DAa fatality on video

I've seen the last minute or two of that video in some Wings programs by the ASF or someone. Chilling is right.
 
gprellwitz said:
I've seen the last minute or two of that video in some Wings programs by the ASF or someone. Chilling is right.
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Same here; I've always wondered why he turned left, towards a ridge and higher terrain, than to the apparently lower terrain in the bowl, to the right?
 
TangoWhiskey said:
Same here; I've always wondered why he turned left, towards a ridge and higher terrain, than to the apparently lower terrain in the bowl, to the right?
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Yeah. Turning towards higher terrain didn't seem the smartest move, unless he thought there'd be ridge lift there. Even then, turn toward descending terrain unless you're certain!
 
TangoWhiskey said:
Same here; I've always wondered why he turned left, towards a ridge and higher terrain, than to the apparently lower terrain in the bowl, to the right?
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I know that area well. Right would have been his route toward Corona (Rolllins) Pass and BJC. Rapidly rising terrain and not paying attention.

Edit: I think he turned right first then spun left after he stalled. He turn right to get back on course and was surprised by the high terrain.
 
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TangoWhiskey said:
Same here; I've always wondered why he turned left, towards a ridge and higher terrain, than to the apparently lower terrain in the bowl, to the right?
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I think ya got that backwards, he did turn right and spun right the bowl was to the left or so it seemed.
 
why didn't he circle and climb? Why stay at the altitude he was at? If he couldn't climb, then that right there is the best indicator to turn around and wait for a cooler day. It's easy to see that the ridges all around him are higher than he was (covering up the ridges behind them as he approaches)... :(
 
TangoWhiskey said:
Same here; I've always wondered why he turned left, towards a ridge and higher terrain, than to the apparently lower terrain in the bowl, to the right?
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Typo. I meant to say "why he turned right, towards the ridge, rather than left towards lower terrain."
 
etsisk said:
why didn't he circle and climb? Why stay at the altitude he was at? If he couldn't climb, then that right there is the best indicator to turn around and wait for a cooler day. It's easy to see that the ridges all around him are higher than he was (covering up the ridges behind them as he approaches)... :(
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High DA plus low performance airplane = unable to climb.

The crash happened because he didn't wait for a cooler day, the ground was coming up and the airplane wasn't.

As far as "easy to see" -- the mountains that looked so "far away" can get real close real soon.
 
Greebo said:
Do we know - what was the mixture at the time of crash?
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Not that I'd ever heardand the NTSB report is very short. But the pilot wasn't new to high alititude so my guess would be he was leaning.

What I saw was the pilot, not paying much attention, sightseeing up the drainage. Then he turned south to get on course not realizing how close to the ridge he was. Pulled it up and stalled with no room to recover. Yes, he could have at anytime up until that last right turn circled to the left or gone back down drainage. That close to ground you can fly the plane or sigthsee, not both. I've circled in that same drainage to get enough altitude to get over the divide. Was withing sight of it yesterday.
 
AdamZ said:
Live Leak Video. The written narrative is self explainitory. But obviously DA is only one of many issues in mountain flying. I really look at DA as an issue in Take off and landing but it can obviously kill you in cruise as well. This is Chilling.
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I have a shortened version of this video on our aviation video page, http://www.alexisparkinn.com/aviation_videos.htm There are over 500 aviation videos there, available for free download and viewing.

Both the original version and the shorter version are in the "General Aviation" section, and are presented commercial-free in a more readily-saved video format. It's called "Cessna L-19 Mountain Crash".
 
AdamZ said:
I really look at DA as an issue in Take off and landing but it can obviously kill you in cruise as well.
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[nitpick]I think the evidence is that "cruise" continues to be the safest segment in flight. This crash was the sad result of low level maneuvering[/nitpick]

Sorry -- sometimes I can't help myself....
 
Ya know what Dan your correct. And I think that points out an important issue. For a guy like me that flies the poconos alleghenys etc I just don't think of it as low level manuvering but it is. Those hills in SW PA and NE PA are an issue for me upon landing and Take off because the planes I fly are capable of flying well above them even on hot humid days. But for the guy in the video due to the DA his cruise was infact low level manuvering and a guy like me may not think of it that way. Now I do. Once again evidence that the certificate is a license to learn!!!
 
Wow, sad. That is actually the first time I'd seen this video, but it is very commonly referenced out here as what not to do.

That is also the first time I've see what a stall/spin that close to the ground looks like.

I bet he found the beetles he was looking for, its just unfortunate he didn't live to report back to the state on it.
 
I'm trying to find out the real story but no everything rings true in the posted account. That IS NOT the way we survey beetles plus there was not a beetle outbreak in that area at the time of the crash. All the lodgepole pine is dead now.
 
AdamZ said:
Ya know what Dan your correct. And I think that points out an important issue. For a guy like me that flies the poconos alleghenys etc I just don't think of it as low level manuvering but it is. Those hills in SW PA and NE PA are an issue for me upon landing and Take off because the planes I fly are capable of flying well above them even on hot humid days. But for the guy in the video due to the DA his cruise was infact low level manuvering and a guy like me may not think of it that way. Now I do. Once again evidence that the certificate is a license to learn!!!
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No truer words...

I fly quite a bit in WV. There are some very interesting little airports there where rate of climb is exceeded by terrain (even a simple airport such as Elkins has some challenging terrain nearby).

But I won't even pretend to know anything about Rocky Mountain flying -- that's a whole 'nuther thing altogther.
 
dmccormack said:
No truer words...

I fly quite a bit in WV. There are some very interesting little airports there where rate of climb is exceeded by terrain (even a simple airport such as Elkins has some challenging terrain nearby).

But I won't even pretend to know anything about Rocky Mountain flying -- that's a whole 'nuther thing altogther.
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Dan, the biggest difference is that in your case the terrain likely looks too steep to climb over but at high DA it looks a lot more benign that it really is given the mediocre climb performance available up that high on a hot day.
 
gismo said:
Dan, the biggest difference is that in your case the terrain likely looks too steep to climb over but at high DA it looks a lot more benign that it really is given the mediocre climb performance available up that high on a hot day.
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I'm also familiar with the area and there's no way that Corona Pass looks benign from treetop level. It's pretty imposing from both sides and the top of the pass is well above treeline. I usually crossed at 13,500' or thereabouts.

I saw this video years ago (early 1990's?) in an accident investigation class and was amazed the tape survived for a number of years out in the elements.
 
ejensen said:
I'm trying to find out the real story but no everything rings true in the posted account. That IS NOT the way we survey beetles plus there was not a beetle outbreak in that area at the time of the crash. All the lodgepole pine is dead now.
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OK, I heard from my friend who was in the CAP at the time of the accident and is a long time Aviation Safety Counseler. I know the story sounded good but:

"lots of bad info.
As I recall he was doing pipeline patrol, I believe for Texaco..
He was going to Aurora Airpark as he had a fear of contol towers, the crash as I recall was found by a young man who was mad at his parents and wondered off into the woods.
He brought back something from the crash, don't remember if it was a wallet or skull or what.
There was no "moratorium" on showing the video.
I have two copies and used it a lot.
Their analysis of the flight and crash is way wrong.
Winds were southwesterly which meant that flying on the south side of the valley he was in downdraft, missing the lift on the northern side of the valley.
Even at that , had he turned left instead of right, he probably would have survived.
Also I don't recall anything about a post crash fire that damaged the camera or that film was strung in the trees.
Would have been a little hard for NTSB to have missed that.
FActual report does not mention fire either."
 
Regardless, he screwed the pooch.

I was at the 5 min mark when I though, "Jeez, this guy has 2 minutes left to live and he doesn't even know it."

Sad.
 
Probably never occurred to them that the engine could quit too which would have probably killed them as well.
 
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