a few weeks and I still love it!

But, the other issue is I love flying, and the cheaper place to LEARN was the U.S. and I have seen how easy it is to be an out of U.S. pilot and get your Certificates transferred to FAA Cert.'s... I just hope it is the same the other way around... Any clue??

Thanks!
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Find an N-Numbered plane in Europe. You'll be good to go.

BTW - they exist, more frequently than you'd think.
 
SkyHog said:
Find an N-Numbered plane in Europe. You'll be good to go.

BTW - they exist, more frequently than you'd think.
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How am I supposed to find that? And even if I do? Would I legally be able to operate under their rules??
 
thezoolityre said:
How am I supposed to find that? And even if I do? Would I legally be able to operate under their rules??
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You need to know the local rules, easy to find their version of our FARs, most are ICAO based.

A US citizen can legally fly any US registered aircraft in any country, I'm sure there may be some local war torn countries where it is limited.

To fly aircraft of that countries registration, you need their certificate. Most countries will issue based on your US certificate.
 
Is special permission required for a US-certified pilot to operate an N-registered aircraft with an experimental airworthiness certificate overseas?
 
Even though all of Europe is EASA and has unified licences now, there are smaller differences between countries still. I can only speak for the UK where I used to live.

In the UK you can fly a G-reg on an FAA license as of now. It will probably change in the near future, but you'r good to go for the next year or so. You can't fly it abroad without getting permission from the country you're flying to. Most of them accept it, I know France does. Germany is a little bit more hardcore when it comes to this, if I recall correctly. There I don't think you can fly D-reg on FAA license, but don't take my word for it. Check on Pprune - you'll get the answers you need there.

As mentioned, due to the bureaucracy in EASA, many Euro owners opt to keep their airplanes on the N-reg owned by a trust in the US. You'll find, I'm guessing, close to 30% of the GA fleet in many countries on the N-reg, at least that's the case in the UK. Therefore, it will be no problem to find a N-reg plane anywhere in northern Europe. Southern Europe is a little harder and generally GA flying isn't as widespread. EASA is closing this loophole by adding a residency clause, so the N-regs will probably diminish in the future, but all good for now.

The good thing is that EASA has just implemented easier conversions from FAA to EASA licenses (not called JAA licenses anymore), so you might want to check up on that. If I recall correctly, you can just get an endorsed EASA based on the FAA one, have a medical done and just a BFR-type thing. It used to be you had to convert it and that included a checkride. I could be wrong again, but I seem to recall reading about that.

Anyway, Pprune is your answer to these questions - that's where all the Euro guys hang out and they can give you a straighter answer.

As for experimental - yes, if it was built in the US and is on the US register, you'll need written permission from all the countries aviation authorities you plan on visiting. This is always given, but you need that paper or email. A UK homebuilt has the same rules - unless it's on the type approved list for microlights or LSA's by EASA, you need approval from the country your visiting. in reality, the customs people don't have a clue if an airplane is certified or not so they'll never ask for that paper, but just in case you get a Walter Mitty.

GENERAL:

UK has some anomalies in the form of the IMC Rating, which is domestic "IR rating light" you can get after 15hrs of instruction. It gives you enroute IFR capabilities and approaches to Class C airports. You're not allowed into class A airspace with it (there is no B in Europe). This rating does not exist outside of the UK, so there you need a full IR.

Mode S is almost mandatory in all countries and if you have only mode C, you'll have to skirt around airspace and stay low. The Netherlands are the most hardcore on this - you're not allowed into the country without mode S. So make sure your aircraft is equipped with it if you plan on touring.

FL's start as low as 5000ft, the whole unified 18000ft TL doesn't exist. It's a very confusing system they're now trying to change. You have to check every airport - they all have different TL's, but it's normally around 5000ft.

Most airports are privately owned and you have to pay a landing fee. Handling etc is often mandatory on the bigger ones and they charge a lot for it. Night flying is not like here, they're treated as IFR flights (even though you don't need IR rating). It can be hard to find smaller airports open after dark, so you're confined to the bigger ones with the expensive handling. No PTT to light up the rwy lights in Europe. Sucks, but that's how it is.

Avgas is exorbitant everywhere, so if you can find a Jet A burner, that will end up a lot cheaper as the tax on that is lower.

Good luck.
 
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Stratobee already covered most of it.

I can can confirm that you will not be allowed to fly D-reg. aircraft without European/German pilot's certificate.

Some things are different here in Germany:
- At uncontrolled airfields, there is always a guy/gal on an "INFO" freq. performing 'flight operations supervision'. It's not ATC and they are not allowed to give clearances etc. but unfortunately even some pilots do not understand this and ask for takeoff clearance etc.

- Due to the presence of these INFO people, self-announcement discipline is low. Often, only the mandatory calls 5 minutes before entering the pattern and then on again on base leg are made.

- In the German AIP, which is somewhat comparable to a combination of the FAR/AIM with the Airports&Facilities Directory (be careful though, it does not contain all regulations), there is a little map for even the smallest of airfields with an airfield-specific mandatory traffic pattern. Since those patterns are mostly introduced for noise-abatement, they often do not take into account operational/safety aspects and sometimes you will find yourself well outside of gliding range to the runway.

- Even the smallest airfield have landing fees.

- VFR weather minima for the different classes of airspace are slightly different tahn in the US.

- A service comparable to flight following is provided by controllers on so called 'INFORMATION' frequencies - not to be confused with the 'INFO' mentioned above - which are not identical to the approach/center frequencies used by IFR traffic.
 
Some things are different here in Germany:
- At uncontrolled airfields, there is always a guy/gal on an "INFO" freq. performing 'flight operations supervision'. It's not ATC and they are not allowed to give clearances etc. but unfortunately even some pilots do not understand this and ask for takeoff clearance etc.
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Yes, it's the same in the UK and many other Euro countries and something you'll encounter. In the UK they call it an AFIS - Aerodrome Flight Information Service. As T-41C mentioned, they give you the favourable rwy, the wind and report any other traffic, but they're not controllers (although an alarming amount behave like they are) and can't order you to do anything - just inform you. To be honest, it's a useless service and just job creation, but that's Europe for you (I say this as an European).

The correct way to address them when you call up is, for instance, "Goodwood Information". The clue is in the name.

A couple of other points in Europe is that they normally don't have 45 degree joins to the circuit (it's not a pattern!). In the UK, they'll normally have an overhead join that goes to the dead side, unless the noise abatement prohibits it.

Flight following in the UK is called Basic Service and you ask for that with the radar controller. Just like when you have flight following in the US, it doesn't mean he'll keep traffic away from you. It's only time permitting. You can ask for a Traffic or Deconfliction Service, but they probably won't give it to you unless they've got nothing to do. It's probably similar in Germany.
 
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Thanks both you guys but I don't want to fly MY plane over there if I got one.. I just want a job, where I could live in Germany, and fly out of an airport for an equivalent 135 or 121 gig, that's what I am looking for.
 
Then you need to convert all your licences, especially if you want to get paid. I thought you were just time building on your own dime/PPL.
 
i suspect you'll find light aircraft commercial opportunities are non-existent other than giving BFR's to people flying their N-reg plane on an FAA license.

for non-commercial recreational flying you're going to the wrong country. France has huge areas of uncontrolled airspace and if you stay off paved runways the cost might approach reasonable.
 
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There is a US military flying club in Germany that has hired civilians as CFIs in the past. They are currently moving from the Coleman Barracks up to the Wiesbaden area due to base closures. You may want to visit their site at www.colemanaeroclub.com and drop them a message for more info.
 
There are N-regs for rent in many European countries... as others have said, you can use your FAA certification to fly internationally. In the UK (as long as you don't leave the UK), you can use your license to fly locally registered aircraft. Just use your checkout time to get used to the (minor) local differences in radio work, flight following, atc and tower operations.

I hope you've got a trust fund... I find flying in Europe roughly 2.3-2.4 times more expensive than the same flying in the US.
 
JHW said:
for non-commercial recreational flying you're going to the wrong country. France has huge areas of uncontrolled airspace and if you stay off paved runways the cost might approach reasonable.
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I don't agree with this. VFR flying in Germany is fine--plenty of hours all over the country (France is also cool!)... and to anticipate another question, you can generally operate in English, although there will be a few German only or French only aerodromes where you may not be able to land unless you speak the language.

My earlier post relates to non-commercial flying, of course.
 
Sorry for the necropost, but does anyone know what the current rules say? We have some family in Europe, Hungary to be specific, and I always thought it would be cool to rent an airplane there and log some European airports, etc

I did some Googling, but ended up on this thread LOL.. appreciate any info you guys may offer, thanks!
 
Slightly different now. You need to sit down with a FI(A) before you can use your ICAO PPL (read: FAA PP) in Europe. Used to be a lot easier.
 
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