F16 vs Cessna 150 collision

Discussion in 'Hangar Talk' started by DaveA, Jul 7, 2015.

  1. DaveA

    DaveA Pre-takeoff checklist

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    According to WCIV in Charleston, SC there was a midair between a Sumter based F16 that collided with a 150 about 2 miles SE of Moncks Corner SC/Berkeley Co Airport KMKS about 1.5 hrs ago (11am EDT). According to Google maps, it's on an old plantation that's mostly trees. The guys at Shaw AFB says the F16 pilot ejected safely...but the 150? OMG, this is bad....
     
  2. ktup-flyer

    ktup-flyer Pattern Altitude

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    Apparently Coast Guard is searching for the cessna pilot. Not sure how this even happens
     
  3. MassPilot

    MassPilot Cleared for Takeoff

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    Doesn't an F16 have RADAR? Isn't that the whole point?
     
  4. murphey

    murphey Final Approach

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    Radar's not much good when you're going 250-400 mph
     
  5. Velocity173

    Velocity173 Final Approach

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    IR-18 goes just southeast of Moncks Corner (MKS). Not saying that's what happened but with the nature of MTRs, it's a possibility.
     
  6. ktup-flyer

    ktup-flyer Pattern Altitude

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    Do F-16s not have ACAS?
     
  7. Bob Noel

    Bob Noel Touchdown! Greaser!

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    The purpose of the radar in the nose of the F16 isn't for traffic avoidance.
     
  8. MassPilot

    MassPilot Cleared for Takeoff

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    Of course not, but it is for tracking other planes which should help with avoiding them.
     
  9. N659HB

    N659HB Pattern Altitude

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    One of my buddies was nearly killed by one 25 years ago near Columbia. He saw it in time to dive away. There are several MOAs along the coast and in the midlands. My friend's encounter was outside the MOAs. Sympathies to the family.
     
  10. 48dodge

    48dodge Line Up and Wait

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    Yeah, not too far from me. I am confused how it happens as well. Most likely not in an MOA unless it happened in Gamecock C and the F16 flew that far before ejecting. B and D don't start until 10,000' and I'm guessing a 150 wasn't up there.
     
  11. gov98

    gov98 Pre-takeoff checklist

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    ...Maybe some Maverick was dipping below the "hard deck" to get Jester.
     
  12. FlySince9

    FlySince9 Pattern Altitude

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    GEEZE! looks like nobody in the wrong place, just at the wrong time... How do you avoid something like that???

    Is it me, or have there been a lot of accidents the last week or so...???
     
  13. jesse

    jesse Administrator Management Council Member

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    Welcome to summer. This is the part of it I don't like.
     
  14. FlySince9

    FlySince9 Pattern Altitude

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    That's a bit tasteless..!!:nono:
     
  15. gov98

    gov98 Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I might get myself in trouble...but it seems hard to see, if it's outside of a MOA or Restricted warning area, how the 150 could be at fault. There is just literally no time to see and avoid an F-16 in a 150. Sorry if I find it, at this very early stage, easier to believe that maybe the F-16 was doing something he (or she) probably should not have been doing.
     
  16. frcabot

    frcabot Line Up and Wait

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    I hope the family of the 150 gets mucho dinero from the government.
     
  17. steingar

    steingar Taxi to Parking

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    Nice to know that a foreign government can just put up a bunch of cheap ultralights that can take out our multimillion dollar aircraft.
     
  18. James331

    James331 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    That was my initial reaction as well, I'd also imagine the families won't even get a "sorry" from the military, let alone a single cent.
     
  19. bullwinkle

    bullwinkle Pattern Altitude

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    Midair collisions occasionally happen. This time it just happened to be a very fast USAF airplane and a slow civilian one. Luck of the draw.

    The big sky principle usually works, every now and then it doesn't.
     
  20. nauga

    nauga Pattern Altitude

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    Cue the "experts."

    Nauga,
    predictably
     
  21. dukeblue219

    dukeblue219 Line Up and Wait

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    Really?
     
  22. frcabot

    frcabot Line Up and Wait

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    Actually collisions with military aircraft have resulted large settlements / verdicts against the US military. Would probably have a cause of action under the Federal Tort Claims Act.
     
  23. FlySince9

    FlySince9 Pattern Altitude

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    Not necessarily true... Sometimes Sh-t happens... The Jet's base was not far south of the accident... The Cessna might have been out of MKS... I used to fly out of, the now closed, Clinton Cnty Airport in Plattsburg NY... 5 miles from Plattsburg AFB... I had some close encounters with FB111s and KC135s pretty regularly... Nobody doing anything wrong... just crossing paths in the big sky... The then Burlington VT TRSA did a good job of keeping aircraft separated, but like I said sometimes Sh-t happens... But FWIW... I wouldn't go prejudging anyone at this early point...
     
  24. jesse

    jesse Administrator Management Council Member

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    I'd say your post is more useless than the "experts", with that in mind, perhaps you'd be best off not to post at all?

    Jesse,
    who can judge whose opinion he values without the assistance of useless posts and credibility police
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2015
  25. pbramlett

    pbramlett Line Up and Wait

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    GMAFB we don't even know what happened. But, the American way is to sue the **** out of someone.
    Do you fly around or drive around and hope to God that something happens so you can get your millions by litigation?

    pathetic


    RIP to the deceased
     
  26. gov98

    gov98 Pre-takeoff checklist

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    ...I agree with everything you said, and maybe the 150 was NORDO with a faulty Mode C. It's possible. And my mind is open, at the same time, that's where my thoughts initially go, but ...it's not evidence and it's just a message board to voice some thoughts, but apparently, unapproved thoughts require scolding now...It's the SJW thing to do.
     
  27. frcabot

    frcabot Line Up and Wait

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    If an F16 hits a Cessna, then the F16 is at fault. The F16 should have been receiving traffic services from ATC, and as the more maneuverable plane it's his responsibility. So there's some negligence somewhere, whether from the pilot or ATC. Either way, it's the Federal government's negligence and the Federal government's responsibility. The Cessna wasn't operating in restricted airspace. So yes, the family should absolutely sue.
     
  28. steingar

    steingar Taxi to Parking

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    If an F16 can get snagged by a 150 in the big sky why couldn't a foreign government, expecting an air attack, just send lots of ultralights aloft? What's the prevent the multimillion dollar fighter jets from blundering into them? They have to have their own airspace here, and apparently don't have the ability to sense and avoid.
     
  29. frcabot

    frcabot Line Up and Wait

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    Yeah, I go around flying hoping I will get disintegrated by an F16 from behind. :loco:

    pathetic
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2015
  30. DaveA

    DaveA Pre-takeoff checklist

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    http://twitter.com/itvnews/status/618463671069581312/photo/1

    It appears according sources that the collision occurred in the vicinity of the Cooper River that runs past Moncks Corner and down to Charleston. Huge debris field- see the photo above...this could have been much worse.

    All you experts speculate away....the smoke is still rising from the crash site....
     
  31. jesse

    jesse Administrator Management Council Member

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    Well, for one, it'd be pretty simple for them to fly above the ultralights. And also be pretty simple for us to drop every single one of them. Be a fun job in an A10...of course we'd be stuck with the J35.
     
  32. steingar

    steingar Taxi to Parking

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    Yeah, blow up thousand dollar ultralights with million dollar missiles. The American Way all right.
     
  33. Geico266

    Geico266 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Retard? Really? It's about time you moved on, troll.
     
  34. frcabot

    frcabot Line Up and Wait

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    Naw, I'm good, son.
     
  35. frfly172

    frfly172 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Wonder if the 150 was on a flight plan,or out practicing maneuvers? Also wonder if the F16 was talking to anybody? May they rest in peace.
     
  36. DaveA

    DaveA Pre-takeoff checklist

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  37. timwinters

    timwinters Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Oh, I don't know, Jesse...

    He was just stating what we all know is inevitable...and what has already started...and what many of us loathe.

    He actually said a lot with very few words, far from useless, rather astutely succinct.

    Tim,
    Who understands the difference between valid opinion and blind useless speculation.
     
  38. frcabot

    frcabot Line Up and Wait

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    The collision apparently occurred near the GINNE intersection, outside the MOA and off of but close to IR18. What's puzzling is that IR MTRs are flown under ATC supervision/control. Planes on the route are supposed to squawk 4000 and are limited to 420 knots, but can fly under 10K feet. The MTR corridor is typically 10nm wide (5nm on each side), and the air base is supposed to NOTAM the use of the IR at least two hours prior.

    Edit: Just checked, no active NOTAMs for the MTR. So the IR should not have been in use.
     

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    Last edited: Jul 7, 2015
  39. murphey

    murphey Final Approach

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    Actually, the 150 is much more maneuverable, all things considered. It's going incredibly slow compared to the F16. Think about the turn radius in the two aircraft at appropriate "slow" speeds for each.
     
  40. Fearless Tower

    Fearless Tower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    No. They will get money. Might take some time in litigation, but if a shipyard worker can injure himself working on a government ship because he didn't use PPE and get money, then I am fairly confident that the family of the deceased will be paid here as well.