ATC Documentary -- "Near Miss"

HPNPilot1200

HPNPilot1200

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Jason
Here’s a cool ATC documentary titled “Near Miss” from late 1999 that I haven’t yet shared here. The 45-minute British film focuses on LGA, EWR, and JFK ATCTs, N90 (NY TRACON), and the Avianca 052 crash. A JFK Tower controller I know, Dave Schoen, is also featured.

Though it’s over 8 years old, most of the principles used then to work traffic still exist today. As far as I know, La Guardia, Newark, and Kennedy towers are still running with the same antiquated equipment shown in the movie with the exception of ground radar (ASDE) which has been enhanced to allow the display of aircraft callsign and type. N90 has been upgraded slightly, now using a full-color radar display (ACD) and communication touch-display, but those systems are 7 years old themselves and no plans to upgrade them have been publicly released yet. The buildings still look the same and N90 is still just as dark in the operations room to this day. (It takes a few minutes for your eyes to adjust to the reduced light, but I actually like it.)

I hope you enjoy watching the documentary and look forward to answering any questions.

Here's the link to download it: http://www.mediafire.com/?ayzo9thxhpd
 
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Thanks Jason, that was interesting. I seriously considered being a controller once in another life.
 
Still, more than a bit dismissive of GA; note the statement that in the PSA crash in San Diego, the Cessna "Hit" the 727? Tragic, it was, but the Cessna had been called-out to the PSA jet, they just thought they had it when they did not.
 
SCCutler said:
Still, more than a bit dismissive of GA;
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I noticed that too. When they were showing the various flight paths of airplanes arriving at and departing from the three major airports I couldn't help but wonder how the arrivals and departures from Teterboro and Westchester County, both busy airports, fit into that picture. I know in the case of TEB they keep everyone below the Newark traffic.
 
Everskyward said:
I noticed that too. When they were showing the various flight paths of airplanes arriving at and departing from the three major airports I couldn't help but wonder how the arrivals and departures from Teterboro and Westchester County, both busy airports, fit into that picture. I know in the case of TEB they keep everyone below the Newark traffic.
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It seems like they keep us high (6k or above) when we're going to LGA and low (5k or below) when we're going to HPN, and we're almost always either on vectors or some sort of published visual procedure by the time we get close enough to either place to matter. Out of LGA, you climb fast and hard, whereas out of HPN, they usually stop you pretty quick and hold you down low until you're well clear of the NY arrival/departure corridors.
 
Teller1900 said:
It seems like they keep us high (6k or above) when we're going to LGA and low (5k or below) when we're going to HPN, and we're almost always either on vectors or some sort of published visual procedure by the time we get close enough to either place to matter. Out of LGA, you climb fast and hard, whereas out of HPN, they usually stop you pretty quick and hold you down low until you're well clear of the NY arrival/departure corridors.
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The way the flows are set up, HPN arrivals and departures are flown underneath the LGA arrivals and departures as you mentioned.

If HPN is landing 34, NOBBI sector (126.4) will usually descend you to 2,000 or 3,000 ft. pretty quick for the Sound Visual 34 so LGA arrivals can overfly you on the RKA2 or the NOBBI5. Landing 16, it's not such a big deal because there is plenty of airspace to the north.

Regarding how fast they'll climb you out of HPN, it really depends what type aircraft, assigned departure exit fix, and what the traffic is like. If you're a Citation going to ELIOT, they're going to climb you fast to 17,000. If you're a Cessna 182 going to SAX, they're going to climb you slowly to merge smoothly with the LGA and EWR departures. Every situation is different, especially when traffic volume increases or slows down. YMMV.
 
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I did my private training out of Teterboro. I remember a friend of mine who flew a Falcon jet from there showed me the TCAS at rush hour to give me an idea of what I was getting into. It was sobering to say the lest. Then he said "Don't hit anything. Better yet, just don't hit me."

I hear there are talks of making KSWF a calss B to take some of the loads in the area.
 
well, you too - but I was talking about that comedian, ol' whatsisname. I missed your post! :)
 
George Carlin
 

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I FINALLY got some free time to watch the documentary today...there were a few parts that bothered me (it seems a little alarmist) but all in all, I'd say it's one of the best stories I've seen the "news" do about aviation in a while. Too bad it's a decade old.
 
Just remember, "Safety was never comprimised."
:)
ApacheBob
 
We are forbidden from wearing blue jeans.
Three out of 4 of the bathroom's urinals don't flush.
Last year, the manager literally stole our Christmas lights. We had gotten his approval to put up lights. A week before Christmas, they disappeared and were not returned.
Last week, we were informed that we are not allowed to laugh in the work area.:dunno:
ApacheBob
 
I also had a near miss in KFAR last year..offending pilot and controller violated. Pilot of Navajo cancelled IFR in IMC decending for another airport.
heres the letter I wrote to the FSDO summarizing the events...

July 27, 2007
To: Verl Addison
RE: Near Miss in Fargo, N.D 7/16/07 10:39 A.M
Aircraft: NXXXX PA-32R
PIC: ClaytonXXXXXXXX (CFI/II/MEI /COMM ASEL/AMEL)



On July 16, 2007 I Clayton X XXXXXX flew as PIC to Fargo N.D from Lincoln, NE on a Part 91 mission. At approximately 10:38 A.M. I was vectored from a location near the Fargo VOR onto a downwind for Runway 18 on a 030 heading by Fargo Appch and asked to descend at from 4000 feet to 3000feet.Immediately after the initial request was made by Fargo Appch I was issued a traffic alert for traffic at 12:00 position and less than a mile. I then keyed my mike button to inquire about the offending traffics altitude when the near miss occurred. As I keyed my mike a passenger seated in the “co-pilots” seat ducked and became frantic. I reacted by pulling the plane into a very steep climb when I then saw a white and blue Piper Navajo pass beneath me( left to right) by less than 100 feet. It is important to note that at 4000 feet there was a broken layer of clouds that I was in and out of. I would estimate the altitude of the Piper Navajo to be at 4000 feet since I pulled up to approximately 100 feet to miss him from 4000 feet. I then proceeded normally to Fargo where I then contacted the tower manager to report the near miss and inquire upon its details.

Clayton XXXXXX

Radar tape indeed confimed we were a "merged target" with less than 100 feet of altitude....scary
 
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