Combat NDB...A real man's approach

[Warlock]

I posted this on the Instrument board and soon figured out this was more of a general interest than IFR related to anything practice...

I made a comment on a thread about NDB's in the student section and came across this looking for a kneeboard and thought some would find it interesting. Although a dinosaur, not long ago its all I had as an Army Aviator flying Attack Aircraft. Yes we were IFR certified with a single NDB in the aircraft with PAR backup. (Never happen civilian side) For twenty years I took annual Instrument Check Rides with a single NDB. Everyone else had multiple instruments but we did not. (AH-1, AH-64A). We did have a Doppler Navigation system but unreliable and primary use was not navigation, but was there to help with firing solutions for the weapons systems through the fire control computer.

This is a Approach Plate circa 1997 for Eagle Base Bosnia, an old Yugo fighter base, just for us gun guys. The waypoints are from the Doppler which you could update crossing the NDB. Note the approach speed and emergency letdown minimums and instructions for AH-64's...Also the Air Force never could seem to keep that NDB running half the time when we might need it in the middle of the night. The PAR also was hit or miss. This area is in a bowl surrounded by mountains. We had no alternates within range unless you went inadvertent IMC within ten Minutes of take off. Most of us felt we had about a 50/50 chance if we ever needed to use it. Push the Head, Pull the Tail was about all we needed to know...of course that may be the reason why they had it that way.

 

[35 AoA]

So did you ever end up using this? Funny because 1997 doesn't seem that long ago to me, but it is astounding how much has changed technologically speaking. Then again, I have no idea what a newer AH-64 is working with these days....maybe more of the same. I know we have the "Hornet 1" approach at our disposal for emergencies where there is no PAR/GCA and no TACAN......similar idea, somewhat different mech. Radar designate a known point (like the end of the runway for example), and then fly a quasi precision approach off of that. Have never done it aside from a couple times going through initial Hornet training (more of a show and tell item on a VFR day off socal than anything else), but I know some who have in more austere diverts that are only rigged for USAF types with ILS. Thanks for sharing!

 

[Velocity173]

Were A models allowed to fly IMC? I was under the impression you all had a ch 5 limit in the -10 restricting IMC flight. I know the new block IIIs coming off the line are fully IFR equipped though.

 

[Warlock]

Only for a check ride for me and others broke out without an issue don't remember anyone doing a zero/zero hover down. Bosnia was horrible for fog and Mountains but always felt that FLIR PNVS would help us breakout unless we were at crossover. GPS is standard these days and long gone is the need to fat finger in coordinates at startup every time for a doppler. My new to me airplane, has Two GPS's and a couple of VOR/GLS and my Nexas7 with a GPS. I told my CFI checking me out again it all seems like cheating to me. No NDB in the new airplane...I might just put one in.

 

[Velocity173]

Here's an approach you won't see around anymore. Precision GPS in an aircraft with a VFR only GPS. Note the caution.

 

[Warlock]

Chapter 5.19 b. The Aircraft is qualified for flight into instrument meteorological conditions. Crazy I know...

Intentional flight into known or forecast moderate icing is prohibited....Light is okay.

We could and sometimes would, but it was the exception for sure in the 64...AH-1's were never IFR certified.

 

[Velocity173]

Chapter 5.19 b. The Aircraft is qualified for flight into instrument meteorological conditions. Crazy I know...

Intentional flight into known or forecast moderate icing is prohibited....Light is okay.

We could and sometimes would, but it was the exception for sure in the 64...AH-1's were never IFR certified.

Huh. We were always told it was restricted. Maybe it's a Long Bow thing?

 

[Warlock]

We also could fly single pilot and a crew chief in the front until about 1991 when a maitenance tech chopped the collar at 300 ft at Ft Rucker...Remember it was sold to Congress as an all weather 24 hr Attack Aircraft...It had to be IFR...