Dodged the crankshaft bullet

Ken Ibold

Ken Ibold

Final Approach
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Ken Ibold
My condolences to anyone nailed by the new Lyc crankshaft AD. There are a lot of airplanes on that list.

Once again the FAA seems to be giving a manufacturer the ability to mandate sales. I dodged this one. Hope my luck holds out.
 
Me, too. Let's hear a rousing cheer for older engines.
 
so lycoming is paying for this, right? as they should...
 
what a crock, their "mettalurgy flaws" cause a bunch of stuff to break and then they dont live up to the responsibility for it.

ill stick with no engines, thankyouverymuch
 
tonycondon said:
what a crock, their "mettalurgy flaws" cause a bunch of stuff to break and then they dont live up to the responsibility for it.

ill stick with no engines, thankyouverymuch
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I got hit with an AD earlier this year for mettalurgy flaws in my cylinders. To ease the pain the compnay did buy back unused time on the cylinders and paid par tof the labor to replace them.
 
This looks very similar to the crankshaft AD that we got hit by last year. (Or is this the same one). IO-360-A1B6 in the RV. Luckily, AeroSport in Canada paid for all shipping and shop time while Lycoming paid for the rest. So basically it didn't cost us a dime other than our personal time it took to remove and crate the engine and the following re-install. Gotta love Experimentals! :D Got the engine off in January I believe had it back in the hangar within 4-5 weeks if I remember correctly.

-Chris
 
Ken Ibold said:
NO. They are giving a price break on the parts for a while, but the labor is up to the owner.
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What I read said the cost of the required replacement crank is $16,000 and if you order one within the next year (three years?) the price drops to $2000. If you have your engine overhauled at Lycoming there is no charge for the crank upgrade. So not only do they stick owners with a bunch of costs that should be the company's, they built in an incentive to have more overhauls done at the factory. Seems like there oughta be a law...
 
CJones said:
This looks very similar to the crankshaft AD that we got hit by last year. (Or is this the same one). IO-360-A1B6 in the RV. Luckily, AeroSport in Canada paid for all shipping and shop time while Lycoming paid for the rest. So basically it didn't cost us a dime other than our personal time it took to remove and crate the engine and the following re-install. Gotta love Experimentals! :D Got the engine off in January I believe had it back in the hangar within 4-5 weeks if I remember correctly.

-Chris
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It is very similar except for the cost part. Lycoming expanded the AD coverage to a bunch more engines but won't be paying anything towards the replacement unless you have them overhaul your engine (at regular prices). In addition they slipped in a requirement that the crank be replaced within 12 years regardless of the engine hours at that point.
 
I am not big on lawsuits but as I have posted in the past I am amazed no one has latched onto this, bigtime.
 
Whew! Does not apply due to engine serial number and crankshaft serial number.

The Extra lives to fly another day.
 
The Trinidad got hit with this last year.....lucky for us as Lycoming was still paying the full bill.
 
I haven't seen a list a serial numbers, but it looks like I didn't dodge it.

The real #$%^&* is that they will issue another AD for any engine that got a part during a RECENT overhaul, like the last crankshaft fiasco which grounded planes for months because they didn't even have replacements, so we could be open to a whole new adventure.

Anybody wanna buy a 235?

What if I buy the crankshaft and store it until the 12 year requirement?
 
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Looks like I'm cool. Whew. Missed two in a row.
 
The SB this AD covers came out in April 2006. It should have been no surprise to anyone. Big red letters on the front stating MANDATORY (which is debatable for SB's). FAA just made it legally required.

The Romanians picked a good model number. Does not appear in the SB or AD.
 
mikea said:
I haven't seen a list a serial numbers, but it looks like I didn't dodge it.

The real #$%^&* is that they will issue another AD for any engine that got a part during a RECENT overhaul, like the last crankshaft fiasco which grounded planes for months because they didn't even have replacements, so we could be open to a whole new adventure.

Anybody wanna buy a 235?

What if I buy the crankshaft and store it until the 12 year requirement?
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OOOPS! I did dodge this. I called my A&P and he said he hadn't heard anything that would hit me. This must be a continuation of the one I was remembering above. I read closely. It is. For those crankshafts installed after March 1997. Wow. That does mean in the last 9 years. urk.

So if you were a good, diligent operator who got a OH recently, this is for you. Please hold the applause. :mad:
 
mikea said:
What if I buy the crankshaft and store it until the 12 year requirement?
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If Lyc operates the same way Hartzell does, you'll need to return the old one to get the discount price.
 
Whereas metallurgy is a factor in the history of this recurring problem this morning's newspaper brings notice of the death of a kind man whose family will forever be linked to the quality of the metals which surround us.

Dud and Louise's home is just a couple miles below where I was raised. When I was a youngster a common summer sight was the little red Triumph sports car, Connecticut-plated LJR zipping up and down the road: Louise James Rockwell(sister of Betsy James Wyeth). RIP, Dud; I'll see you off, tomorrow, though going "back home" is supposed to be a joyous occasion.

http://www.legacy.com/mainetoday-pressherald/Obituaries.asp?Page=Lifestory&PersonId=19459745
 
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lancefisher said:
What I read said the cost of the required replacement crank is $16,000 and if you order one within the next year (three years?) the price drops to $2000. If you have your engine overhauled at Lycoming there is no charge for the crank upgrade. So not only do they stick owners with a bunch of costs that should be the company's, they built in an incentive to have more overhauls done at the factory. Seems like there oughta be a law...
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Over the last two years, I've pretty much busted my left financial nut to get into a position to buy, and now that I'm there, I'm not so sure I can pull the trigger. Stuff like this above just seems like "gouge the rich pilot" stuff. Add the dark cloud of possible user fees and increased fuel prices, and I think I'll just sit tight for a while and see how things play out.

And AOPA wonders why we have a shortage of pilot wanna be's.
 
Bill Jennings said:
Over the last two years, I've pretty much busted my left financial nut to get into a position to buy, and now that I'm there, I'm not so sure I can pull the trigger. Stuff like this above just seems like "gouge the rich pilot" stuff. Add the dark cloud of possible user fees and increased fuel prices, and I think I'll just sit tight for a while and see how things play out.

And AOPA wonders why we have a shortage of pilot wanna be's.
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Yep. Welcome to the nightmare. One of these could be waiting for you at any time, much less waking up someday finding out once again you can't "Until Further Notice" fly due to some new security measure.

Besides 9/11, I woke up one morning to see on TV that Meigs was gone.

Crusty just told me that it's a buyer's market for planes now. There are others that agree with you.
 
Bill Jennings said:
Over the last two years, I've pretty much busted my left financial nut to get into a position to buy, and now that I'm there, I'm not so sure I can pull the trigger. Stuff like this above just seems like "gouge the rich pilot" stuff. Add the dark cloud of possible user fees and increased fuel prices, and I think I'll just sit tight for a while and see how things play out.

And AOPA wonders why we have a shortage of pilot wanna be's.
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Maybe the AOPA could talk some underwriter into providing "AD insurance" to spread the pain around. It's the crap shoot aspect that really sucks IMO.
 
Bill Jennings said:
Over the last two years, I've pretty much busted my left financial nut to get into a position to buy, and now that I'm there, I'm not so sure I can pull the trigger. Stuff like this above just seems like "gouge the rich pilot" stuff. Add the dark cloud of possible user fees and increased fuel prices, and I think I'll just sit tight for a while and see how things play out.
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Ahhh Bill, its only money. Just do it! :blueplane:
 
Could be worse. There are Beeches that became unairworthy overnight due the spars being condemned.
 
How do you guys now feel about a field over haul that doesn't replace a part that is servicable.
 
Bill Jennings said:
Over the last two years, I've pretty much busted my left financial nut to get into a position to buy, and now that I'm there, I'm not so sure I can pull the trigger. Stuff like this above just seems like "gouge the rich pilot" stuff. Add the dark cloud of possible user fees and increased fuel prices, and I think I'll just sit tight for a while and see how things play out.

And AOPA wonders why we have a shortage of pilot wanna be's.
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Don't buy anything that the manufacturer is still in business..

Go classic, 1940 or prior. fly the oooo and ahhhh factor, and maintain by the 43,13 repair procedures, and no new ADs because there is no manufacturer trying to CYA by ADs
 
NC19143 said:
How do you guys now feel about a field over haul that doesn't replace a part that is servicable.
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Amen, Tom.

Question.
If you had a FACTORY overhaul that later became victim to one of these AD's would the FACTORY stand behind the part and the labor?
 
NC19143 said:
Don't buy anything that the manufacturer is still in business..
Go classic, 1940 or prior. fly the oooo and ahhhh factor, and maintain by the 43,13 repair procedures, and no new ADs because there is no manufacturer trying to CYA by ADs
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Its a double edged sword, no manufacturer often means no replacement parts. 'Course, Tom can make any part he needs but not all owners are capable!
In general I like old stuff better too. We have lost our tech & qc skills with the recent changes in society.
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
Its a double edged sword, no manufacturer often means no replacement parts. 'Course, Tom can make any part he needs but not all owners are capable!
In general I like old stuff better too. We have lost our tech & qc skills with the recent changes in society.
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Any A&P has the skills to fabricate any part I do. If you can read and understand the 43,13 you can maintain clasic aircraft. Most classic aircraft are hand made anyway and will require a fit in place fabrication. That means you have a blue print but you must fit the part due to how many times the aircraft has been tweeked.

Finding old engine parts is a horse of a different color. OLd Warner radial parts are still out there but getting expensive P&W 985 are still being overhauled by the factory in Canada. as well as many other shops, the Lycoming radials parts are getting very scarce, but if you got the bucks you can still find them And the old Jacobs are still being supported by several shops. the old ranger engine is still easy to fine new or freshly overhauled engines and there are several gurus that are hording parts, and can build you a new one for 20K. The Franklin 165 horse is still well supported by several shops, but the 150 horse is a difficult engine to support, and the B9F - 215 horse is a night mare (republic Sea Bee)

Classic Aircraft that I believe could be flown and supported on reasonable budget are these.

Stinson 108-3, any of the PA teens, Fairchild 24 R or W, Globe swift, early 172s C powered, early C-210, C-170, And last but not least, the early Balancas (C-powered)
 
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Keith Lane said:
Amen, Tom.

Question.
If you had a FACTORY overhaul that later became victim to one of these AD's would the FACTORY stand behind the part and the labor?
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That's really up to their lawyers isn't it.
 
NC19143 said:
How do you guys now feel about a field over haul that doesn't replace a part that is servicable.
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Uhhh, that's pretty much how I operate. I used to build most of my racing engines out of other peoples take outs.
 
Ken Ibold said:
There ya go...

Lycoming sure is making it easier to shop for Cont-powered airplanes!!
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Aren't they both the same parent now?
 
NC19143 said:
Go classic, 1940 or prior. fly the oooo and ahhhh factor, and maintain by the 43,13 repair procedures, and no new ADs because there is no manufacturer trying to CYA by ADs
Click to expand...

Anything in that category that can be IFR capable, does 130kts, can carry 3 + bags, and is short/grass field friendly? One of my wish list airplanes would be an IFR capable 195, and I could afford to buy one, but don't know if I have the wallet to keep her flying. Excluding gas/oil, what would be a yearly estimate for keeping a 195 in the air?
 
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