Checkride approaching. Few questions

Meanee

Line Up and Wait
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Messages
521
Location
Brooklyn, NY
Display Name

Display name:
Meanee
So, I am sitting here, adding up all the numbers for the 8710.

I have a feeling that my checkride will be "unique". Reason being, my primary trainer is my CFI's Warrior II. My Solo aircraft is C152. And from the looks of it, my checkride aircraft would be C172. And I only have 1 hour in 172, back in 2009.

My plan is to do a checkride on a weekend of March 24. Reason being, I want to get more familiar with C172, and I still have to do my required 3 landings in towered airport.

My problem is that the field I train at is 100 miles away from home, with significant tolls on the way ($30 both ways). So, in order to reduce travel, stress, and mistakes, I got a couple of questions.

My plan is to get a checkride on Sunday. I want to arrive to the airport on Saturday, review plane's documents, and do a "mock checkride" solo. Obviously without hood and unusual attitudes part. Is it a good idea to do that a day before checkride? Or is it better to simply relax, and not read anything aviation-related?

Tomorrow, my CFI will check me out in a C172. I want him to put the airplane into a spin and have me get it out of one. Good idea or should I leave that to after the checkride?

Aircraft for the checkride. I was thinking that C172 would be a better choice. Aircraft is a bit heavier, a bit more powerful. In C152, I felt like a kite, being thrown all over the sky even in light turbulence. Also in C152, I tend to float too much over the runway. For some reason, never had an issue like this in CFI's warrior. Since I am more familiar with Warrior, is C172 a good call?

During oral, can I use Foreflight, or DPE's frown on that? Obviously, I will have current map and A/FD with me.

I was thinking of simply bringing the DUATS printout. Am I digging myself in a hole with DUATS printout?

My FAR/AIM edition is 2011. Would it be suitable, or should I get 2012 edition right away?

And other than Captain Levy's thread, any additional tips?
 
Here is what I send my students. Hope this helps.

Jason's Checkride Advice

While the outcome of a checkride determines whether or not you are issued a specific certification, it is better to think of the checkride as a tool in the training process during which you can demonstrate the skills, techniques, and abilities that you have learned throughout your training. After you successfully complete a checkride, you do not emerge as a changed person or an ace aviator simply because you passed. You begin the checkride possessing the knowledge, skills, and abilities to successfully fly an airplane otherwise your instructor wouldn’t have signed you off. The oral and flight tests are simply a way to prove that you can talk the talk and walk the walk. This is an important mindset that will relax you during the entire checkride process. You will come out learning many things from the checkride, both new techniques and procedures you could have flown or talked through better. The checkride is not just a way to prove yourself as a pilot but more importantly it is an important step in the learning experience.

Get plenty of rest the night before the checkride. While cramming the night before may work to successfully complete a written exam, the same technique won’t work for either the oral or flight portion of the checkride. Your preparation for the checkride should begin well before the night preceding the test and you should feel confident knowing that your instructor thoroughly reviewed important material with you before recommending you. Also make sure you stay hydrated and eat a proper meal before the checkride. Pilots are known to get cranky when they are thirsty or hungry (I know I am).


Preparation is key. I cannot stress this enough. The FAA Practical Test Standards (PTS) define in great detail the aeronautical knowledge and in flight maneuvers that will be asked of you during the checkride. Use this to your benefit by following the PTS as a study guide. You may not know the specific question that an examiner or inspector may ask you but the items listed in the PTS actually give you a leg up by defining what topics may be asked of you during the checkride. Designated Pilot Examiners and Aviation Safety Inspectors are limited to those items listed in the PTS for testing. If a specific topic is not mentioned in the PTS, you technically cannot be tested on it.


The PTS defines tolerances you must meet to successfully pass a checkride, however it is also important to note the FAA’s definition of Satisfactory and Unsatisfactory Performance. They are listed at the beginning of every PTS document. Also remember that just because you lost 125 feet in a steep turn which is beyond the PTS tolerance of 100 feet does not mean you automatically fail the checkride. The FAA defines unsatisfactory performance using four main statements two of which are, “
Consistently exceeding tolerances stated in the objectives” and “Failure to take prompt corrective action when tolerances are exceeded.” If you recognize the error and immediately correct it the examiner or inspector may find that you demonstrated the maneuver satisfactorily. There are other qualifications that define unsatisfactory performance so read up on those in the PTS.

The oral exam is an opportunity to make sure you are “in the know” and possess the knowledge to safely operate an airplane. Listen to the examiner’s question in its entirety before you answer and ask for clarification if you believe it is unclear. Do not answer a question simply based exactly on the answer you prepared for a similar question out of an oral exam guide. The examiner may have asked for something different. Treat the oral as an opportunity to impress the examiner before you even step foot in the airplane in a casual and non-threatening environment. Yes the examiner technically can fail you on the oral, but try your best to stay relaxed and answer questions in a straightforward and simple manner (don’t talk yourself into a corner). The more information you can discuss freely without reservation demonstrates your superior understanding. Remember that you are allowed to use reference materials to look up a specific answer if you forget but use this privilege sparingly. If you completely forget how many feet below the clouds you must be in Class G airspace at night between 1200’ AGL and below 10,000’ MSL simply tell the examiner you are not sure and would like to use the FAR/AIM to confirm your answer. Don’t pull this card to look up material you should clearly have memorized (aircraft limitations, speeds, aircraft airworthiness requirements, etc). Only use it for the more abstract questions you legitimately do not know the answer to but be able to locate where the answer can be found.

Triple check all of your paperwork including aircraft maintenance records, logbook entries, logbook endorsements, FAA Form 8710-1 or the IACRA equivalent. If you catch mistakes before the checkride there is no harm no foul as long as its fixed before the checkride. It becomes a lot more difficult and time consuming if you don’t discover a mistake until the beginning or the middle of the checkride. Double and triple check to make sure you are legal to take the checkride (aeronautical experience), have the appropriate sign offs, and that everything was submitted correctly. IACRA mistakes are hard to fix on the spot during the checkrdide, especially if your instructor is not readily available near a computer to sign you off again should you need to resubmit your application.

While the examiner or inspector is required to grade you as objectively as possible using FAA accepted practical test standards, the professionalism and proficiency you demonstrate can make your checkride experience much more enjoyable. First impressions do not technically influence an examiner’s decision to issue a temporary certificate or a letter of disapproval but you can certainly make the process a lot easier by dressing nicely, speaking articulately and confidently, and ensuring you are well prepared for the material that will be asked of you in the PTS. First impressions are key, especially in aviation. Make it your goal to impress the examiner in a humble and tasteful manner. If the examiner asks you to calculate a weight and balance prior to the checkride, have it completed and make a copy of the CG envelope from the POH so you can demonstrate you are within limits. When the examiner asks you about this during the oral, all you have to do is pull out the copy which you marked up to show you are legal. You won’t have to fumble around or calculate anything immediately after the question is asked.

Do not allow what you just completed to bother you whether you think it was satisfactory or unsatisfactory. Press forward and try your best on the next maneuver or question. If you complete a maneuver or answer a question that you believe may have been unsatisfactory, continue anyway unless the examiner stops you. Often the examiner, who has a great deal of experience, may have found your answer or performance to be satisfactory despite what you may think. If you let the last thing you did bother you or distract you, that may influence your performance on the next task asked of you so try your best to guard against these thoughts.

Remember you already possess the knowledge, skills, and abilities to meet the requirements of the certificate or rating you are being tested for if your instructor signed you off. You will not come out as a different person, just someone who now holds a piece of paper (eventually plastic in a few weeks) proving that you meet the legal requirements of a pilot certificate or rating. The checkride is just a small part of the process to becoming a pilot or advancing certifications. Your actual flight training is arguably the most significant portion of this process so use your previous experience to impress the examiner while meeting all of the PTS requirements.

Lastly, have fun! Checkrides may seem stressful but you will learn a lot from the process and it will become much easier the more flight tests you experience. Try your best to stay focused, excited, and professional throughout the entire process. Don’t “study” these techniques but rather use them as a guide to conduct yourself during the checkride. You’ll be surprised how much more comfortable you will feel while going through a rather formal regulatory process of obtaining a pilot certificate or rating. Enjoy the opportunity to prove you know your stuff and can fly an airplane.
 
So, I am sitting here, adding up all the numbers for the 8710.

I have a feeling that my checkride will be "unique". Reason being, my primary trainer is my CFI's Warrior II. My Solo aircraft is C152. And from the looks of it, my checkride aircraft would be C172. And I only have 1 hour in 172, back in 2009.

My plan is to do a checkride on a weekend of March 24. Reason being, I want to get more familiar with C172, and I still have to do my required 3 landings in towered airport.

My problem is that the field I train at is 100 miles away from home, with significant tolls on the way ($30 both ways). So, in order to reduce travel, stress, and mistakes, I got a couple of questions.

My plan is to get a checkride on Sunday. I want to arrive to the airport on Saturday, review plane's documents, and do a "mock checkride" solo. Obviously without hood and unusual attitudes part. Is it a good idea to do that a day before checkride? Or is it better to simply relax, and not read anything aviation-related?

Tomorrow, my CFI will check me out in a C172. I want him to put the airplane into a spin and have me get it out of one. Good idea or should I leave that to after the checkride?

Aircraft for the checkride. I was thinking that C172 would be a better choice. Aircraft is a bit heavier, a bit more powerful. In C152, I felt like a kite, being thrown all over the sky even in light turbulence. Also in C152, I tend to float too much over the runway. For some reason, never had an issue like this in CFI's warrior. Since I am more familiar with Warrior, is C172 a good call?

During oral, can I use Foreflight, or DPE's frown on that? Obviously, I will have current map and A/FD with me.

I was thinking of simply bringing the DUATS printout. Am I digging myself in a hole with DUATS printout?

My FAR/AIM edition is 2011. Would it be suitable, or should I get 2012 edition right away?

And other than Captain Levy's thread, any additional tips?

1. Alot of flight schools don't spin their planes since they may also use them for Instrument training (frequent spinning messes up the gyros. Not an issue if the airplane is G1000 equipped), but if your CFI doesn't object, I say go for it.

2. Foreflight is considered an acceptable source of charts, so I wouldn't worry about it. Just don't be suprised if the DE makes you turn off the GEO referencing for the nav portion.

3. Some DE's are ok with DUAT nav/log printouts (I used one for my instrument ride), but I'd just do it manually for a private pilot checkride.

4.Get the 2012. Not much has changed, but DPE's tend to prefer current publications.
 
Search back through the checkride prep threads for my comments on doing mock-exams and practicals. Very very helpful and gets you past the "dear-in-the-headlights" feeling when you do the actual exam.

Also look for my suggestion of making flash cards from the information in the PTS.
 
To ask the obvious... why can't you do the checkride in the Warrior?
 
CFI's bird, he does not rent it out.

So during training, did he not charge you for use of the airframe? Or just the cost of having his body and brain in the right seat?
 
Most likely he's not insured for it. You can get insurance that will cover you giving instruction in your own plane (even if you charge rental for the plane) but not to allow you to rent for other purposes.
 
So why didn't you do all the training in the 152? Trying to do the PP training in two different airplanes then do the practical test in a third seems unwise to me. If you can't get the Warrior for the ride, my suggestion is to skip the 172 and do the ride in the 152 in which you already have significant experience. Otherwise, I would at least want to do all the checkride test prep in the 172, not just a 1-hour checkout before the ride, and I'd want to do every maneuver in the PTS at least three times in that 172 before going for the checkride (maybe more if that maneuver is not comfortable).
 
So why didn't you do all the training in the 152? Trying to do the PP training in two different airplanes then do the practical test in a third seems unwise to me. If you can't get the Warrior for the ride, my suggestion is to skip the 172 and do the ride in the 152 in which you already have significant experience. Otherwise, I would at least want to do all the checkride test prep in the 172, not just a 1-hour checkout before the ride, and I'd want to do every maneuver in the PTS at least three times in that 172 before going for the checkride (maybe more if that maneuver is not comfortable).
I agree with Ron. While there are a lot of similarities between a 152 and a 172, there are enough differences (especially the flight characteristics) to significantly impact your apparent skill level and confidence until you've got a few hours of experience on takeoffs, landings, and maneuvers under your belt. If you must fly your checkride in the 172 I recommend you spend at least two to three hours getting familiar with the plane while performing all the PTS tasks with a CFI and I'd do that at least a couple days before the checkride so you've got a day to rest between the checkout and the checkride.

Heck, some students get stressed out if they just have to fly a different airplane of the same make/model for the checkride because the one they've been flying recently is unavailable.

You also mentioned that you've been getting dual in an Archer and flying a 152 for solo practice. I assume you must have had some dual in the 152 but if all of your recent dual was in the Archer I'd probably want to spend at least an hour with a CFI in the 152 going over the PTS tasks (i.e. a mock checkride) before the real checkride.
 
I agree with the others here. The check ride is hard enough without having to learn a new plane. I'll put it to you this way- the flight school I trained at and still rent from just bought a 152 to rent to the pilots who already have a private license like myself and the school is requiring us to take additional training and pass some written tests before being allowed to fly the 152 instead of the 172. Having never flown the 152 I think that speaks volumes for their view of the differences between the two planes.

If you have to go in the 172 I'd make sure I knew the systems on the plane and the v-speeds down cold. I know the DPE would be likely to ask about those either in your oral or during the flight- especially since you have so many different planes you've flown.

I give you credit for flying a bunch of planes already- I've only flown a 172 and am soon to learn the 152. Whatever happens with the planes, good luck on the ride!
 
Just got back. Checked out in 172, and flew few patterns. Sure's different, with fuel injected engines. Seems to float less too. In a 152, I found it was difficult to bleed some of the speed and I floated decent way on the runway. Today's practice was a somewhat challenging pattern. There's a hill, and I had to follow hill slope few hundred feed above it. And with winds all over the place (favoring one runway, and 2 minutes later, favoring another runway), I think I did ok. Next weekend, will head out to practice area, and run through PTS few times.

To address few questions here.

Why did I not do all of my training in a C152?
CFI's airport is MUCH closer to home. 20 minute drive vs. hour and a half to where C152 is based.

Why CFI won't rent the Warrior to me?
I am sure he has his own reasons. I do not currently have renter's insurance. He's not insure for having others fly it. I am sure there's more.

Suggestion to do PTS tasks in C172
Yes, that's kind of obvious. I do not plan just to show up in a brand new plane that I never touched and yell "Test me, oh great one!" to a DPE. I would like to put in 3-4 hours to prepare in it.

Dual in 152?
Yes, I have few dual hours in C152, and a dual cross country flight in it.

Suggestion to take a test in C152
From what I heard from numerous sources, DPE does not like C152's. He will ride in one, but won't be too happy. And honestly, I do not like it much either. Too light, in light to moderate turbulence it's all over the place. There was moderate turbulence today and I felt much better in C172. Also, FBO has 1 152 and 2 172's. And I get to play with autopilot in 172s!

Edit: CFI said that it would be my call on spinning the C172. He did suggest that we postpone it after we are done with private, and he will do the spin training on his Yak 52.
 
Last edited:
So why didn't you do all the training in the 152? Trying to do the PP training in two different airplanes then do the practical test in a third seems unwise to me. If you can't get the Warrior for the ride, my suggestion is to skip the 172 and do the ride in the 152 in which you already have significant experience. Otherwise, I would at least want to do all the checkride test prep in the 172, not just a 1-hour checkout before the ride, and I'd want to do every maneuver in the PTS at least three times in that 172 before going for the checkride (maybe more if that maneuver is not comfortable).


This same curiosity question occurred to me. The 150/152 is cheaper and a better trainer IMHO.
 
Just got back. Checked out in 172, and flew few patterns. Sure's different, with fuel injected engines. Seems to float less too. In a 152, I found it was difficult to bleed some of the speed and I floated decent way on the runway. Today's practice was a somewhat challenging pattern. There's a hill, and I had to follow hill slope few hundred feed above it. And with winds all over the place (favoring one runway, and 2 minutes later, favoring another runway), I think I did ok. Next weekend, will head out to practice area, and run through PTS few times.

To address few questions here.

Why did I not do all of my training in a C152?
CFI's airport is MUCH closer to home. 20 minute drive vs. hour and a half to where C152 is based.

Why CFI won't rent the Warrior to me?
I am sure he has his own reasons. I do not currently have renter's insurance. He's not insure for having others fly it. I am sure there's more.

Suggestion to do PTS tasks in C172
Yes, that's kind of obvious. I do not plan just to show up in a brand new plane that I never touched and yell "Test me, oh great one!" to a DPE. I would like to put in 3-4 hours to prepare in it.

Dual in 152?
Yes, I have few dual hours in C152, and a dual cross country flight in it.

Suggestion to take a test in C152
From what I heard from numerous sources, DPE does not like C152's. He will ride in one, but won't be too happy. And honestly, I do not like it much either. Too light, in light to moderate turbulence it's all over the place. There was moderate turbulence today and I felt much better in C172. Also, FBO has 1 152 and 2 172's. And I get to play with autopilot in 172s!

Edit: CFI said that it would be my call on spinning the C172. He did suggest that we postpone it after we are done with private, and he will do the spin training on his Yak 52.


It sounds like your DPE is large and won't fit very well into a 152. My DPE was VERY large and had a heck of a time getting in my C140 which is pretty much the same cabin as a 150/152, but I don't think he has a lot of choice.

I don't think anyone likes turbulence, but IMHO learning to fly in a light plane will get you past it sooner than ignoring it and only flying heavier planes. The first time I went back up for a flying lesson after 20 years it was a REALLLY rough day. In fact at one point in the flight I told myself that after I landed I was never getting in a small plane ever again. Of course, the addiction still didn't go away.

Now about 100 hours later with 6 hours in the 150 and about 95 or so hours in the Cessna 140 and I have built a tolerance to rough air that at one time I thought would have been impossible. If I had hid from the problem by flying a heavier airplane, I would never have accomplished this. Learning to fly and be more comfortable in Rough Air is a worthwhile endeavor.

As far as tips and encouragement, I would be willing to bet that the checkride will turn out to be easier than you think. Go work on your 360's and 720's and all your maneuvers along with slow flight. If you feel comfortable with all that and be ready for the oral, I bet you will have no problem.

Relax and enjoy it. You will learn alot.

Good luck!
 
It sounds like your DPE is large and won't fit very well into a 152. My DPE was VERY large and had a heck of a time getting in my C140 which is pretty much the same cabin as a 150/152, but I don't think he has a lot of choice.

I don't think anyone likes turbulence, but IMHO learning to fly in a light plane will get you past it sooner than ignoring it and only flying heavier planes. The first time I went back up for a flying lesson after 20 years it was a REALLLY rough day. In fact at one point in the flight I told myself that after I landed I was never getting in a small plane ever again. Of course, the addiction still didn't go away.

Now about 100 hours later with 6 hours in the 150 and about 95 or so hours in the Cessna 140 and I have built a tolerance to rough air that at one time I thought would have been impossible. If I had hid from the problem by flying a heavier airplane, I would never have accomplished this. Learning to fly and be more comfortable in Rough Air is a worthwhile endeavor.

As far as tips and encouragement, I would be willing to bet that the checkride will turn out to be easier than you think. Go work on your 360's and 720's and all your maneuvers along with slow flight. If you feel comfortable with all that and be ready for the oral, I bet you will have no problem.

Relax and enjoy it. You will learn alot.

Good luck!

I am not a light guy (230lbs, 6'), and I heard DPE is around 210. So just getting into C152 I would have to drain fuel.

My worry about C152 for the test is that I will bust tolerances more often than in a heavier plane. I've flown C152 for a bit over 10 hours solo, and I have a tolerance for rough/gusty air. I just don't feel like fighting wind gusts should be my primary concern during all of the PTS maneuvers during the checkride. And I also found C172 to be more enjoyable experience overall. They have 180hp engines, and with only me onboard, I swear that thing climbs like a Boeing.
 
When I set up my checkride, my DPE told me what route to plan and to plan for his weight at 200 pounds. I don't know if he was dillusional or a wishful thinker, but there is NO WAY he could have weighed as little as 200 pounds. I weigh 180 myself.

For a couple of good sized guys a 140/150/152 is doable, but for the two of you, a 172 would indeed work out better.

I really don't think being in a 150 vs a 172 would have much to do with flying within tolerances. That will be determined by practice.

I'm sure this is a sermon you've already heard, but just in case, when doing 360's and 720's don't try to fly the gauges. Just bank it into the turn and watch a rivet or something to keep that angle and position of the horizon in the same place then roll out on the same point when you come around.

When I did my 720 on my checkride, there was a column of smoke off in the distance. I turned toward the smoke, let it stabilize and banked it over to 45 degrees with the Attitude Indicator and stroked the trim tab back a little. I just held that position of the horizon until I lined up on the smoke column again and flipped it over the other way to 45 degrees according to the AI and then held the position and angle of the horizon again until I saw the smoke.

I glanced at the altimeter a few times in both directions, but that was the only time I didn't just watch for the angle and position of the horizon and watched for the smoke.

BTW, I was a bit nervous leading up to the whole thing, but I SHOCKED myself with surprise once we got in the plane and taxiid out. I was never nervous at all once I was in the plane with him. There is no reason to be. He just wants to see that you're safe to carry passengers and teach you some things along the way. I learned a TON from him and really enjoyed the experience.

Best of luck! You'll do great!
 
Last edited:
Just got back. Checked out in 172, and flew few patterns. Sure's different, with fuel injected engines. Seems to float less too. In a 152, I found it was difficult to bleed some of the speed and I floated decent way on the runway. Today's practice was a somewhat challenging pattern. There's a hill, and I had to follow hill slope few hundred feed above it. And with winds all over the place (favoring one runway, and 2 minutes later, favoring another runway), I think I did ok. Next weekend, will head out to practice area, and run through PTS few times.

To address few questions here.

Why did I not do all of my training in a C152?
CFI's airport is MUCH closer to home. 20 minute drive vs. hour and a half to where C152 is based.

Why CFI won't rent the Warrior to me?
I am sure he has his own reasons. I do not currently have renter's insurance. He's not insure for having others fly it. I am sure there's more.

Suggestion to do PTS tasks in C172
Yes, that's kind of obvious. I do not plan just to show up in a brand new plane that I never touched and yell "Test me, oh great one!" to a DPE. I would like to put in 3-4 hours to prepare in it.

Dual in 152?
Yes, I have few dual hours in C152, and a dual cross country flight in it.

Suggestion to take a test in C152
From what I heard from numerous sources, DPE does not like C152's. He will ride in one, but won't be too happy. And honestly, I do not like it much either. Too light, in light to moderate turbulence it's all over the place. There was moderate turbulence today and I felt much better in C172. Also, FBO has 1 152 and 2 172's. And I get to play with autopilot in 172s!

Edit: CFI said that it would be my call on spinning the C172. He did suggest that we postpone it after we are done with private, and he will do the spin training on his Yak 52.
Definately wait then.
 
I am not a light guy (230lbs, 6'), and I heard DPE is around 210. So just getting into C152 I would have to drain fuel.
Dang near all of it. That makes the question moot. Just make sure you get enough practice in the 172 that you are comfortable with it for the ride, and you get enough study on it's systems to pass the oral portion.

I'll save my feelings on a CFI who trains someone in his own plane and only then tells the trainee the plane won't be available for the practical test for another time.
 
Dang near all of it. That makes the question moot. Just make sure you get enough practice in the 172 that you are comfortable with it for the ride, and you get enough study on it's systems to pass the oral portion.

I'll save my feelings on a CFI who trains someone in his own plane and only then tells the trainee the plane won't be available for the practical test for another time.

He told me that right off the bat. At no point I was unclear which machine I will take for the checkride.

It may sound like a poor practice on CFI's side, but honestly, after the nightmare of the last CFI, I am glad I am with my current. He loves flying, and not waiting for an airline job. Has his own "day" business, so I won't be left high and dry because he accepted right seat on some airline.

There are other good qualifying qualities with him. He spends every Sat/Sun in airport, restoring his Yak, flying around, etc. And I am always welcome to hang out there. So I think that me not being able to take a checkride in his warrior is a minor thing.
 
Back
Top