Comair Instructor: "Crew would have failed test"

[wsuffa]

A Comair pilot instructor said the pilots of Flight 5191 would have failed a flight test for violating rules the day the flight crashed, killing 49 people, according to court documents.

Comair Capt. Thomas Scharold testified in a deposition that the pilots violated briefing, taxi and "sterile cockpit" rules, which say pilots must maintain a distraction-free cockpit. Scharold is a line check pilot, a veteran pilot who trains other pilots.

http://news.enquirer.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070719/BIZ01/307190035/1076

 

[tonycondon]

well duh

 

[KennyFlys]

Recently, I acted as safety pilot while an instrument student flew left seat. I kept trying to get him to ask his wife to be quiet during approaches. This event should be a clear explanation why. For those who think an instrument flight in a small aircraft is not the same as an airliner, I would counter with... all that's different is the size and weight of the airplane. Everything else is still applicable.

 

[NC Pilot]

> pilots of Flight 5191 would have failed a flight test <

They did fail and took many lives with them.

 

[KennyFlys]

> pilots of Flight 5191 would have failed a flight test <

They did fail and took many lives with them.

You make an interesting point. Every flight we make is a test of our performance. It's just that 99.99% of them are not observed or evaluated by someone who can effect a change.

 

[flyersfan31]

Wow. That'll open the $$$$$ floodgates!

Still, if they blew it, they blew it. It's a tragedy no matter how you slice it.

 

[bbchien]

Recently, I acted as safety pilot while an instrument student flew left seat. I kept trying to get him to ask his wife to be quiet during approaches. This event should be a clear explanation why. For those who think an instrument flight in a small aircraft is not the same as an airliner, I would counter with... all that's different is the size and weight of the airplane. Everything else is still applicable.

Lemme get this straight. Instrument pilot with his WIFE in the back? He permitted this? You agreed to this?

Yowse. It the mission is training, the only other ones in the a/c other than flight crew required, are one other student in the midst of same training, to learn, or none at all (or a federal check airman, for some required processes).

There is a word for this. It is "NO". If this situation is tolerable with an instructor, the law of primacy will teach him to tolerate this all the time. My wife has tested this numerous times. I have done everything but put a sock in her mouth. I have been known to just pull her mic jack when I am handed off to C90.

Comair Capt. Thomas Scharold testified in a deposition that the pilots violated briefing, taxi and "sterile cockpit" rules, which say pilots must maintain a distraction-free cockpit. Scharold is a line check pilot, a veteran pilot who trains other pilots.

Could he really have said anything else?

 

[KennyFlys]

Lemme get this straight. Instrument pilot with his WIFE in the back? He permitted this? You agreed to this?

Yowse. It the mission is training, the only other ones in the a/c other than flight crew required, are one other student in the midst of same training, to learn, or none at all (or a federal check airman, for some required processes).

There is a word for this. It is "NO". If this situation is tolerable with an instructor, the law of primacy will teach him to tolerate this all the time. My wife has tested this numerous times. I have done everything but put a sock in her mouth. I have been known to just pull her mic jack when I am handed off to C90.

Sorry, let me clarify this. The primary goal was a XC from PDK to CPS as part of a dog rescue flight. We landed enroute at Smyrna. He wanted to fly by hand, under the hood. So, I sat right seat. Before we left CPS, he did talk to her but I don't think she was happy about it.

 

[Richard]

Dr Chien, with all respect to you, I humbly submit the question: if not on an instructional/currency flight with safety pilot, when? Think realistic distractions.

I have been known to pull the mic jacks if previous attempts are for naught. What is a pilot to do but exercise his PIC responsibilities at all times? And how is that best taught, if it is to be taught?

 

[Jeff Oslick]

Many of the instructors I've flown with do their best to create distractions. It is realistic, and it teaches you exactly why distractions are a bad thing. Because I've learned the consequences of being distracted in a controlled training environment, I don't permit them when I'm flying outside of training. I know exactly where the pilot-isolate switch is on the intercom, and I don't hestitate to use it.

Jeff

 

[poadeleted20]

I'm with Jeff. If an instructor wants to create realistic distractions during a training flight, that's part of the job description. OTOH, a non-instructor safety pilot is only providing a pair of eyes to look for traffic so they don't hit anyone, and should not be trying to teach anything or introducing any training scenarios. If talk from someone in the back is interfering with crew coordination up front on such a flight, the "crew isolate" switch is an important safety feature. Absent that switch, the PIC should be telling the folks in the back to "zip lips" unless they see something that affects safety of flight.

 

[KennyFlys]

I saw on Avweb where the courts denied Comair's suit against Bluegrass Airport. Good. That was bogus claim to start with the only purpose to reduce their liability.

While the tower may have had limited fault by not observing aircraft movement, in the end there's really nothing to point to anyone else but ultimately the PIC. I'm not saying that just to point fingers. It's a sad reality.

Truthfully, my heart goes out to the first officer, James Polehinke, having been the only survivor. He may have a lifetime of questions but may never find the answers. I pray God will bring him peace and understanding.