CFI oral and checkride tale

TMetzinger

Final Approach
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Display name:
Tim
First - I passed. I'm a CFI now.

I had my Oral exam last week at the Washington FSDO. The inspector (who shall be namless here) had previously given me the assignment to teach the power-off stall.

I arrived at 9 AM and waited for a bit, then he came in. He said he had to take care of some other airline things (he's also a 121 POI) but gave me a checklist of the things we’d cover during the oral and the flight. So I used the time to mark up that list with the actual tasks.

When he came back in, we went through the 8710 paperwork and logbook review, he noted that I was already an AGI/IGI and so didn’t need an FOI written exam.
He gave me his background – he’s a CAP check pilot and somewhat active CFI too – with 2500 hours of instruction given. I’m his third CFI candidate since he was “reactivated” as a GA inspector in addition to his other duties So far all his candidates have passed.

We started talking about the airplane systems – and covered the landing gear system, the fuel system, and the constant speed prop in some detail. Key questions were:
The rods that connect the gear doors to the landing gear legs – are they straight or bent? They’re bent, and they’re supposed to be so that they stay out of the way. Apparently some folks have thought that they were "damaged".
The big hump/round thing in the engine compartment – what is that? The shroud that warms the air for the cabin/defrost.
Can you tell if the airplane has the automatic gear extension system by looking at the outside? Yes – look for the pitot tube growing out of the left side of the fuselage, but this airplane has the system disabled.
What powers and actuates the landing gear? Electrically powered, hydraulically actuated.
We discussed how the gear retract override would work if it was installed.
We discussed the way the electric pump maintains system pressure and how the light comes on when it’s running, and how to disable it with the circuit breaker.
We discussed the emergency gear extension sequence – and how it’s gravity-driven and spring assisted.
I drew out the constant speed prop system, and we discussed the difference between single and multi-engine constant speed props.
We covered what actually happens when we move the prop lever, and what we’re looking for on when we cycle it during the pre-takeoff checks.
We discussed fuel injection, the good (no carb ice) and the bad (more sensitive to fuel contamination, and hot starts) and the cold and hot start procedures.

Then we covered airworthiness – and I get the idea that this is a special interest for him because he told me how he likes to teach it. He breaks it down into sections:
“Unexpected” airworthiness issues – ADs, SBs, and service letters that tell an operator of something that isn’t quite the way it was predicted.
“Routine” airworthiness – Periodic inspections for airframe and engine and instruments for IFR and VFR operations (we reviewed the airplane logs at this point)
Damage and Repair – how to detect damage during preflight and how repairs are signed off by A&Ps. Special Flight Permits were covered here.
Mods and Alterations – The STC and Field Approval process.
Weighing the airplane – how 135 and 121 airplanes get weighed annually to “keep them honest”, but 91 airplanes are often heavier than their "computed" empty weight.
Documents and Placards – AROW and the fact that the limitations may be in the AFM, or in placards, or both.
MELs and Part 91 deactivation and placarding.

Then I got to deliver my prepared lesson on Power Off stalls. I started by telling him he was a commercial student, and then gave him the description of a stall and the objectives of the maneuver. Then I took him through the aerodynamics, using the CL/AOA diagram from the AFH, and emphasized that what mattered was the angle between the wing and the relative wind, NOT the angle between the wing and the horizon, and using a model showed him how to stall the airplane in a dive with the nose still pointing down. Then when I was happy he had the concept, I walked him through the elements and standards for the maneuver. We agreed we’d do it at the commercial level, with the gear down and full flaps, and would recover AS the stall occurs (commercial) rather than AFTER the stall occurs (private). He mentioned that in the wake of the Colgan accident the FAA thinking on stalls is to deemphasize the “minimum altitude loss” portion of the standard, and focus on reducing the angle of attack even if that means it goes below the horizon, and getting more energy as rapidly as possible. He expects that will filter down to the PTS too.
Overall the lesson took about 20 minutes.

Then we briefly covered the remaining items that would be flown the next day, with some discussion on steep turns (what to do if losing altitude) and unusual attitude recovery – I explained why the recovery sequence was specifically power, roll, pitch for a nose low attitude recovery to avoid undue loads on the airplane.

Then we covered airspace and I taught him the SFRA and the DC airspace. There was no FOI stuff, probably because of the AGI/IGI certificate and the fact that I've taught as a FAASTEAM rep for this FSDO for a while.

His parting remarks were that I did fine on the Oral, and based on that he had no concerns about the flying and that the focus was on teaching, and if I found a maneuver going south that I should turn it into a teaching moment and explain the error and how to correct for it. I think we spent maybe 2 1/2 hours total on work from the about three hours I was there.

Weather had us postpone the ride twice, and we finally caught a break today. With ceilings of 4000-ish AGL, the steep spiral we had originally planned was out, so we decided to do steep turns and chandelles for that section of the test. I think I got some points for taking the manuevers he'd specified and breaking them up into hi and low altitude before he arrived, so we could concentrate on doing the things that required a decent ceiling first as the weather was supposed to worsen.

We started out with a thorough preflight exam and a cold start of the airplane. Since we were in Manassas inside the SFRA, we went through the drill of getting our specific code and ATC frequency for our transition outbound. I talked about winter operations and the dangers of snowbanks on the way out, and we departed using a soft field technique. Once clear of the SFRA we did clearing turns, and then a chandelle up to gain altitude. Once up high we did unusual attitudes, then simulated a rough-running engine followed by a simulated failure that required a spiral down over an airport to an engine out landing. We then covered the after-landing checklist once clear of the runway, and taxied back. A short field takeoff followed, (no confusion on this one as we'd discussed the performance during the oral) with a turn around the pattern and a normal landing. Once more around to a short-field landing that turned into a go-around. Then we departed the area, stayed low, and did S-turns across a road, followed by 8's on pylons. Climbing backup to a "normal" altitude of 2500 feet, we did steep turns.

For all of these - I was flying and teaching, except the unusual attitudes where I taught through the recoveries.

At that point the ride was "complete" - he said further tasks would just be "torture for no real benefit - it's obvious you know how to fly and to teach". So we headed back to Manassas. Total flight time was 1.6 hours.

I'd heard my share of horror stories going into the tests, but my inspector managed to be very efficient and friendly and kept the stress low. As Ron noted - this ride is all about teaching. The chief CFI and I discussed things after the oral and came to the consensus that having an accomplished and active instructor for the inspector makes a difference - my guy was quite confident he knew what to look for in an applicant and because of that had no need to "surprise" me or spend hours on end to get the job done.

I also sent a fellow FAASTeam rep a copy of the temp certificate so that I get WINGS credit. A CFI checkride covers the Master, Advanced, and 5/6ths of a Basic phase so it will reset the flight review clock that way. Jeannie, if you're enrolled in WINGS at faasafety.gov, send my your email address and I'll grant you the appropriate credit.

Now I just have to wait for the certificate stuff to wind its way through the mail and add the new role in IACRA.
 
Good deal - thanks for the information. I'm thinking about going through this soon - I can only hope that I can get a reasonable inspector.
 
Whoo-hooo, good on you Tim. And, John the exminer and I went through the WINGS credit after he completed my temporary certificate, but thank you for your offer to help on that.

Also, I forgot to say in my write up before that part of what John had me teach him was WINGS program things.

So, we both have a new flight review date and we're both happy it's completed.

There is a lot to be said for examiners that have real experience and aren't just picky for picky sake.
 
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Thanks for the write-up, Tim. And congrats.

What's your next rating? :)
 
Thanks for the write-up, Tim. And congrats.

What's your next rating? :)

Probably the MEI - it can be done in a day or two.

As an IGI, I can already give instrument instruction in the classroom and in the simulator, so I'm going to keep doing that and get really sharp at it, and then that rating (CFII) should be a minimum of practice in the airplane before the ride.
 
As an IGI, I can already give instrument instruction in the classroom and in the simulator,
The Chief Counsel said otherwise last fall, overruling something Flight Standards had said years ago.
[G]round instructors are not authorized instructors for purposes of conducting flight training in flight simulators or flight training devices.
http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org.../interpretations/data/interps/2010/Gatlin.pdf

I guess if there were a practical test for GI-I's, this would be a question on the oral, but since there isn't...
 
Congrats, nice work!! It's a fun ride looking back on it, but certainly a challenge. Very rewarding in the end.

"Fun" is not the word I would have used. I still hope I never see my examiner again.

Congrats, Tim!
 
The Chief Counsel said otherwise last fall, overruling something Flight Standards had said years ago.

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org.../interpretations/data/interps/2010/Gatlin.pdf

I guess if there were a practical test for GI-I's, this would be a question on the oral, but since there isn't...

Damn - who asked THAT question? and what about the instruction I gave last spring?

And I love their "we didn't say it's permitted, therefore it's not" attitude, overriding years of precedent in federal rulemaking (if it's not prohibited, it's allowed). And this particular Counsel author seems to be the same one who made a bunch of other rulings that AOPA and others are trying to get overturned..
 
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Damn - who asked THAT question?

Mr. Stephen Gatlin
740 Centervale Drive​
Celebration, FL 34747

Feel free to send any barbs his way.

and what about the instruction I gave last spring?
Good question, and one which I would not want to have to ask.

And this particular Counsel author seems to be the same one who made a bunch of other rulings that AOPA and others are trying to get overturned..
No, the whole staff has been doing this.
 
Congrats, Tim! I gotta go flying with you soon! I wish you were a bit closer--I'd just do my comm with you!
 
Awesome job! What was the most difficult part of the rating for you?

Splitting the attention between the flying and the teaching, and making sure that the right words came out while demonstrating a manuever. When I got task-saturated the "teaching" would stop.

It was amusing for my instructor to watch when he pulled the power on downwind, turning a normal pattern and landing into a power off approach.
Example - our third flight together:
Tim: "So, as we make the turn to join the downwind from the 45, we perform the first set of our pre-landing checks. Speed is good, gear can go down"
<sound of gear going down>
Tim: "three greens!. Adjust the power as needed to compensate for the drag, and as we get abeam the numbers we can..."
<sound of engine going to idle>
Tim: <silent as he pitches for best glide, turns to the runway, gets aligned and adds drag necessary for landing>
<sound of touchdown>
Tim: "and as we maintain the centerline and slow to our taxi speed, we leave everything else alone until we get off the runway".

By the time I took the ride I was able to verbalize EVERYTHING while doing it. To make the CFI as painless as possible from the teaching while flying perspective I encourage folks to get familiar with flying from the right seat, and practice verbalizing your actions while you do them. You can do this while driving, biking, whatever - though you may get some odd looks if you do it walking down the street.

It's important to use the correct language - the FOI topic on communication is one of the few I think is still fairly up-to-date. When describing 8's on pylons for example, you need to be clear about the object on the ground being the pylon, the wingtip "picture" being the reference point, so you can say "if the pylon is moving back from the reference point, we're below pivotal altitude so we add back pressure and climb to the correct altitude for our groundspeed". Saying something wrong will plant the wrong concept in the student, and that can be hard to overwrite later (primacy, don't ya know).
 
You can do this while driving, biking, whatever - though you may get some odd looks if you do it walking down the street.

Funny you say that...I'm working on the CFI stuff now and I quite often find myself talking through the pattern while driving to/from work.

Definitely agree on flying as much as you can from the right seat - if you aren't comfortable there, it is going to hurt you in the checkride.
 
Way cool, Tim! Saw the email from the school. CONGRATULATIONS!!! :thumbsup:
 
FDefinitely agree on flying as much as you can from the right seat - if you aren't comfortable there, it is going to hurt you in the checkride.

Have run into some insurance policies that state that single-pilot operations as PIC must be done from the left seat... with wording for odd-ball aircraft that covers the lawyer's behinds if the aircraft is "normally" flown from the right.

Watch out that yours doesn't have such a clause, or don't have an accident where anyone can see which seat you were in, and you're not bleeding on the upholstery on the right side. :cryin:
 
It's important to use the correct language - .

Congrats Tim, Well Deserved.


- I remember this more than anything during my oral/checkride in 2006 (LAS FSDO).

The grumpy chain-smoking examiner about had a heart attack when I said "BFR"...that was about a 20 minute lecture(one of many) from the SI on why it was "Flight Review"
 
Tim, that's awesome. Congratulations on the new cert.
 
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