Aerobatics training for Student Pilot?

Erice

Erice

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Erice
I am a high school teacher (not a CFI). One of my students is post-solo, but still working toward her PPL, and plans to finish before summer is over. She has expressed interest in doing some aerobatic training at some point, and seems pretty intent on it. She is seriously considering aviation as a career.

My question is: Do you think she should wait until she is further along in her training before she does some aerobatic flight training? Or should she take a few aerobatic lessons now before she completes her PPL? Would it be too much to take in while she is still learning the basics, or would it enhance her training?

All of her time thus far is in a Cessna 150.
 
I don't think that aerobatic training would be out of line for a post-solo student. It should give a very good command of a plane's envelope. Admittedly, she won't be doing the checkride in the same plane, but she should be much more comfortable.
 
Not a problem for someone who has the stomach for it. Make sure she doesn't suffer from vertigo (ver-did-de-erth-gh). My second lesson in my book reads; 'aileron rolls to the right, loops, and slow flight.'
 
Not a CFI either. My thinking would be spin training would be good during her student days but if it were me, I wouldn't spend the money on other aerobatics until after I had my certificate (unless of course, her Mom and Dad have plenty of cash!).
 
The earlier the better IMO. WWII pilots learned basic aerobatics during primary training. They definitely didn't go through their flying careers uncomfortable with stalls and terrified of spins. :)
 
whifferdill said:
The earlier the better IMO. WWII pilots learned basic aerobatics during primary training. They definitely didn't go through their flying careers uncomfortable with stalls and terrified of spins. :)
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Couldn't-a said it better myself.

(but that's not saying much)
 
Aerobatic experience at any level will do wonders for your confidence in all of your flying. Also, it is a BLAST! I took my first aerobatic lesson just after my first solo, and have been hooked ever since. Also, you need not worry about feeling a little queasy after your first couple aerobatic lessons, as it is completely new to the body... many popular aerobatic pilots suffer from a little vertigo at the beginning of their training.

If your student has any questions about aerobatics feel free to PM me, I'd be glad to help.
 
I took some aerobatics when I was a student also and it was very beneficial I believe - beides the fun factor of course. It was in a Super Decathlon and I told myself at the end of those 4 flights that someday I was gonna get one and sure enough I did.

It will be good for her confidence - I recommend that she go for it if her parents allow it and she can fly with an experienced/competent aerobatic CFI.
 
There seems to be two types of people - those that get some acro training and decide it's not for them and just say "Been there, done that, checked it off." And then, there are normal functioning people that weren't dropped on their heads as a baby who get their first taste of acro and discover the strongest drug ever and it changes them forever.

The reason I say these are the normal people is that I believe that there is a longing for the freedom that we see that birds have that is written into our DNA and inseparable from our souls. Flying patterns and cross countries for $100 hamburgers tap in to a mere fraction of that longing. And worse yet, those that never expose themselves to upset/acro training will spend their time in the air with some real fear of the unknown like they're trespassing someplace they really shouldn't be. They may not admit it to their fellow pilots but it's there.

Go get the acro training and answer the question - which type of person are you?
 
PittsDriver said:
There seems to be two types of people - those that get some acro training and decide it's not for them and just say "Been there, done that, checked it off." And then, there are normal functioning people that weren't dropped on their heads as a baby who get their first taste of acro and discover the strongest drug ever and it changes them forever.

Go get the acro training and answer the question - which type of person are you?
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The real problem is that it's fairly difficult to find an acro plane to use after we get addicted. :cryin: Best I can do is a Citabria, and it's not nearby.
 
I think some acro would be good for a student pilot.

Where is the closest place in SE PA to do some acro training?
 
swingwing said:
I think some acro would be good for a student pilot.

Where is the closest place in SE PA to do some acro training?
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There are a few places to go that are nearby but you're so close to Annapolis, there's only one place I'd consider - Bill Finagin, Dent-Air. Bill is one of the rare gems in aerobatic upset and spin training and one of, if not the most respected instructor in the world today. He was inducted into the Aerobatic Hall of Fame a couple of years ago for his contributions to aerobatic safety and the sport of aerobatic competition. He trains in a nearly new Pitts S-2C and I've never met anyone that thought that they weren't changed in an overwhelmingly positive way by his instruction. So, I guess my point is if Bill is just a couple of hours away by car, why would you go anywhere else?

I'm based with Bill at Lee airport in Annapolis and have for years met pilots from literally all over the world that have sought Bill out for instruction. Just last year I met pilots from Japan, South Africa, and Australia to name a few places who came to Annapolis for training with Bill.
 
It should be mandatory - at least the EMT part of it. It will add such a complete understanding of the 3 dimensions of flying, and confidence to their abilities.
 
Erice said:
I am a high school teacher (not a CFI). One of my students is post-solo, but still working toward her PPL, and plans to finish before summer is over. She has expressed interest in doing some aerobatic training at some point, and seems pretty intent on it. She is seriously considering aviation as a career.

My question is: Do you think she should wait until she is further along in her training before she does some aerobatic flight training? Or should she take a few aerobatic lessons now before she completes her PPL? Would it be too much to take in while she is still learning the basics, or would it enhance her training?

All of her time thus far is in a Cessna 150.
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Heck no, aerobatics is good at any point in training, if high performance glider aerobatics are available in your area, that would serve her best.
 
The fact that we even have categories of aircraft that are non-aerobatic just shows that some folks are willing to give up the most important part of aviation... That it's a 3 dimensional experience around all axes.

(Says the guy who has plenty of spins in his logbook, but owns part of a non-Utility category airplane and is scared to go find the local Citabria or other aerobatic bird rental place for fear of what it would do to his bank accounts and possibly even all of the retirement savings... which would likely lead him to contracting AIDS*.)

I have a compelling need to get upside down again, but my wallet is more a right-side up kinda wallet. ;)

*Aviation Induced Divorce Syndrome :)
 
In my very brief experience with acro, I would say acro training, even just a basic intro, is of incalculable benefit to a pilot.

A hammerhead is pretty darn cool. Did some today. Yowza!
 
I think EVERY PPL ASEL should have recovered from a spin (DUAL, please!) prior to signoff. If that is considered aerobatics training, so be it.

I see no point to hammerheads, tail slides, Cuban 8s, Immelmans, Snaps, splits, etc for the PVT student.
 
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bbchien said:
I think EVERY PPL ASEL should have recovered from a spin (DUAL, please!) prior to signoff. If that is considered aerobatics training, so be it.

I see no point to hammerheads, tail slides, Cuban 8s, Immelmans, Snaps, splits, etc for the PVT student.
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I would agree with you to a point Bruce but I think there's also a huge eye-opener experience in doing aerobatic upset/recovery training and not just a few spins. The botched recovery from many upsets can end up in a spiral descent with the power full on before the pilot admits they are out of control. There's a huge value in that training beyond recovering from a spin that I knew we were about to do. The most important thing you learn in upset training is to quickly admit that you're out of control and invoke the recovery programming. It shortens the time your mind is frozen and gives you that programming to activate even when you still don't understand what just happened.

All that I just said is for any pilot. But for even the casual, infrequent aerobatic pilot then I think it's absolutely mandatory to get that upset training from all those maneuvers you mentioned - hammerspins, immelspins, etc. It's never a matter of "if" but "when."
 
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