Flight training in San Diego (MYF)

Timmer

Timmer

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Timmer
Hello,

I have been interested in starting my PPL flight lessons for a while now. Life keeps intruding as it is wont to do but I have set a goal for myself to start taking a few introduction flights to find a good instructor. I live just a couple of miles away from MYF which has the great Plus One Flyers club and a handful of schools.

I wanted to post here and see if anyone had recommendations for great CFIs or schools or, at the other end, warnings of some. The Plus One Flyers page has about 50 CFIs and it never hurts to see if others have some good input. Also, has anyone experience with some of the schools like Learn To Fly San Diego? (Besides making their CFIs wear the silly epaulets :)

I am going to head down tomorrow and do another walk around the airport to have lunch at the mexican restaurant there with my dad and check out some planes. My father holds a CFII and has been keeping a log book for me with some logged hours for me since I has about five. I am looking forward to logging some more, finally :)

Thank you!
 
There are other options in the area, but as a former member (before I moved last summer), you will be very hard pressed to find a better deal in aviation than Plus One. You definitely won't find a better deal in SoCal. I can give you a few recommendations for club CFIs if you need.
 
As far as the other MYF outfits, I used to be out at Gibbs 3-4 times a week flying. I never met anyone who flew or trained at NAC if that tells you anything. San Diego Flight Training is not bad, but just another big, overpriced school. ATP is well, ATP. pretty much accelerated training. Works for some, not for others. Learn to Fly San Diego is not bad, but relatively new and as of last summer didn't have much of a fleet. There is also Golden Flyers- another club like Plus One. It is decent, but also a relatively small fleet. Most of the pilots I know who are members of Golden Flyers are also members of Plus One. I never saw a reason to pay dues to two clubs at the same airport.
 
Wasn't pleased with NAC. Aircraft were old and outdated panels. It was like a flight school on its last leg of operation. Can't believe they're still in business. Reserved an aircraft once on my birthday and some instructor bumped me and had the aircraft. Very disappointed.
 
Thanks for the replies. My dad is a big believer in the "find a retired military or pro pilot that's teaching for fun" line of thought and he was a member of Plus One when he flew so I'll definitely join there once I get my PPL even if I don't learn from them.

I really don't want to join a formal academy as this is something I'm doing for fun and want to take my time and enjoy the journey and be as safe as possible. I mentioned Learn to Fly since I have seen their purple planes and they seem to have good yelps on their intro flights and their rates are in-line with Plus One -- figure I can take an intro flight with them (unless their planes look too scary tomorrow!) There are plenty of planes in MYF I wouldn't care to sit in even on the ground.

@Fearless: if you have specific CFI recommendations, I'd love to have some. That's part of the issue with Plus One. Just looking at a giant list with one sentence to describe each person is overwhelming.

@Mcfly: Yeah, that place isn't an option. Did you train around here?
 
Well I wouldn't call it training. I saved my bonus from the Marines in hopes of getting my multi-commercial rating at NAC. Instead, other distractions came about. I bought an expensive car and spent the rest on sky diving at Brown. :) basically I just rented their Piper Warriors and Archers in my spare time. That was in 1998. I just got on their website tonight and they still have the same aircraft I used rent.

My advice is to stick with a larger school that has modern aircraft (Cirrus) or at least updated panels. If you want to pursue this as a career you'll want training on the most up to date stuff.
 
I did my tailwheel add-on with these guys and also have a little time in their 172.
This is my kind of school/FBO... nice folks, nice fleet, good prices, and KSDM is a good training environment. Not sure where you live, but I was staying in Chula Vista at the time I was in the area, and found it pretty easy to get there.

http://www.firstflightcorp.com/
 
rottydaddy said:
I did my tailwheel add-on with these guys and also have a little time in their 172.
This is my kind of school/FBO... nice folks, nice fleet, good prices, and KSDM is a good training environment. Not sure where you live, but I was staying in Chula Vista at the time I was in the area, and found it pretty easy to get there.

http://www.firstflightcorp.com/
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If the OP lives close to KMYF, the commute to KSDM will be absolute hell in rush hour traffic (count on at least one hour each way). If he can drive during the day and stay off the roads during rush hour traffic it's OK, but otherwise he's better off spending the mogas $$ on avgas instead.
 
I did my PPL training at MYF with Armed Forces Aero Club. Scott Peterson (Paterson maybe) was my CFI. Good outfit with nice planes and cheap rates. $42 an hour for a 172? Been awhile so that may be off a few dollars.

Good luck!
 
I know one CFI who is retired NAVY pilot at Pacific Coast Flyers (which used to be part of Plus One long time ago) at Palomar Airport CRQ.

To my taste MYF is overcrowded and wrapped by layers of bravo as for VFR flying..


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Flying Cirruses or "updated panels" is not going to help your career nor help you become a better pilot. You are learning to fly an airplane, not a panel. A good instructor is much more important, the airplane not so much as long as it is maintained to a safe standard.
 
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Ateaist said:
If the OP lives close to KMYF, the commute to KSDM will be absolute hell in rush hour traffic (count on at least one hour each way). If he can drive during the day and stay off the roads during rush hour traffic it's OK, but otherwise he's better off spending the mogas $$ on avgas instead.
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I can see why they'd want to avoid that drive at rush hour (not really any way to circumvent the worst of the traffic), but around here, only an hour to go that distance at rush hour would hardly be "hell". :D
 
dmspilot said:
Flying Cirruses or "updated panels" is not going to help your career nor help you become a better pilot. You are learning to fly an airplane, not a panel. A good instructor is much more important, the airplane not so much as long as it is maintained to a safe standard.
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Now this is understatement. If one wants transition to an airline it is better to fly "glass". There is nothing wrong with updated panels.


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sdflyer said:
Now this is understatement. If one wants transition to an airline it is better to fly "glass". There is nothing wrong with updated panels.
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You need to know both.

I would venture to say that the average 121 cockpit is a far cry from a Garmin or Avidyne glass panel.

Here is the thing....flying is freaking expensive enough as it is. A glass panel 172 will run you about $30-$40 more per hour than the same airplane with steam gauges. The PPL is about VFR flying and looking out the windows. You need to be familiar with steam gauges because there are a lot of those airplanes out there both in GA and in the 135/121 world. As tech advances, it is important to be familiar and competent in flying glass, but you can get all the basic exposure you need from fiddling around with a G1000 on an old copy of MS Flight Sim.

If you want to fly professionally, you need the hours. Save the money you would spend on glass and use it for more hours in the air.


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I flown plenty aircraft retrofitted with Aspen Evolution. They all had some steam gauges as a backup. Most of those it planes were built in 70th and 60th. So they don't run that much expensive.

PFD is something 20 years old airliner would have. I've seen actually more steam gauges pilots who had difficulty to transition from steam to glass than opposite.

In fact, glass could be more complex than steam. Flying steam doesn't make better pilot IMHO

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sdflyer said:
I flown plenty aircraft retrofitted with Aspen Evolution. They all had some steam gauges as a backup. Most of those it planes were built in 70th and 60th. So they don't run that much expensive.
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I have too, but there is a big difference between an ASPEN PFD combined with steam gauges and a G1000 or Avidyne full glass. And even with mixed panel, it still adds to the cost of flying. My point is there is not much value to be added by solely focusing on training in a glass panel aircraft. IF your goal is to fly professionally and money is at all a concern, you are better off building the bulk of your time in a steam gauge airplane and supplementing it here and there with glass time.

sdflyer said:
Flying steam doesn't make better pilot IMHO
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Neither will make you a better pilot. Understanding how an airplane flies through the air is what is most important. You can do that in either, but one is more expensive than the other. Which one is going to get you the job? I've seen lots of jobs with 1500-2000 TT required. Haven't seen a single one that said 'must have glass panel experience'
 
OK, don't fly a newer aircraft like a Cirrus for preparing for professional flying. Do it because of the capabilities they offer. You'll be flying in one of the busiest GA airports around the U.S.. You'll also be flying in an area with mountains to the east. So, having a panel that is equipped with TIS/TCAS,TAWS, XM WX and other goodies is only going to help. Sure you can get that crap in an iPad but I'd rather have it in the panel. Of course you'd have a parachute if needed.

I used to not care about glass and the toys that I listed above until I started flying professionally. The helicopter I fly is glass with the bells and whistles. Once I became used to flying instruments on glass and SA that the other stuff provides I never want to go back to steam. Our spare aircraft is steam and whenever I fly it I feel naked.

It all depends on your budget though. If you want to save some money by flying aircraft that were ragged out when I flew them 15 yrs ago, be my guest. If you have the money for a newer product, that's the way I'd go. Either way it's going to be expensive. I was looking at the rental rates at NAC and they're almost twice as much as when I rented. Same as instructor rates.
 
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Velocity173 said:
OK, don't fly a newer aircraft like a Cirrus for preparing for professional flying. Do it because of the capabilities they offer.
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Won't disagree there. For anyone getting into flying, you need to really assess what your priorities and goals are and compare those with your financial resources. If technology and capabilities are your priority and you have the money to do it, then by all means go for the advanced avionics.

Velocity173 said:
You'll be flying in one of the busiest GA airports around the U.S.
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True, but having flown extensively IFR and VFR in the San Diego, LA basin and Phoenix airspace for the past 5 years, I feel much safer with my eyes looking out the windows than at things installed in the panel. YMMV.


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I don't mean to derail the derail as it's a good conversation. Thanks for all the input and if any others have some recommendations, I'm all ears!

Unfortunately, a $280/hour Cirrus is definitely not in my budget. I'm just taking this up for fun and I have Flight Sim to learn all the pretty panels I want *g* I don't care about the panels but I do care about the shape of the aircraft. As I said, I saw a few planes sitting on the MYF tarmac you couldn't pay me to fly in. I'd pay $120/hr vs $95 for a plane that's well-maintained by a solid mechanic and school or club, though.

It's too bad there aren't more Diamond DA20s around here. They seem like a great airplane to learn in, also. But right now on my list is flying a great instructor.
 
Fearless Tower said:
I have too, but there is a big difference between an ASPEN PFD combined with steam gauges and a G1000 or Avidyne full glass. And even with mixed panel, it still adds to the cost of flying. My point is there is not much value to be added by solely focusing on training in a glass panel aircraft. IF your goal is to fly professionally and money is at all a concern, you are better off building the bulk of your time in a steam gauge airplane and supplementing it here and there with glass time.


Neither will make you a better pilot. Understanding how an airplane flies through the air is what is most important. You can do that in either, but one is more expensive than the other. Which one is going to get you the job? I've seen lots of jobs with 1500-2000 TT required. Haven't seen a single one that said 'must have glass panel experience'
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I gotta go to an interview to find out.


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Timmer said:
I don't mean to derail the derail as it's a good conversation. Thanks for all the input and if any others have some recommendations, I'm all ears!

Unfortunately, a $280/hour Cirrus is definitely not in my budget. I'm just taking this up for fun and I have Flight Sim to learn all the pretty panels I want *g* I don't care about the panels but I do care about the shape of the aircraft. As I said, I saw a few planes sitting on the MYF tarmac you couldn't pay me to fly in. I'd pay $120/hr vs $95 for a plane that's well-maintained by a solid mechanic and school or club, though.

It's too bad there aren't more Diamond DA20s around here. They seem like a great airplane to learn in, also. But right now on my list is flying a great instructor.
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I mentioned before retired NAVY and CFI at Pacific Coast Flyers. His name is John Hiltabidle.

By the way a lot of instructors in Pacific Coast Flyers also work at Plus One. Generally speaking CFI don not belong to one particular club, they are club members who offer independent services.




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Fearless Tower said:
Won't disagree there. For anyone getting into flying, you need to really assess what your priorities and goals are and compare those with your financial resources. If technology and capabilities are your priority and you have the money to do it, then by all means go for the advanced avionics.


True, but having flown extensively IFR and VFR in the San Diego, LA basin and Phoenix airspace for the past 5 years, I feel much safer with my eyes looking out the windows than at things installed in the panel. YMMV.


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I also thought so until I get to fly airplane with TCAS. I was astonished how many I didn't see.

The good rule if you don't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist :) Seriously, 5 years ago on one hazy socal day day I was hair close to mid air. A twin flying head on, shaded by mountains on the background, came out of nowhere. (Very hard to see especially when people don't use landing light for traffic). It just grew from small dot to huge objects in matter of seconds straight on.

We spotted it very late, I managed to dive to the right barely missing it. Twin didn't even moved, the pilots were obviously busy training engine outs - all inside the cockpit...

After that my co-pilot buddy thought for a week about quitting flying....Things happens. The sad thing we had plenty of mid airs in SoCal skies and counting.


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Thanks, sdflyer. CRQ is a bit far for me, but I may get in touch with him. I currently live off of Balboa, just five minutes from MYF so it would be a hard sell to fly out of somewhere else but options are a good thing.

I went down today and met with one instructor and checked out the planes. Unfortunately, not too much traffic pattern flying to watch today, maybe due to the gusty winds. Still, it was a nice afternoon and reminded me how much fun it is to be around flying.
 
Fearless Tower said:
As far as the other MYF outfits, I used to be out at Gibbs 3-4 times a week flying. I never met anyone who flew or trained at NAC if that tells you anything. San Diego Flight Training is not bad, but just another big, overpriced school. ATP is well, ATP. pretty much accelerated training. Works for some, not for others. Learn to Fly San Diego is not bad, but relatively new and as of last summer didn't have much of a fleet. There is also Golden Flyers- another club like Plus One. It is decent, but also a relatively small fleet. Most of the pilots I know who are members of Golden Flyers are also members of Plus One. I never saw a reason to pay dues to two clubs at the same airport.
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I flew out of NAC for a few instrument lessons.. we'll just say i felt like their a/c were flying deathtraps
 
I took my first intro lesson on Saturday after two previous cancels. The first due to me getting a sinus infection the night before and the other, on Friday, due to the marine layer sticking around past its welcome. Saturday, however, the marine layer burned off around 10AM and left a beautiful day. We got off the ground right at 11am.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/1575jhtfkq15t1a/ERXkj4XFW3

I had forgotten how easily small planes get bumped around the air, making the climb out fun until we got above the cloud layer, yay inversion layers, and then became smooth as glass.

Having not flown since '89 according to my logbook (at the age of 14) it was a wonderful experience. The only thing that was a shock to me was the rudder pedals. Wow, they are sluggish and without feeling! That'll take me a bit. Otherwise, I had fun doing 30 degree turns and 45 degree turns and did well at trimming for climb and decent and level flight.

I am excited about getting back into the air and embarking on the journey to become a pilot!
 
I got my PPL at MYF... Western Sun Aviation. $40/hour wet for a Piper Warrior II; $50/hour wet for an Archer II. But wait, that was in 1985. Never mind. Good luck!
 
Yeah, prices have gone up just a bit. If only that was the cost of the rental now.

Thanks for your well-wishes. I am excited!
 
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