Flight Lesson: 6/18/09

Snaggletooth

Snaggletooth

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Dustin
Had a great lesson today!! We did Ground reference maneuvers and touch and goes.

We took off of runway 17 with a north departure. We flew a little ways and found a road running east to west and started doing S-turns across the road. then started doing turns around a point. From there My CFI told me to navigate my way back to the airport, which I did with ease.

We then started doing the touch and goes. We came in fast trying to beat other traffic. after touching down we took off and at 300ft my CFI did something that totally surprised me. With a quick movement he cut the power and said "ok.... your engine died. what do you do now?"
I'm still in shock that he did that and said "try and go around." despite knowing I had to find a Emergency landing field. I just blurted out what came to mind I guess. On the second touch and go, we landed and got to about 300ft and he again cut the power and said "ok.... your engine died. what do you do now?" I got it right and said "make a landing in the field and pitch for 60 knots."

We did two more touch and goes then came in for a full stop.

My CFI said I'm doing very good I just need to work on leveling off above the runway on landing.

Next lesson is June 24th.
 
Snaggletooth said:
Had a great lesson today!! We did Ground reference maneuvers and touch and goes.

We took off of runway 17 with a north departure. We flew a little ways and found a road running east to west and started doing S-turns across the road. then started doing turns around a point. From there My CFI told me to navigate my way back to the airport, which I did with ease.

We then started doing the touch and goes. We came in fast trying to beat other traffic. after touching down we took off and at 300ft my CFI did something that totally surprised me. With a quick movement he cut the power and said "ok.... your engine died. what do you do now?"
I'm still in shock that he did that and said "try and go around." despite knowing I had to find a Emergency landing field. I just blurted out what came to mind I guess. On the second touch and go, we landed and got to about 300ft and he again cut the power and said "ok.... your engine died. what do you do now?" I got it right and said "make a landing in the field and pitch for 60 knots."

We did two more touch and goes then came in for a full stop.

My CFI said I'm doing very good I just need to work on leveling off above the runway on landing.

Next lesson is June 24th.
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I am not a fan of this practice of pulling the power so close to the ground. I wonder what the local FSDO would think of this practice. You should call them and see what they have to say of creating a dangerous situation that did not need to be there. Pull the power in the practice area and practice what you would do.

Old pilots or bold pilots, NOT Old and Bold pilots
 
Well Snag i sort of agree with baxter unless you have done failure at altitude (hope you have) but then me instructor did that to me also only at about 500 ft. And i knew what to do. Keep up the good work and keep us informed.
Dave G
 
baxter1000 said:
I am not a fan of this practice of pulling the power so close to the ground. I wonder what the local FSDO would think of this practice. You should call them and see what they have to say of creating a dangerous situation that did not need to be there. Pull the power in the practice area and practice what you would do.

Old pilots or bold pilots, NOT Old and Bold pilots
Click to expand...

If I understand what Snaggle said, the lesson was to NOT turn around to the airport - At least, I hope "landing in the field" means a field off the end of the runway...
 
flyingcheesehead said:
If I understand what Snaggle said, the lesson was to NOT turn around to the airport - At least, I hope "landing in the field" means a field off the end of the runway...
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Yea. Where's the problem? Reducing power on climbout with a good alternate ahead?
 
There was a very Large open feild right off the nose.
I feel that what he did was all part of training, and was a good thing to do to make one aware of what could happen, and what to do.

JMHO
 
Most people never really see "what's off the nose, close-in" right after departure, as they are in a climb attitude and what you see over the nose is quite a distance off.

I had an instructor say "my plane" about 400' on departure--and talk through what he was doing and why--as he reduced power, showed how aggressively you immediately pitch over to maintain airspeed, and pointed out the wonderful 1800' of grass alongside the railroad tracks and near the road that I could easily make if I ever lost an engine on departure from runway 14 at T67. I'd been flying out of that airport for a year at that time, and had never seen this spot. Seeing that strip of grass instantly removed any desire to try and turn back to the runway if I ever lost the engine in the future.

It CAN be a useful lesson to a student; if they never get to "see it" before it really happens, and see how fast "it" happens, it's a good bet they won't do the right thing fast enough when "it" does happen.
 
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Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
Yea. Where's the problem? Reducing power on climbout with a good alternate ahead?
Click to expand...

I can see the argument that it should be done at altitude *first*, but I think the Law of Primacy and the Law of Exercise would dictate that if engine failure drills are *never* practiced at low altitude, the pilot will *never* expect the engine to fail down there, leaving him ill-prepared when it does. Sounds like Troy had a smart CFI...

That reminds me of what my favorite instructor said recently when I talked about getting checked out in the Seneca. "By the end of a good checkout, you should be surprised when both engines work." This is the instructor I did my IR with, and I got REALLY good at handling failures. And yes, I was surprised when my instruments kept working afterward.
 
Baxter, I really don't see the problem here. The CFI pulled the power to get the student to see the big field in front of them to land in in order to not turn back to the airport. This means that the CFI already knew about the field and was likely prepared to safely land there had the engine failed completely. Plus, he just reduced the power, it's not like he actually killed the engine. This was a good exercise in opening a student's eyes, and one that I'm thankful my CFI did for me when I was doing my primary training.

Snaggletooth - what airport are you flying out of again? I did my training out of SGR, and there are many nice, large fields available off the departure end of 17 there.
 
My CFI has also stressed engine failures at altitude in the practice area and has had me take the plane down to 1200' in the best glide configuration but stressed that he would NEVER do so on T-O..just his way. Of course, perhaps the mind set we students sometimes fall into is being familiar and comfortable with our home base and too inexperienced with other airports to deal with engine failures on T-O on a strange field. However, I am not sure that anyone can really be 'familiar' with that event unless its practiced alot in a simulator. I have had it drilled into me many times over to NOT go back to the field unless I had at least 1000 ft AGL. Snaggletooth..have you worked on a teardrop maneuver back to the airport to simulate a quick return to the field?

Oh gang...just a brief request for your good thoughts....FAA written this week and my checkride (if the weather cooperates) by Saturday 6-27-09...am I nervous!!!!
 
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