Class C - Expired pitot/static/transponder

skidoo

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skidoo
Flying VFR only, my pitot/static/transponder checks expired. Looking towards an IR, I would like to get these checks done. But, I find that the best place to take it is at a Class C airport, 2 hours away. What is the best way to legally get it in there to have it done?
 
Call up approach and tell them that you want to land at said class C airport. Land, and then get your pitot static check done.

(I do not believe you need a xponder check to fly in class C, just an operating mode C transponder.)
 
Call up approach and tell them that you want to land at said class C airport. Land, and then get your pitot static check done.

(I do not believe you need a xponder check to fly in class C, just an operating mode C transponder.)

I think you do; every two years. I doubt ATC would know though. I had mine fail (started reporting low) and ATC let me know and I got it fixed.
 
I believe that in theory, you are not supposed to use your transponder if the check has expired.

You can fly into class C - but you should call them an hour ahead to tell them you want to fly in with no transponder. By the time you get there, they will have forgotten and will give you a transponder code, but you can tell them that the transponder is inop. They may have you make a couple turns so they can identify you on the screen.

No big deal.

I flew under the 30 mile class B veil with no transponder to get it installed, then back out and into Class C to get it checked and turned on for the first time using the call first, then remind them process.

And I sound like Jethro Bodine on the radio...
 
I think you do; every two years. I doubt ATC would know though. I had mine fail (started reporting low) and ATC let me know and I got it fixed.

The altimeter and encoder must be checked every two years for IFR operations. The transponder must be checked every two years for operations wherever transponders are required. See FARs 91.411 and 91.413.
 
> you should call them an hour ahead to tell them you want to fly in with no
> transponder.

Insure that you get the name and/or operating initials of whoever at ATC approves
your arrival. Recently heard a controller chewing-out a pilot ... until the pilot said,
"Really? Your colleague, initials CC, approved my flight/arrival today." Crickets.
 
> you should call them an hour ahead to tell them you want to fly in with no
> transponder.

Insure that you get the name and/or operating initials of whoever at ATC approves
your arrival. Recently heard a controller chewing-out a pilot ... until the pilot said,
"Really? Your colleague, initials CC, approved my flight/arrival today." Crickets.

Calling ahead doesn't "approve your arrival", it just grants relief from the requirement to have a transponder. ATC still has to separate you from any IFR traffic and sequence you with other arrivals, if traffic at the time you show up doesn't permit that you'll be denied entry to Class C airspace.
 
I suppose that I should call Center too if I want to use flight following above 10K ft?
 
I suppose that I should call Center too if I want to use flight following above 10K ft?

Do you have to go above 10K? I see you are in Montana?
Center is not going to be very happy trying to track a primary target in mountainous terrain.
 
I suppose that I should call Center too if I want to use flight following above 10K ft?
A transponder is required above 10K whether you're talking to ATC or not. In addition, I doubt that you'll get ATC to provide flight following to a non-transponder aircraft.
 
Unless otherwise authorized or directed by ATC.
Yes, of course. JOOC in your experience does ATC generally authorize that for piston powered FLIBs in the flatlands or do they/you just tell the requester to stay below 10,000 MSL if the airplane is already down there.
 
Yes, of course. JOOC in your experience does ATC generally authorize that for piston powered FLIBs in the flatlands or do they/you just tell the requester to stay below 10,000 MSL if the airplane is already down there.

Never heard of such a request being made. With terrain elevations being what they are around these parts piston powered FLIBs generally have little interest in those altitudes.
 
Do you have to go above 10K? I see you are in Montana?
Center is not going to be very happy trying to track a primary target in mountainous terrain.


I have done the trip before using FF. Center can not see me unless I am above 10K. Even then, there is a blank section, maybe 50 miles, along my route. I like to stay above 10k for terrain. I suppose I could go IFR :D(i.e. following the roads) down lower.
 
At night, your Class C airport might be Class E, when the tower is closed. Check the Airport Facility Directory. If that's the case, fly in just before the tower opens, and no transponder is necessary.
 
At night, your Class C airport might be Class E, when the tower is closed. Check the Airport Facility Directory. If that's the case, fly in just before the tower opens, and no transponder is necessary.

It's no big deal to call first. If a hick like me can manage, anyone can.

When I came into the mode C veil, DTW couldn't pick me up on radar - dunno why - just because I was 30 miles away scud running at about 1000 AGL over the lake... No problem. I told them I would be following the shoreline and remaining clear of bravo. Finally, they called me and asked if I was the one diverting around a bit of weather east of Monroe. Yup, that's me. Then I told them I had Grosse Ile in sight - frequency change approved. That was all there was to it.
 
You can go above 10K MSL without a transponder and without ATC's involvement as long as you are not above 2500 AGL. See 91.215 for all the details of what you cannot do without a transponder.

As for the OP's fundamental issue, just call the TRACON on the phone before takeoff and get permission to arrive with your transponder off (since it isn't legal to turn to ON or ALT until you get it rechecked). As long as you're not arriving in the middle of a major airline "push" (and not many Class C's have that much air carrier traffic), you should have no problem getting that approval. Just don't fly through any Class B/Mode C veils, overfly any other B/C-space, or go above 2500 AGL above 10,000 MSL on your way there and you will be completely legal. And be prepared for "Cessna 123, turn thirty degrees left for radar identification" when you call them 20 miles out.
 
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You can go above 10K MSL without a transponder and without ATC's involvement as long as you are not above 2500 AGL. See 91.215 for all the details of what you cannot do without a transponder.
JOOC, how literal is that 2500 AGL limit. I've always taken AGL boundaries to be relative to the sector MSA (minus the 1000/2000 offset). Doesn't make sense that you'd be in violation of the hemispheric altitude rule by flying westbound at 9000 MSL while crossing a series of small ridges and valleys where the terrain altitude varied from 5000 to 7000 MSL and I'd think the same reasoning would apply to the 10,000 MSL transponder requirement. Then again the FAA has proven that common sense is not a requirement for rule interpretation.
 
Flying VFR only, my pitot/static/transponder checks expired. Looking towards an IR, I would like to get these checks done. But, I find that the best place to take it is at a Class C airport, 2 hours away. What is the best way to legally get it in there to have it done?
Contact tower before you enter the Class C airspace, and tell them you are landing to get the transponder repaired, should be no problem, they know there is a repair station on the field, and probably do this 5 times a week.
 
Never seen it legally tested.
How would YOU interpret it. Let's say you've got a transponderless airplane and you want to fly through an area of the northern Rockies with undulating terrain that varies between 8000 and 12,000 MSL crossing no stretch lower than 9500 for more than 5 miles. Would you feel legal flying at 13,000 MSL the whole way (day CAVU light winds etc. and you're using oxygen)?
 
Contact tower before you enter the Class C airspace, and tell them you are landing to get the transponder repaired, should be no problem, they know there is a repair station on the field, and probably do this 5 times a week.
That may work. It also may not. While the reg says you can make the request "at any time," the reg does not guarantee your request will be granted "at any time." Phone ahead in case there are restrictions unless you're willing to orbit outside until they're ready to take you.
 
How would YOU interpret it. Let's say you've got a transponderless airplane and you want to fly through an area of the northern Rockies with undulating terrain that varies between 8000 and 12,000 MSL crossing no stretch lower than 9500 for more than 5 miles. Would you feel legal flying at 13,000 MSL the whole way (day CAVU light winds etc. and you're using oxygen)?
Probably. ATC won't have any IFR traffic below 14,000 in that area (2000 above the highest obstruction, etc), so there won't be any conflicts with IFR traffic. I doubt anyone would notice. Might also check the L-charts to see what the MEA's are there, and stay below them if they're lower, although if I'm in brown space, I wouldn't worry at all.
 
That may work. It also may not. While the reg says you can make the request "at any time," the reg does not guarantee your request will be granted "at any time." Phone ahead in case there are restrictions unless you're willing to orbit outside until they're ready to take you.

With a repair station on field that is the only one in 2 hours flying time I doubt they turn you away, That repair station operator will be pitching a fit if they knew the ATC was turning away there livelihood.

I have done this many times at PAE, never had a problem.
 
With a repair station on field that is the only one in 2 hours flying time I doubt they turn you away, That repair station operator will be pitching a fit if they knew the ATC was turning away there livelihood.
Oh, humbug. ATC has their own issue, and if they're busy at that time, the repair stations concerns will not be ATC's concerns.

I have done this many times at PAE, never had a problem.
OK, folks, if you go to PAE, take Tom's advice. Anywhere else, please listen to mine.
 
OK, I figured that I can get there at under 10K msl. Going mostly direct, the highest peak is near 8K. Going by interstate and VOR routes, there is one highest peak at 7K MSL with most terrain under 6K. This would take about 15 minutes longer. I prefer to go above 10K, but I see that it should be no problem going direct at 9500 one way and 8500 the other, while ensuring some climb at that one peak.

Thanks! When it is time to go, I will call the tower before leaving..
 
When it is time to go, I will call the tower before leaving..
The people with whom you actually need to speak are in the TRACON downstairs, but the tower should be able to transfer the call or give you the correct number.
 
I would say to seek a ferry permit from the FAA and get your mechanic to authorize the flight. From what my mechanic advises, you ate then legal to make that flight. I am doing this very thing to get my plane to the avionics shop for the pitot static.
 
I would say to seek a ferry permit from the FAA and get your mechanic to authorize the flight. From what my mechanic advises, you ate then legal to make that flight. I am doing this very thing to get my plane to the avionics shop for the pitot static.
Since the aircraft is still airworthy for VFR flight, there is no need for a ferry permit or your mechanic's "authorization" for a VFR flight to the avionics shop unless there are other issues besides an expired altimeter/static system check.
 
Unless I knew the transponder was inaccurate, I would fly it to the avionics shop.:rolleyes: I'm sure I'd be in violation of several FARs, but that's honestly how I would do it. ;) I don't recommend my method, but I bet lots of other folks would do the same thing.:dunno:
 
Unless I knew the transponder was inaccurate, I would fly it to the avionics shop.:rolleyes: I'm sure I'd be in violation of several FARs, but that's honestly how I would do it. ;) I don't recommend my method, but I bet lots of other folks would do the same thing.:dunno:
Shhhhh!!! :nono:
 
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