Commercial insurance

[Fearless Tower]

I've noticed that most insurance policies prohibit commercial operations with the insured aircraft.....I've also heard that there are only a few companies who will offer such coverage (I believe Avemco will not).

Any idea how bad the cost is to get coverage compared to non-commercial?

I think I have a hole in my head....or my wallet. I'm toying with the idea of trying to sell rides from a biplane.

And before anybody asks....this has nothing to do with the question I posted about medical certificates and non-profit ops.

 

[flyingron]

When I switched from the limited commercial policy (rental/flight instruction) to a personal operations only the insurance dropped to a third of what it was before.

Note, by the way, that giving rides in a biplane has gotten a lot harder regulatorywise. There's no longer an exemption to the commercial operator requirements for local sightseeing flights.

 

[poadeleted20]

A friend of mine operates a one-man flight school. He owns the plane (Cherokee) and provides the instruction. He pays $2200 for insurance, and is limited one to instructor (himself only) and four students at a time. Personal use would run about $1000, and an instructional coverage policy without those restrictions was quoted at $12K.

 

[Fearless Tower]

Note, by the way, that giving rides in a biplane has gotten a lot harder regulatorywise. There's no longer an exemption to the commercial operator requirements for local sightseeing flights.

Do you have a reference for that, or is it just something you've heard?

 

[TMetzinger]

Do you have a reference for that, or is it just something you've heard?

I remember there was an NPRM on that, but I don't remember the outcome. I thought it was going to require sightseeing operators to fully comply with part 135, but the details are fuzzy, it was several (5?) years ago.

 

[Fearless Tower]

I remember there was an NPRM on that, but I don't remember the outcome. I thought it was going to require sightseeing operators to fully comply with part 135, but the details are fuzzy, it was several (5?) years ago.

Interesting....I did my Commerical a year ago and nothing was said about it changing from what we have all known in the past about sightseeing flights.

 

[TMetzinger]

Well the change wasn't to the commercial certificate, it was to the other regs, so it might not have been covered in commercial pilot training.

The last I remember for VFR commercial sightseeing in the vicinity (25 NM) of an airport:
You had to coordinate with the FSDO for supervision
Commercial Pilot
100 hour Inspection
Approved Drug Testing Program

And I think they were going to add the rest of the 135 requirements on (maintenance, manuals, inspection/oversight), but I don't remember if the operator was going to have to get an actual 135 certificate.

 

[taters]

I rent out a cherokee and a cessna 150 the first year I had them insured its was 10k..that is now 6k per year.

Just got a quote to run a bonanza single-pilot operator P135...5900/year.

 

[poadeleted20]

Do you have a reference for that, or is it just something you've heard?

Try 91.147.

 

[Fearless Tower]

Try 91.147.

Well, that effective date is indeed newer than my Comm ticket.

So, anyone know if the FAA will accept participation in the DoD urinalysis program as meeting the drug testing requirement?

 

[TMetzinger]

Well, that effective date is indeed newer than my Comm ticket.

So, anyone know if the FAA will accept participation in the DoD urinalysis program as meeting the drug testing requirement?

Don't know. Back when I first got my commercial ticket over a decade ago, the fact that I was in the DEA (with their random drug testing) meant nothing to the FAA. They want you in a pool with an approved testing company.

 

[Fearless Tower]

the fact that I was in the DEA (with their random drug testing) meant nothing to the FAA. They want you in a pool with an approved testing company.

That does not suprise me.....

 

[weilke]

So, anyone know if the FAA will accept participation in the DoD urinalysis program as meeting the drug testing requirement?

They dont.

Btw. you also have to prove that the shop that does the maintenance on your sightseeing plane only employs techs that are on a drug testing program. That one is not in the regs, they just pull that out of their you know what if they want to.

 

[denverpilot]

Don't know. Back when I first got my commercial ticket over a decade ago, the fact that I was in the DEA (with their random drug testing) meant nothing to the FAA. They want you in a pool with an approved testing company.

Government efficiency in action.